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The future of degree/diploma programs

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  • #16
    Originally posted by Cal76 View Post

    Given that the cost of rent/food/transit is often greater than tuition, universities may consider condensing 4-yr undergrad programs into 3 years. A 3-yr BA/BSc is pretty common in many Commonwealth countries (UK, India, Australia etc) so no reason why it won't work here.
    Also some scope for cutbacks in bloated faculty/admin if this was implemented. Is there any special reason why Canadian kids need 4 years to do what is easily achievable in 3?
    "The only really positive thing one could say about Vancouver is, it’s not the rest of Canada." Oink (britishexpats.com)

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    • #17
      Originally posted by mnugent View Post
      Originally posted by Chmilz View Post
      As it stands now, all these kids are going and getting arts degrees and crap that doesn't teach you to do anything, and they aren't getting jobs while loading up debt.
      [...]
      The value of an arts degree is really up to the individual. You're right that it's not going to give you a specific, pre-packaged set of technical skills like other degrees, but that's not the point. Writing, critical thinking, presentation skills and other things that it's geared towards are skills that stick with you for life.
      [...]
      I think the arts for critical thinking, presentation skills (!) etc. is a canard. Folks, an arts degree is for culture, tradition, and civilization. Please tell me you know what that is. No responsible student should forego a career to wallow in four years of University humanities programmes such as at the U of A. But to have a university education and not understand the first thing about the course of history, or western thought, or art and music - that's not a university education. It should combine civilization and career in a fruitful way, so that the student can go on to a full life in a complete sense. Man doesn't live by bread alone - a statement that unites in opposition our populist 'conservatives' and your garden variety marxist/cultural theorist university professor.
      Last edited by Sophia Karel; 12-12-2012, 03:19 PM.
      La verite se venge.

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      • #18
        Originally posted by mnugent View Post
        At the end of the day, the people that go the furthest are the ones that ask "why". A technical degree might make you a solid, obidient worker, but just that. It's going to get you that fancy entry-level position that you so value but you're going to have a harder time climbing the latter in the long run than someone with a broader university education.
        I have a marketing diploma from NAIT. Yet I have critical thinking skills and have not only surpassed my University-educated peers, but am destroying them. Education is only part of the equation. Some people are simply smarter, or better at certain types of thinking. You could be the smartest person on the planet but if you have no creativity you may never be more than a small town bar doorman (google it), but you could be decidedly average IQ with your brain wired the right way, be creative, know how to empathize, and go really far.

        An Arts degree can help you a bit more than a technical program, but it can't change your genes.

        I'd argue that most of the students taking an Arts program with no goal beyond that fall into the category of people who simply don't have critical thinking skills and wind up wondering why they took such a useless program in the first place.
        Last edited by Chmilz; 12-12-2012, 11:33 AM.
        "Men never do evil so completely and cheerfully as when they do it from religious conviction" - Blaise Pascal

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        • #19
          ^Yah, really the different programs are suited for different things, college and university alike. Universities just tend to have higher entrance requirements and hence have "better" students because of that, but not because they necessarily teach any better, just differently. Just like within university, some programs have higher entrance requirements and hence they are populated with even "better" students on average.

          I have a university degree in an honors program and I don't think they really taught people how to think critically. It's just the sort of people I was in class with were already critical thinkers.

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          • #20
            Originally posted by Chmilz View Post
            I have a marketing diploma from NAIT. Yet I have critical thinking skills and have not only surpassed my University-educated peers, but am destroying them. Education is only part of the equation. Some people are simply smarter, or better at certain types of thinking. You could be the smartest person on the planet but if you have no creativity you may never be more than a small town bar doorman (google it), but you could be decidedly average IQ with your brain wired the right way, be creative, know how to empathize, and go really far.

            An Arts degree can help you a bit more than a technical program, but it can't change your genes.

            I'd argue that most of the students taking an Arts program with no goal beyond that fall into the category of people who simply don't have critical thinking skills and wind up wondering why they took such a useless program in the first place.
            I'm sure it's not your intention, but that does read awfully like someone who's carrying a bit of a chip on his shoulder about the level of his education.
            Last edited by expat; 13-12-2012, 03:30 AM.
            "The only really positive thing one could say about Vancouver is, it’s not the rest of Canada." Oink (britishexpats.com)

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            • #21
              The man who wants to make university degrees obsolete - BBC Worklife
              Latin America faces huge skills gaps in the workforce, and college is expensive. One man is looking to shift the education model on its head.
              By José Luis Peñarredonda
              16th August 2019

              But Vega does not believe that universities can expand to cover the demand. Even if they did, he thinks the problem is the pipeline itself – he believes the university model is outdated. “Is it normal to have a social contract where people spend four years in college, get a huge debt, then get a job and spend their first year there learning everything they need to do? It makes no sense.”

              ...

              “One thing the online platform can offer over the formal education sector is the idea that people should “never stop learning”, as Platzi’s motto states. It creates loyal subscribers but more than that, it’s increasingly obvious that as technology develops how workers update their skills will be a factor in how well they thrive. It’s also how Vega built his business.”...


              https://www.bbc.com/worklife/article...grees-obsolete
              Last edited by KC; 18-08-2019, 05:32 AM.

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              • #22
                A new era of microcredentials and experiential learning

                “Thinking about microcredential offerings only as shorter online educational programmes would miss the broader, more significant trends that they exemplify.

                First, the growth of microcredentials is evidence of the emergence of more continuous and less episodic post-secondary learning. Second, microcredentials highlight an educational curriculum that is much more industry-aligned and competency-focused. Finally, they demonstrate that we are entering an era with much greater overlap and integration between education and experience.

                https://www.universityworldnews.com/...90213103113978


                ...

                Finland’s Education System Leads Globally
                By Lakshi De Vass Gunawardena




                ““In education, Finland has the lead according to many international comparisons,”...”


                “...
                “The Finnish education system is one of the top performing education systems in the world,” she declared

                Finland has been ranked as one of the happiest and most successful countries in the world, and most recently was ranked as the number one country for higher education by The Economist.

                In terms of what other countries, such as the United States should learn from Finland, Dr. Samuel E. Abrams, director of the National Center for the Study of Privatization in Education at Teachers College, Columbia University had this to say: “We should follow Finland in testing only small samples of students rather than testing all students”.

                “Our approach forces teachers to teach to the test. As we test all students in reading and math in grades 3-8, we generate undue stress for students, teachers, and parents alike”.

                Moreover, he pointed out, “in focusing on reading and math, we crowd out time for history, science, music, art, crafts, and physical education. And students need those subjects as well as plenty of play for a well-rounded education.”

                “Second, we should follow Finland in preparing teachers with high-quality master’s programs in pedagogical theory and practice.

                “Third, we should follow Finland in paying teachers well and giving them significant autonomy,” he added.

                “Finally, we should follow Finland in funding our schools fairly. That means more money per student at schools in disadvantaged neighborhoods, not less. We base funding on property taxes, which means wealthy districts have significantly more money to spend per pupil than poor districts”.

                “None of this is rocket science,” he said. “But that does not make it easy.”

                Dr. Abrams concluded: “We must...”



                http://www.ipsnews.net/2019/07/finla...eads-globally/
                Bolding is mine
                Last edited by KC; 18-08-2019, 05:46 AM.

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