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  • Ward 2 Loss of employment nodes (other than retail) increasing need to commute

    ECCA is closing...fact, doesn't need any additional discussion

    What does need discussed is what is going to be done to replace the businesses Ward 2 residents worked at.

    As it stands there is little in a very large portion of the Ward other than retail level jobs. Which are not the greatest when it comes to making a wage in most cases.

    This means that the majority of Ward 2 has to commute to work. Trades and some other professions are going to have commute a fair ways in many cases.

    There is a problem with commuter roadways
    There is a problem with Transit
    There is no LRT

    What's the plan (if there is one or if a candidate has one) to put non retail employment nodes back in the Ward.

    Reduce the length or hopefully even the need to commute
    Reduce the pressure on transit
    Ease the time line on LRT

    In my highly biased personal opinion
    Last edited by Thomas Hinderks; 14-06-2013, 03:45 PM. Reason: format

  • #2
    I don't know what you're talking about given that 1/3 of Ward 2 consists of developed or developing industrial / business parks. The lands west of 142 Street, east of 156 Street, north of 111 Avenue and south of the Henday are industrial.
    http://www.edmonton.ca/city_governme...ap_Ward02_.pdf

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by ChrisD View Post
      I don't know what you're talking about given that 1/3 of Ward 2 consists of developed or developing industrial / business parks. The lands west of 142 Street, east of 156 Street, north of 111 Avenue and south of the Henday are industrial.
      http://www.edmonton.ca/city_governme...ap_Ward02_.pdf
      Yes they are but you should take a drive (I go through the area fairly frequently) and see what is in there.

      142 to 156 from 111ave and North to 125ave have been, for the most part, built out for years. Not much new.

      Same streets going up to 137 ave is generally business that needs space not not skilled workers (container yards, storage yards, etc.) with the exception of the engine rebuild plant and retail as well as some select others that have been there a long time (lumber manufacturer, the Brick company and the heavy steel fabricators).

      As has been discussed to death on various threads having home and work close together reduces the distance or even the need to commute, be it by transit, car or whatever. This of course has environmental benefits, quality of life benefits, cuts wear and tear on roads and lightens the need for transit, I think there is pretty wide acceptance of that.

      At the same time Ward 2 has lost the jobs tied to the CN intermodal yard that have gone west, ECCA related technical trades etc.

      The strip on the North side of 127 street is converting to residential, mostly town home style and the Trades and Technical jobs are moving.

      So what are the Ward 2 candidates going to do to promote trades, technical and related types of skilled employment moving to the area?

      I think the overall benefits are obvious as are the benefits of reducing commuting needs and it's a fair question.

      In my highly biased personal opinion

      Comment


      • #4
        Ward 2 is mostly industrial... if anything the ECCA lands will give this ward the residential density it's been lacking.
        "Men never do evil so completely and cheerfully as when they do it from religious conviction" - Blaise Pascal

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        • #5
          Originally posted by Chmilz View Post
          Ward 2 is mostly industrial... if anything the ECCA lands will give this ward the residential density it's been lacking.
          I'd disagree, especially sitting here looking at the Ward map.

          By the time the Griesbach lands are developed out plus whatever ends up with ECCA the Ward will predominantly residential and retail with some decent greenspace.

          Example:

          St. Albert Trail East to 97 street and soon up to the Henday is by and large residential with heavy retail particularly along 137 avenue and retail is rapidly filling the gap at 127 street up by the Henday.

          lots of housing, lots of places to spend money, not many to make money...other than retail.

          IN my highly biased personal opinion

          Comment


          • #6
            Thomas, you're wrong. There are hundreds of thousands of square feet of industrial/commercial/office space under development or planned for the Rampart Industrial and Mistatim areas. Most of the lands north of 137 Ave, east and west of St. Albert Trail have yet to develop and are designated for business/employment uses. There are many skilled people working or will be working in these areas from professional, trades, administrative staff to labourers and other support staff.
            Last edited by ChrisD; 15-06-2013, 11:06 PM.

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by ChrisD View Post
              Thomas, you're wrong. There are hundreds of thousands of square feet of industrial/commercial/office space under development or planned for the Rampart Industrial and Mistatim areas. Most of the lands north of 137 Ave, east and west of St. Albert Trail have yet to develop and are designated for business/employment uses. There are many skilled people working or will be working in these areas from professional, trades, administrative staff to labourers and other support staff.
              Well for the moment we will agree to disagree.

              I drive the area and I see no signage and have watched the papers for signs or notices of what was happening.

              So I would have to guess you have information not available to the public.

              But what I have stated is what can be seen by anyone willing to look.

              In my highly biased personal opinion

              Comment


              • #8
                BTW Chris

                What's the plan (if there is one or if a candidate has one) to put non retail employment nodes back in the Ward.
                Is still a very valid question regardless of who is correct.

                Candidates need to have a vision for what is needed in the Ward and how they plan on attracting it.

                In my highly biased personal opinion

                Comment


                • #9
                  I think the reality for many inner city areas that once had industry is that it's part of a life cycle. This has happened with the Warehouse District, and it's now happening in suburban Edmonton and Strathcona, as rail lines and yards are being relocated further out.

                  I agree that Ward 2 needs some kind of economic revival, but it is not entirely the fault of the city. The NAIT LRT line will open next year, and it could help commuters with better access to other parts of Edmonton. Transit commutes into downtown or university could be cut by about 15-20 minutes. Kim Krushell may not have been for everybody, but I think Ward 2 needed somebody to push forward.
                  "Talk minus action equals zero." - Joe Keithley, D. O. A.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    What loss of employment is occurring in ward 2 (outside of the very minute numbers at the airport, which will be replaced when the airport is redeveloped?)

                    As far as I can tell, Ward 2 has tons of growth in the industrial areas, especially in the western edge of ward 2 (02-06)
                    A people that elect corrupt politicians, imposters, thieves and traitors are not victims, but accomplices.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      The_Cat
                      but it is not entirely the fault of the city.
                      Whose fault it is is irrelevant in all practicality.

                      What are the candidate's or other plans is the question.

                      Medwards

                      As I stated above:
                      At the same time Ward 2 has lost the jobs tied to the CN intermodal yard that have gone west, ECCA related technical trades etc.

                      The strip on the North side of 127 street is converting to residential, mostly town home style and the Trades and Technical jobs are moving.
                      As well after a drive last night I see a couple of the large warehouse complexes between St. Albert Trail and 142 street have also gone vacant.

                      Living in the area I drive the area to access other points in the City fairly regularly and have watched the retail build up at an amazing pace...other, not so much.

                      And what jobs will replace those trades and tech jobs Medwards?
                      More retail?

                      All the talk on this forum about reducing the need to commute, living where you work etc. applies just as much to Ward 2 as downtown.

                      In my highly biased personal opinion
                      Last edited by Thomas Hinderks; 16-06-2013, 09:44 AM.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Thomas Hinderks View Post
                        Originally posted by ChrisD View Post
                        Thomas, you're wrong. There are hundreds of thousands of square feet of industrial/commercial/office space under development or planned for the Rampart Industrial and Mistatim areas. Most of the lands north of 137 Ave, east and west of St. Albert Trail have yet to develop and are designated for business/employment uses. There are many skilled people working or will be working in these areas from professional, trades, administrative staff to labourers and other support staff.
                        Well for the moment we will agree to disagree.

                        I drive the area and I see no signage and have watched the papers for signs or notices of what was happening.

                        So I would have to guess you have information not available to the public.

                        But what I have stated is what can be seen by anyone willing to look.

                        In my highly biased personal opinion
                        The statutory plans that identify the proposed land uses are below. These are bylaws that are public information. This illustrates all that lands that are planned for commercial and industrial uses.

                        http://www.edmonton.ca/city_governme...solidation.pdf
                        http://www.edmonton.ca/city_governme...solidation.pdf

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by ChrisD View Post
                          Originally posted by Thomas Hinderks View Post
                          Originally posted by ChrisD View Post
                          Thomas, you're wrong. There are hundreds of thousands of square feet of industrial/commercial/office space under development or planned for the Rampart Industrial and Mistatim areas. Most of the lands north of 137 Ave, east and west of St. Albert Trail have yet to develop and are designated for business/employment uses. There are many skilled people working or will be working in these areas from professional, trades, administrative staff to labourers and other support staff.
                          Well for the moment we will agree to disagree.

                          I drive the area and I see no signage and have watched the papers for signs or notices of what was happening.

                          So I would have to guess you have information not available to the public.

                          But what I have stated is what can be seen by anyone willing to look.

                          In my highly biased personal opinion
                          The statutory plans that identify the proposed land uses are below. These are bylaws that are public information. This illustrates all that lands that are planned for commercial and industrial uses.

                          http://www.edmonton.ca/city_governme...solidation.pdf
                          http://www.edmonton.ca/city_governme...solidation.pdf
                          Thanks for the links, I'm sure it will make for an interesting read.

                          That said "public information" and "what the public knows" from conventional sources (newspaper notices etc.) are (2) different things.

                          Most importantly it comes back to my original point "what are the candidates plans?"

                          That is part of what my vote will be based on.

                          In my highly biased personal opinion

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            If you look west of St Albert Trail, light industrial is sprawling at an incredible rate and every single plot of land has a "sold" or "coming soon" sign with more industrial sprawl on it. This is the single largest industrial expansion occurring in Edmonton right now.

                            Look no further than Albany for the latest retail/power center node. Skyview isn't even fully built/leased yet. Oxford has a bunch of new mixed-use retail/professional going up. Griesbach's mixed use commercial sector barely has roads in, let alone the hundreds of jobs that will be there. The new Remand center is in Ward 2.

                            While not directly in ward 2, Namao is a massive mixed use center as well that likely employs hundreds if not thousands of ward 2 residents. Same with the big commercial center at Northgate/Town.

                            Ward 2 has, in my opinion, the best new employment prospects in the city. As I stated before, what ward 2 lacks is residential density, not employment options. I'd argue a significant majority of the employers in the ward have employees that don't live in the ward commuting in due to a lack of residential density.
                            "Men never do evil so completely and cheerfully as when they do it from religious conviction" - Blaise Pascal

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Public knowledge is there for those who seek it. For those that don't and expect to be spoon fed, expect what ever you can get from tabloid headlines and newspaper that are looking to earn a dollar, rather than reporting the news properly...

                              Hate when people play the it wasn't in the news or newspaper so I haven't a clue...

                              That said "public information" and "what the public knows" from conventional sources (newspaper notices etc.) are (2) different things.
                              A people that elect corrupt politicians, imposters, thieves and traitors are not victims, but accomplices.

                              Comment

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