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23rd Ave. / Gateway Blvd. / Calgary Tr. | Interchange | Completed

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  • #16
    Originally posted by ralph60
    The need for this interchange is obvious but the cost is horrendous. I think the city is going about these projects totally wrong. The transportation dept designs these projects, announces a budget and then tenders the project.
    From my dealing with the process that is a bit of an over-simplification. There are people on the forum that can give a detailed account as to the typical process so I shall hope they see this and leave it to them.
    LA today, Athens tomorrow. I miss E-town.

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    • #17
      Originally posted by ralph60
      Why doesn't the city advertise to engineering companies world wide with a request for proposals? We could have a design competition and pick from a number of ideas. The province did this with the S.E. Henday and the result is a cost effective freeway that will be totally complete by 2007. It will cost $493 million with 24 bridges 11km. of 4 and 6 lane freeway and with maintenance including the s.w. Henday for 30 years. Compare this to one interchange that is not even comparable in complexity to the Henday/Hwy 14 included in the provinces project and the answer is obvious. Also the $109 million is a guess as there is no contract in place.
      It would be an excellent idea, but unfortunately the unions at City Hall would never allow that to happen because it is basically subcontracting union jobs to private corporations. The provincial government can brush off the NDP opposing the SE Henday P3 concept for the same reasons, but that rarely happens under the pyramid.
      “You have to dream big. If we want to be a little city, we dream small. If we want to be a big city, we dream big, and this is a big idea.” - Mayor Stephen Mandel, 02/22/2012

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      • #18
        ^What union jobs are you talking about? Construction jobs or engineering jobs...The majority of interchanges are constructed by non-union firms.
        Alot of the engineering and consultation is done by places like Stantec as well.

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        • #19
          The more idealistic unions will oppose P3s on general principle because of the notion of private corporations funding a public service. And the opposition would be even stronger if the P3 includes a multi-year maintenance warranty - so instead of city crews plugging up the potholes, it will be done by the private firms.
          “You have to dream big. If we want to be a little city, we dream small. If we want to be a big city, we dream big, and this is a big idea.” - Mayor Stephen Mandel, 02/22/2012

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          • #20
            I wonder what will happen to it when it rains?

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            • #21
              Originally posted by RichardS
              Originally posted by IanO

              yes i recognize the complexity of this guy, but edmonton...do it....now...
              Again, a great example of Edmonton INaction instead of Edmonton in ACTION.
              Heh. The 200st overpass in Langley, BC. Interchange was already there, all that had to be done was to replace the old bridge over the transcanada with a new wider structure. They started before my friends moved out to the coast in early 2000, they just finished in Aug 2005.

              Edmonton isn't so bad... we usually do build something once we get the money for it. It's the getting the money that seems to be the problem.

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              • #22
                The project looks great now there is only one thing to happen, as many others have said.

                LET'S GET IT STARTED ALREADY!!!!

                The traffic is getting worse and worse. The other day I was trying to get out of the city at rush hour (ok not the brightest move) and traffic was tied up almost to 34th ave.
                LRT is our future, time to push forward.

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                • #23
                  Originally posted by ralph60
                  The need for this interchange is obvious but the cost is horrendous. I think the city is going about these projects totally wrong. The transportation dept designs these projects, announces a budget and then tenders the project. Why doesn't the city advertise to engineering companies world wide with a request for proposals?
                  Actually, you are quite wrong. In fact, the City of Edmonton Transportation and Streets Department rarely designs interchanges anymore. Most of these projects are contracted out.

                  ISL Engineering designed the 23rd Avenue interchange.

                  The City typically uses RFP's for many municipal projects.

                  FYI - they have been working on the interchange for the past year. Massive utility realignments and expansions have been ongoing underground...out of sight.

                  Also, the trailer park is being dismantled and removed as we speak along with the random trees and vegetation.

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                  • #24
                    I beg to differ, the 23 ave interchange is a concept designed by the City, they engaged ISL to do the detailed engineering work. I am curious as to whether the ISL work was tendered.
                    My idea is that the city should advertise for both the concept and the detailed engineering. They could have design competitions drawing on ideas from all over the world. Why not advertise for proposals simply outlining the objective, ie. "an interchange at 23 ave & Calgary Trail" They could outline the specific requirements such as traffic capacity and future expansion and let the engineering companies do the rest. We could then pick the best from a number of different concepts.
                    I have yet to hear of an RFP for a major roadway project.

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                    • #25
                      Originally posted by ralph60
                      I beg to differ, the 23 ave interchange is a concept designed by the City, they engaged ISL to do the detailed engineering work. I am curious as to whether the ISL work was tendered.
                      My idea is that the city should advertise for both the concept and the detailed engineering. They could have design competitions drawing on ideas from all over the world. Why not advertise for proposals simply outlining the objective, ie. "an interchange at 23 ave & Calgary Trail" They could outline the specific requirements such as traffic capacity and future expansion and let the engineering companies do the rest. We could then pick the best from a number of different concepts.
                      I have yet to hear of an RFP for a major roadway project.
                      What? And steal bread from the mouths of our union brethren at the City? Shame on you.

                      (p.s. I'm being playfully sarcastic)
                      [email protected][email protected]: the 5th Horseman of the Apocalypse

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                      • #26
                        That is true that there has been work on things that no one has really been able to see. I think the thing I was wondering is why couldn't they have other aspects of the project worked on at the same time, such as the trailer park and other areas that have to be cleared.
                        LRT is our future, time to push forward.

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                        • #27
                          Originally posted by ralph60
                          I beg to differ, the 23 ave interchange is a concept designed by the City, they engaged ISL to do the detailed engineering work. I am curious as to whether the ISL work was tendered.
                          My idea is that the city should advertise for both the concept and the detailed engineering. They could have design competitions drawing on ideas from all over the world. Why not advertise for proposals simply outlining the objective, ie. "an interchange at 23 ave & Calgary Trail" They could outline the specific requirements such as traffic capacity and future expansion and let the engineering companies do the rest. We could then pick the best from a number of different concepts.
                          I have yet to hear of an RFP for a major roadway project.
                          Trust me, Transportation and Streets Department rarely and as far as I know DO NOT design interchanges anymore. They contract this out. The consultant comes up with a few options, Transportation chooses what they feel is best and in line with the proposed budgets and away they go.

                          Design competitions are time consuming and usually not required for interchanges. I mean, it's just an interchange...whoopee!

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                          • #28
                            i noticed that the trailer park is all boarded up and ready to be nuked.


                            Ottawa-Edmonton-Vancouver-Edmonton

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                            • #29
                              'bout time

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                              • #30
                                No kidding. I know those were someone's home, but it was time for that park to move.
                                President and CEO - Airshow.

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