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  • #46
    Originally posted by KC View Post
    I like to see the City trying to find ways to offset having the taxpayer subsidize everything. The simple lack of signage for Fort Edmonton Park always mystified me.

    We had and still largely have a situation where tourists are likely driving right by a great attraction but receiving near zero advance notice of it’s presence up ahead, and then little directional assistance in guiding them to the park.

    So every dollar not earned from a tourist is thus another dollar out of the pockets of taxpayers. A find situation during our boom years but possibly a significant lost opportunity. Then, of course, during our repeated and protracted tough years we just resort to our well known practice of: deferring, declining and demolishing.
    This is very seldom mentioned but lots of the time I hear from people that even have moved here that they had trouble finding the park, or didn't find it at all. If we think back, each one of us, the first drive to the park was tricky. Sometimes you miss the one turnoff (no other way to get to it) and you have do double back a long distance to get back to the turnoff again.

    The wayfinding for this is like they don't want visitors. Is there also any way to have another entrance to this, and a better entrance? The current one is like its a detour arrangement. The whole Fort Edmonton development and entry was poorly thought out from the beginning. This is as hard to find as Snow Valley for visitors.
    "if god exists and he allowed that to happen, then its better that he doesn't exist"

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    • #47
      Originally posted by kkozoriz View Post
      “It’ll fill our hotel, it will be an enormous boon for our food and beverage because FEMCo will provide all of the food and beverage in the spa and then the specific partnership arrangements between us and the Edmonton Nordic Spa ownership group, we haven’t worked that out yet. But it will be a true partnership in every sense of the word.”
      I can't see how it will fill their hotel. A scandinavian modern spa and a historical museum park do not seem like common bedfellows. I think being in the city it will have more day visits rather than overnight packages.

      The food and beverage part sure, but that doesn't seem like big dollars.

      I think the PArkland one will probably be more in tune with the nordic spa concept.

      But, it's private dollars and the lease will be subsidizing city activities, so seems worth a try.

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      • #48
        Originally posted by nobleea

        I can't see how it will fill their hotel. A scandinavian modern spa and a historical museum park do not seem like common bedfellows. I think being in the city it will have more day visits rather than overnight packages.
        A Nordic Spa is primarily popular in the winter time, whereas Fort Edmonton runs during the summer, so the on site hotel mostly sits empty in the winter, and would be there to be utilized by anyone coming from Red Deer, Fort Mac, Calgary, or even out of province or country to use the spa over a multi-day period.

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        • #49
          Originally posted by nobleea View Post
          Originally posted by kkozoriz View Post
          “It’ll fill our hotel, it will be an enormous boon for our food and beverage because FEMCo will provide all of the food and beverage in the spa and then the specific partnership arrangements between us and the Edmonton Nordic Spa ownership group, we haven’t worked that out yet. But it will be a true partnership in every sense of the word.”
          I can't see how it will fill their hotel. A scandinavian modern spa and a historical museum park do not seem like common bedfellows. I think being in the city it will have more day visits rather than overnight packages.

          The food and beverage part sure, but that doesn't seem like big dollars.

          I think the PArkland one will probably be more in tune with the nordic spa concept.

          But, it's private dollars and the lease will be subsidizing city activities, so seems worth a try.
          ii can't see how it will "fill their hotel" either...

          according to the hotel's web site:

          "Hotel Selkirk is open for guest stays throughout the summer and on select days in the fall, winter, and spring. In addition to all the Park amenities, you can also enhance your stay by taking in an event, dine in Johnson's Café, or have a drink in theMahogany Room bar."

          which, if i understand the concepts correctly, means the spa - which is pretty much a winter activity - will pretty much be open when the hotel - and the rest of the park for that matter - will pretty much be closed.

          and then there's the matter of scale... the hotel selkirk offers a grand total of 29 rooms. even at an average $150 per night nights for half a year for each room, that's just over $750k in gross income for fort edmonton park which, at typical hotel margins - which i'm not sure the selkirk can actually achieve with only 29 rooms - would barely add $75k at best to their bottom line...

          i'm not opposed to a nordic spa in the river valley and i support fort edmonton park's goal to be a major tourist destination. i'm just not convinced this is a good marriage as opposed to say integrating the spa into rossdale where it would be accessible to more hotels and more residents and adding a "hop on hop off" bus that would include downtown's hotels and the convention centre and the spa and fort edmonton park and west edmonton mall and telus world of science etc. on it's loops...
          Last edited by kcantor; 11-06-2019, 11:01 AM.
          "If you did not want much, there was plenty." Harper Lee

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          • #50
            Originally posted by Ustauk View Post
            Originally posted by nobleea

            I can't see how it will fill their hotel. A scandinavian modern spa and a historical museum park do not seem like common bedfellows. I think being in the city it will have more day visits rather than overnight packages.
            A Nordic Spa is primarily popular in the winter time, whereas Fort Edmonton runs during the summer, so the on site hotel mostly sits empty in the winter, and would be there to be utilized by anyone coming from Red Deer, Fort Mac, Calgary, or even out of province or country to use the spa over a multi-day period.
            If such a client existed. I don't think this location will see a lot of overnight visitors. And if they do, they would probably stay at a more modern and central hotel in Edmonton. For example, a girls weekend might involve a spa day, shopping, dining out, and maybe a concert or show. Staying at a hotel that is at least walking distance to some of those attractions would be more attractive.

            The parkland one I can see being more of a retreat better suited for a quiet weekend.

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            • #51
              the hotel runs on on 10% occupancy the one article said yet they want to expand the hotel to hold more people. Seems a bit lofty to do that

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              • #52
                Proposed zoning changes for nordic spa near Fort Edmonton Park
                August 28, 2019

                Edmontonians are invited to a drop-in engagement session to learn more about proposed zoning changes related to a nordic spa at 7000 143 Street NW.

                Date: Wednesday, September 4
                Time: 5:30 – 8 p.m.
                Location: Whitemud Equine Learning Centre Association, 12504 Fox Drive NW

                The City has received a proposal to add personal service shops and increase the flexibility for restaurants and specialty food services use in a portion of the River Valley Activity Node (AN) zone. The addition of these uses to the zone would facilitate the development of a nordic spa adjacent to Fort Edmonton Park. The proposed changes would apply only to Appendix 1 of the zone, which includes only the Fort Edmonton Park and nordic spa sites.

                The engagement session will be an opportunity to learn more about the proposal and share your views with the City and the applicant, B&A Planning Group. Feedback will be summarized in a report to City Council for decision at a City Council Public Hearing.


                For more information:
                edmonton.ca/nordicspazoning

                Media contact:
                Karen Burgess
                Communications Advisor
                Communications and Engagement
                780-496-4908


                Ottawa-Edmonton-Vancouver-Edmonton

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                • #53
                  Yes, more commercial activity in the valley. Maybe a nice mall in Victoria Park. Or a pet shop at the zoo.

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                  • #54
                    ^^ I'll make it if I can
                    “You have to dream big. If we want to be a little city, we dream small. If we want to be a big city, we dream big, and this is a big idea.” - Mayor Stephen Mandel, 02/22/2012

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                    • #55
                      Anyone make it to the meeting? Any further developments?
                      LRT is our future, time to push forward.

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                      • #56
                        Goes to public hearing at Council on Oct 21.

                        3.5

                        Charter Bylaw 19044 - To amend the text of the River Valley Activity Node Zone,

                        River Valley-Fort Edmonton

                        Charter Bylaw 19044 and Item 3.6 will be dealt with together.

                        3.6

                        Edmonton Nordic Spa Rezoning

                        Report to be distributed when available


                        Ottawa-Edmonton-Vancouver-Edmonton

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                        • #57
                          Fort Edmonton's nordic spa cancelled

                          The proposed Nordic spa at Fort Edmonton Park is dead in the water.

                          Fort Edmonton Management Co. (FEMCo) announced Friday that the organization and the Edmonton Nordic Spa group have "dissolved their partnership," according to a news release.

                          "Both organizations worked hard to find commercially viable common ground, but in the end we could not make it work," said Darren Dalgleish president and CEO of Fort Edmonton Management Company in a release.

                          The managing partner of the Edmonton Nordic Spa group said in the release that the two groups were "not successful in finding a solution that had long-term sustainability for both organizations."

                          The nordic spa was originally planned to open next fall.

                          The company was expecting about 130,000 to 150,000 people to visit the Edmonton nordic spa each year.

                          The group of entrepreneurs who pursued the Edmonton project are the same owners of the Kananaskis Nordic Spa at the Pomeroy Kananaskis Mountain Lodge.

                          The spa was set to be discussed at a city public hearing on Monday but has since been removed from the agenda, the release said.

                          The spa would have been on two acres of city-owned land.

                          The proposed development site currently hosts an overflow parking lot and runs parallel to the North Saskatchewan River.

                          Members of the Edmonton Nordic Spa group still want to open a spa and have started to look for a site.
                          “You have to dream big. If we want to be a little city, we dream small. If we want to be a big city, we dream big, and this is a big idea.” - Mayor Stephen Mandel, 02/22/2012

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                          • #58
                            No surprise.
                            Go Canucks Go!

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                            • #59
                              I wonder if the spa would do better at the Old Queen Elizabeth Pool location.
                              "Talk minus action equals zero." - Joe Keithley, D. O. A.

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                              • #60
                                Originally posted by The_Cat View Post
                                I wonder if the spa would do better at the Old Queen Elizabeth Pool location.
                                That would be nice, but shaded from the sun much of the time. I think visitors would prefer a sunny location.

                                Plus sunlight could be used to reduce costs through solar water heating.

                                Is there a river side location close to a LRT station.




                                Maybe the old RAM Provincial Museum museum could become some sort of Nordic spa-entertainment conference complex.

                                Change most of the access to a below the bank parking lot to isolate it from the surrounding neighborhoods. Buses and walk-in traffic could still enter from street level. A top of bank restaurant, bar and the Nordic spa could overlook the valley.
                                Last edited by KC; 18-10-2019, 08:26 PM.

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