Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Air Passenger Leakage 101 - Why Edmontonians should care!

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • #16
    When I book my vacations, I choose destinations I can get to non-stop with Edmonton departure. I dislike transfers, I dislike layovers, and moreso, I want to support our airport and see more flights added to in-demand locations.

    We really need more direct flights to Cuba. Toronto transfers are ********.
    "Men never do evil so completely and cheerfully as when they do it from religious conviction" - Blaise Pascal

    Comment


    • #17
      Try via Mexico City?!
      "Do you give people who already use transit a better service, or do you build it where they don't use it in the hopes they might start to use it?" Nenshi

      Comment


      • #18
        Originally posted by edmonton daily photo View Post
        Just post a series of billboards down the QEII starting at the EIA and heading south.. saying.

        - You could have had your boarding pass by now

        -You could have cleared security by now

        -you could have boarded by now.

        -you would have been in teh air by now

        -Beverage service would have started by now

        then you can end it with..

        You would have been in Las Vegas (or any destination that takes roughly 2 hours to get to) by now. Please fly EIA.
        How many people really do that? How often are flights from Calgary sufficiently cheaper to justify spending $50 on gas and $13/day more on parking?

        I'll drive if I'm going to Calgary, but I wouldn't drive to Calgary to fly somewhere else unless I was saving at least $100 over flying from YEG.

        Comment


        • #19
          Maybe if YEG could pull in more Oneworld members I wouldn't fly from Calgary as often. (AA, BA)

          Comment


          • #20
            Originally posted by TheGreatestX View Post
            Maybe if YEG could pull in more Oneworld members I wouldn't fly from Calgary as often. (AA, BA)
            Maybe if you didn't fly from Calgary as often, YEG could pull in more Oneworld members.

            get it?

            Comment


            • #21
              Originally posted by Titanium48 View Post
              How many people really do that? How often are flights from Calgary sufficiently cheaper to justify spending $50 on gas and $13/day more on parking?

              I'll drive if I'm going to Calgary, but I wouldn't drive to Calgary to fly somewhere else unless I was saving at least $100 over flying from YEG.
              last minute deals tend to be better from calgary. most people in edmonton have friends in calgary where they can park the car and take a cab instead.
              when you start talking $300 per person savings on the last minute flight, you can understand why people do it sometimes.

              Comment


              • #22
                Nice article Peter.

                While all your points are valid what about the following example:

                Say airline A puts in a new route to a city. In a week or two Airline B puts in the same route.

                Air Canada has a flight to Maui from Calgary - Westjet puts one in. Or AC has a crappy flight to LA from YEG - Westjet puts in a daily 737 - then AC upgrades to a mainline route.

                Is this the result of consumer demand or just one airline afraid to lost its market share -whatever share that may be - to the competition? How much does this factor affect routing?

                Comment


                • #23
                  I'd be interested in seeing the stats broken down into Domestic, Transborder and International, if it's available. It looks like many of the drives to Calgary are during the winter months, although the variation is not as great during the past two years.

                  It would also be interesting to see the nature of the destinations, if they are available. How many Edmonton passengers drive to Calgary to fly to Amsterdam or Frankfurt? I'm sure if it's 250-300 per week, that would justify another European destination (3X a week to start).

                  With the code sharing, I'm sure that YEG could lobby AA for a flight to Dallas.
                  "Talk minus action equals zero." - Joe Keithley, D. O. A.

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    So the customer is to blame if YEG does not offer the connections that customers want? Pretty weak IMO - if YEG wants to be world class it has to stop the small minded view that Edmontonians are to blame for its failings, and instead offer the connections its customers demand. I have no grudge with Calgary, Nisku, or any other place, and will continue to choose the best connection regardless of who offers it. I think most Edmontonians think the same way, it doesn't make us to blame for Calgary sometimes offering a better package.
                    Last edited by moahunter; 13-10-2009, 08:35 PM.

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      Good article but the numbers do not make sense. It is sad if there really that many people driving to Calgary

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        This is a great explanation of how and why air connections and service is the way it is in Edmonton, but I fear we are all not seeing the larger picture.

                        For Alberta to compete at a national and international level for tourists, jobs, quality of life, etc, we need to be looking at the Edmonton-Calgary corridor as "mega-region", and not a "us vs. them" mentality. The future will reward those that work together, and if we want to continue to diversify Alberta's economy and potential beyond a simple oil economy, this will be key. Certainly those world cities that are part of a larger mega-region with good mass transit connections and diverse economies are the places people choose to live, do work, and visit. (see "Outliers" by Malcolm Gladwell)

                        I am also afraid that these numbers will be an excuse for people to not support a high-speed train link between the two cities, for certainly train travel and reducing our reliance on air travel is going to be a huge step to cutting our overall greenhouse gas emissions.
                        Last edited by GreenSPACE; 13-10-2009, 08:58 PM.
                        www.decl.org

                        Comment


                        • #27
                          So you are telling people a "non-preferred routing" to Orlando would be on WestJet via Calgary?

                          Let me get this straight....

                          If every single person in Edmonton planning on going to Orlando flew via Houston instead of Calgary, how would that get us better flights?

                          WestJet would look at those numbers and say "hey there isn't a single person flying to Orlando from Edmonton, why should we give them a non-stop flight?"

                          OR if we flew via Calgary...

                          "Hey there's a sizeable amount of Edmontonians flying to Orlando via Calgary, that looks like it could be a sustainable non-stop route" a la Palm Springs, Phoenix, Las Vegas and Los Angeles - all of which were originally via YYC only.

                          Comment


                          • #28
                            Originally posted by TheGreatestX View Post
                            So you are telling people a "non-preferred routing" to Orlando would be on WestJet via Calgary?

                            Let me get this straight....

                            If every single person in Edmonton planning on going to Orlando flew via Houston instead of Calgary, how would that get us better flights?

                            WestJet would look at those numbers and say "hey there isn't a single person flying to Orlando from Edmonton, why should we give them a non-stop flight?"

                            OR if we flew via Calgary...

                            "Hey there's a sizeable amount of Edmontonians flying to Orlando via Calgary, that looks like it could be a sustainable non-stop route" a la Palm Springs, Phoenix, Las Vegas and Los Angeles - all of which were originally via YYC only.
                            You are not being a team player with that sort of outlandish statement, you are forgetting the mantra in all things Edmonton "to not cooperate with Calgary and do anything we can that is good for us not for Calgary"

                            This is of interest too:

                            Originally posted by kcantor View Post
                            thanks for your answer to my question on monday and the time and effort that is obviously going in to answering everyone's questions. several of the questions and answers to date however have mentioned 750,000 people driving to yyc every year. is that a typo being carried forward in error or is my math and conclusions out? 750,000 is more than 2,000 passengers per day and even at 2 passengers per car as far as i can determine that would account for more than 5% of all passenger car traffic between edmonton and calgary. furthermore, if 1,000 cars per day are assumed to be driving to calgary and one were to assume that the average trip being taken would be five days in length (probably low as there can't be that many one or two day trips that would justify the drive down), then at any one time there would be 5,000 cars from edmonton parked at yyc. i don't know how many park 'n fly or park and jet stalls they have but yyc itself doesn't have 5,000 parking stalls in total including both its discount parking weekly lots and its parkade. is the real number perhaps closer to 75,000 than 750,000 (which would seem to make more sense)? personally, i would never drive to yyc instead of using yeg and will actually take more time or adjust my travel dates to do that or to connect anywhere but through yyc if at all possible. although i'm sure some don't care that much one way or the other, i can't see how driving to calgary could be that much more advantageous for that many...

                            Comment


                            • #29
                              Originally posted by moahunter View Post
                              So the customer is to blame if YEG does not offer the connections that customers want? Pretty weak IMO - if YEG wants to be world class it has to stop the small minded view that Edmontonians are to blame for its failings, and instead offer the connections its customers demand. I have no grudge with Calgary, Nisku, or any other place, and will continue to choose the best connection regardless of who offers it. I think most Edmontonians think the same way, it doesn't make us to blame for Calgary sometimes offering a better package.
                              YEG doesn't just create connections out of thin air. All they can do is market our airport and its numbers into a business case for the airlines. They can't do that if Edmontonians keep bypassing their own airport in favour of another one.

                              It's like you didn't even read the column.
                              Strathcona City Separatist

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                Originally posted by GreenSPACE View Post
                                This is a great explanation of how and why air connections and service is the way it is in Edmonton, but I fear we are all not seeing the larger picture.

                                For Alberta to compete at a national and international level for tourists, jobs, quality of life, etc, we need to be looking at the Edmonton-Calgary corridor as "mega-region", and not a "us vs. them" mentality. The future will reward those that work together, and if we want to continue to diversify Alberta's economy and potential beyond a simple oil economy, this will be key. Certainly those world cities that are part of a larger mega-region with good mass transit connections and diverse economies are the places people choose to live, do work, and visit. (see "Outliers" by Malcolm Gladwell)

                                I am also afraid that these numbers will be an excuse for people to not support a high-speed train link between the two cities, for certainly train travel and reducing our reliance on air travel is going to be a huge step to cutting our overall greenhouse gas emissions.
                                I'd love to know how you would propose to get all of the civic and business leaders of both Edmonton and Calgary to suddenly stop competing with each other and work together. And I'd love to know how you would market that sudden togetherness to the airlines to get them somehow benefit us both equally. And I'd love to know how both cities would be able to share equally in this new economy without one taking advantage of the other.

                                Sorry, but we are in competition with Calgary, and they are equally in competition with us. That's just how business works. All this talk about a grand unified economy is just feel-good talk.
                                Strathcona City Separatist

                                Comment

                                Working...
                                X