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Thread: Edmonton Airshow 2019

  1. #101

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    No, they work just fine. However, claiming that as many people would TRAVEL to Edmonton as do to Reno is what I'm disputing. Reno pulls in more tourist $ than we do despite being much smaller than we are. Those are people bringing money INTO the economy whereas the events here that you mention are mostly redistributing it.

    And if the CFR was such a cash cow, why wasn't Katz willing to make a deal with them? Or Calgary? Why did it end up in Red Deer with 1/10th the population of Edmonton in a smaller arena?

    And Travel Alberta should be re-named Travel Calgary because what they do to promote Edmonton is just enough to keep from being zero. But we're supposed to go "Yay!' when they manage to actually promote something here.

    It's also a mistake to assume that you'll draw the same size TV crowd for an event here as they do in the states. This year's NBA finals were the lowest rated in a decade. Americans generally aren't interested in something happening in another country.

  2. #102
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    Boy, someone here is a big fan of Reno. My brother-in-law has lived there for 15+ years and hates every second of it. Besides gambling, Reno is apparently home to most of the world's cat litter mines....betcha didn't know that....visit him once a year and it is depressing as hell......airport sucks - only attribute it's proximity to Tahoe - where we all share a cabin every September.....

  3. #103

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    Not saying I'm a big fan of Reno, just stating facts. They draw 5 million+ tourists with a local population of ~250,000. Edmonton pulls in ~3.5 million despite having 4 times the population of Reno. And a lot of those Edmonton tourist nights are simply single overnights for shopping at WEM or an Oilers game. Reno not only pulls in more visitors, they tend to stay longer, which means spending more money.

  4. #104
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    Tahoe is the draw KK. Tahoe. It is the same as Calgary/Banff...

    Not Reno...not the casinos...maclac has it right. I am not trying to disparage Reno, but I'd say Edmonton holds its own and surpasses in many areas. We could host the same amount of private jets, and the travel here has ample connections if we do this in advance. That's one reason why we pushed this off until 2020.

    I note how you sidestepped Stampede. Telling. We're learning from how that executes and Calgary businesses are taking notice. The ONLY reason this is not in Springbank is encroachment. Same for the other close proximity airports. But, they think the idea is good enough to want to play in Villeneuve. You...you say it would never happen here.

    The event I am talking about itself, people WILL travel to it. It is not all the other ancillary travel stats. The reason it is in Reno is the airport layout, not the city. Most of the executive live elsewhere (the president is in FLA). This is rare enough that it incents people to travel. Even Indy, for all its warts, was proven to give a 6% jump in passenger traffic at YEG, filled hotels, drained the rental car fleet, had 3-4 conventions book Edmonton because it was here, etc. The city pulled the plug on that due to politics, and I cannot say what or how as that would break confidences.

    CFR was a cash cow. But, politics ensued. I won't say more as again it gives up some confidences, but we learned some lessons from that issue.

    If you would take more time to stop doing the Wikipedia 50,000' view, and actually start talking about the event...

    Travel Alberta looks to Calgary because Calgary actually provides them with the metrics they want. Stampede, Banff, Kananaskis, etc give them the numbers. A lot of festivals/attractions here don't. That's why we aligned our reporting to fit their metrics. Again, lessons learned from other's mistakes.

    Once you get behind the scenes KK, it is a slightly different world than it appears. Yes, Travel Alberta does have a lot of staff in Calgary, and films a lot in the area. But, if the main municipality/ies get onside, TA is there with matching funds and effort. That is the key here and why I am pushing so hard. Once the City proper finally gets on board, then TA and others show up. The CoE is key to all of this. If they want a chance to get these numbers, they need to play. Period.

    As for your fixation on gaming, the 2017 UNR study focusing just on NCAR shows that gambling...something you think is this huge draw...is #5 of 6 key metrics. The only reason the shopping metric didn't beat gambling is the dearth of shopping in Reno compared to other cities. Also, what is not included in the UNR study but listed out in one that is NDA is the number of business deals done during NCAR.

    So, yes KK, people WILL travel to Edmonton from elsewhere if you give them something to travel FOR. Something unique, different, and not easily acquired elsewhere.

    Americans may not be interested in something happening in another country when it comes to an international sports team vs another international sports team when an American one is around. The same could be said for ratings when the Arizona Diamondbacks won the world series. Ratings were abysmal...and it wasn't the Diamondbacks vs the Jays... It is more about a sports team being based in a major market (US) than not. Even the Subway Series (Mets/Yankees) was abysmal by World Series standards. But, they do watch premier league football, Tour de France, etc. Can I blame them for being homers? Nope.

    Again, by your logic, you appear to say that Edmonton isn't worth the effort. Again, I ask do you live here? Again, I ask if this idea is so **** poor, and others are, then what is your mind melting idea and why aren't you pushing it? I'm OK if there is a better idea and it wins. So KK, instead of just trying to trash other's efforts with high-level statistics melded for your convenience, what is your strategy?

    I know the answer. You don't have one. So, what's for dinner?
    President and CEO - Airshow.

  5. #105

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    Tahoe pulls in ~3 million visitors per year. Reno gets 5 million. Somehow, 60% of what Reno draws is actually why people go there. And regardless of which it is, that's 8 million visitors (some of which are probably counted twice) compared to Edmonton's ~3 million. It's the same with Calgary/Banff. Do you think that all those visitors to Banff think about how they can bypass Calgary or do they stay in both locations?

    A lot of Edmonton festivals/attractions don't provide what Travel Alberta is looking for? So, which ones should we stop supporting and which ones deserve to be promoted by Travel Alberta? Which ones are holding us back? Is it time to stop splitting the support and put fewer eggs into our basket? And how do we come up to something that compares to Banff or Kananaskis? Move Jasper to the east? There's a big difference between deciding to have lunch in Banff ant 10 am and being able to do so and doing the same in Edmonton. Do that and you'd end up having lunch in Leaman, not Jasper.

    No, Edmonton is worth the effort but the whole "We need to make the world take notice of us at all costs" has been going on for decades. The old joke was there were two things people knew about Edmonton were Wayne Gretzky and West Edmonton Mall. Well, Gretzky is long gone from the headlines. I'd prefer that we concentrate on doing what's best for the people that live here. If other people notice and decide that it looks interesting, so much the better. Edmonton's desperate need for outside validation is keeping us from seeing that we're actually just fine being ourselves and that we don't need to be the needy friend who's always trying to be the popular cheerleader or the famous jock.

    We're looking at spending millions to attract a World Cup game or two, dropping more money onto a stadium that sits empty 95% of the time. And even if we do get to host a game and get world TV coverage, what's the long term result? How many people Edmonton hosted the World Track and Field Championships in 2001? What is the result from that now, nearly 20 years on? Any lasting effect to the average person planning their vacation?

    And again, if the CFR was such a cash cow, why didn't Calgary or even Saskatoon snap it up? Oh right "secret" politics. Edmonton has such influence over those cities that we managed to kibosh any move to a larger center. We're sneaky that way.

    The problem was that Katz, who may have grown up here but can hardly be considered an Edmontonian these days, decided that he had to have a No Compete Clause added to the deal that saw the city buy him a brand new arena. And Edmonton, being so desperate for the attention that an NHL team brings, went along with it. But that's the way we are. We want the new, she sparkly, the shiny. Don't build on what we have. Instead, we get distracted by "the next big thing" and let what's already here fall by the wayside. LMP is half finished. Public spaces are overgrown with weeds. Trashcans are overflowing on Jasper but don't worry because we've got fancy new sidewalks and still unfinished custom light standards to draw people downtown.

    I used to attend the Namao Airshow and while it was an interesting way to spend a day, it didn't really have much of a lasting effect on me. It was a couple of days out of the year. What about the other 363 days of the year? It's like going out for a night on the town and then going home to a house that needs painting and general repairs. Sure, the night out was fun but I spend a lot more time in the house that needs work.

  6. #106
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    "The problem was that Katz, who may have grown up here but can hardly be considered an Edmontonian these days,..."

    kkozoriz, I stopped reading when I read your asinine statement. Grow up ... Katz is more of an "Edmontonian" than you ever will be. Katz has been a champion for Edmonton for his entire life and continues to support numerous charities, promote academic and applied research and maintains business operations and investment in Edmonton. And while he has a home in Edmonton - he has the good fortune to be able to live and work from any place in the world. Who the hell do you think you are to decide who is and who is not an Edmontonian - you're pathetic.

  7. #107
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    KK

    1. Namao was a military show, meant for RCAF recruiting. They made no secret of that. We are an air summit meant for business generation and education in STEM, trades, and we still do a bit of CAF recruiting. 2 advisory board members are ex RCAF- both commanders and one commanded Namao during the airshow years. Our scope is far broader.
    2. the rhetoric of moving mountains is unnecessary. It is about what you do with what you have, and how do you expand. If Leaman wanted to be something, it can. I also was a proponent of a design for a highway 16 set of attractions from Lloyd to Valemount.
    3. This is not an "at all costs" effort. It is tightly controlled. Investment in this is far cheaper than Crashed Ice, the money stays here, local IP, pays local suppliers...not that Crashed Ice was bad...
    4. How dare you do the tired trope of setting me up for failure. I did not ask for any festival or event to be axed. I just mentioned that if you want Travel Alberta cash, you need to do what Travel Alberta needs. They focus on external tourists, not locals.
    5. This is not about validation. It is an ANNUAL event that gets people here ANNUALLY. You said
      If other people notice and decide that it looks interesting, so much the better.
      Well how in the world are they going to notice in enough volume to make a difference? Word of mouth? Glossy brochures that people take on boondoggles? I can tell you with authority that when I get people here, they stay. When I was living in the US, I outsourced jobs TO Edmonton from a multi-national company. When I moved here, I recruited 66 jobs in 4 months using this very forum as a way to show people what is going on here. It is when they got here, that I definitely pushed the wow factor to 10. That is what this annual event is, and why I am trying to expand it. Once we get them here, they tend to like it.
    6. Again, ANNUAL event. ...as in people do plan their vacations. In this industry, even volunteers plan their vacations to come and play. Ask Reno. Ask Oshkosh. Ask Farnborough. Don't try to deflect by juxtaposing to a one and done events like the Track and Field games, or FIFA.
    7. CFR. Calgary has an arena issue. Saskatoon got burned. CFR wanted Alberta. Red Deer it is. they've done a good job so far.
    8. Please stop the rhetoric of lawns, garbage cans, and parks. Using your house metaphor, I am inviting several people to our house so that they can see how good it is. They are going to drop some cash, and maybe make some comments, so we can take the rest of the year to fix up our house for next year's party. We may even reciprocate and go to other house parties to see what they do.
    9. You STILL ignore the Stampede equation. Where are the mayor's, MLA's, MP's, provincial leaders, CEO's etc right now? Stampede. Whether it is Rachel, Jason, Justin, Stephen, Ralph, Alison....they always attend Stampede. Stampede is NOT a rodeo. Alberta has several rodeos, yet this Calgary event is world renowned. If we can even get a little bit of that excitement here, we'd be golden. 10% of $400M is $40M. ...but, you'd rather pooh pooh this.


    I'm still waiting for your eye-watering solution.
    President and CEO - Airshow.

  8. #108
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    Oh Richard, I feel so badly for you, having to try and explain all this, to someone that isn't listening. We're so looking forward to the air show. I've passed the info on to everyone we know, and put information in other forums..
    Animals are my passion.

  9. #109

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    https://www.nytimes.com/2019/06/17/b...-airlines.html

    Airlines Try New Ways to Build Pilot Ranks


    Olivia Mickevicius and Ahkeel Leach after a preflight equipment check at the American Airlines Cadet Academy in Mesa, Ariz., where they are training to become pilots.


    Caitlin O'Hara for The New York Times


    By Christine Negroni
    June 17, 2019


    It’s a conundrum bordering on a crisis for the global airline industry: More people are flying to more places, but the number of pilots is not keeping up.


    “Airlines have had to go to greater lengths to recruit pilots,” said Nick Leontidis, group president of civil aviation training solutions at CAE, an aviation education company. “If it took a month to recruit 50 pilots, it takes six months now.”


    Reports from airplane manufacturers, industry associations and pilot labor groups point to a confluence of events. Not only are more people traveling by air, but airlines now link an unprecedented number of cities — 20,000 worldwide as of 2018. Often those markets are served by smaller planes, not the jumbo jets of a decade ago that could carry 450 people or more, and that makes for more flights.


    Demand for air travel is growing so quickly that 635,000 commercial pilots will be needed by 2037, according to a forecast produced by Boeing in 2018. The biggest need is in Asia, where an improving economy in China has resulted in more people traveling. More people are flying in the United States as well and, at the same time, pilots are hitting the mandatory retirement age of 65.


    For aspiring airline pilots like 24-year-old Ahkeel Leach, who spent his childhood traveling between his father’s home in New York and his mother’s in Britain, the industry’s challenge is a career opportunity. Though he had wanted to fly since he was a child, he did not know where to study or how to pay for it.


    “My family, we’re all immigrants. Aviation is one of those things you stick in the corner,” he said. “It’s a great job, but not everybody knows there are affordable avenues or has guidance to get there.”


    Programs that give students like Mr. Leach flying lessons, the means to pay for them and the promise of a job after graduation are new in the United States. Recently, American Airlines and JetBlue became the first United States-based carriers to offer what is called an “ab initio” training program. A Latin term for “from the beginning,” it means that airlines select people with an aptitude and personality for the cockpit and teach them everything else.

    (...)

  10. #110

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    US Navy assets coming!
    https://www.edmontonairshow.com/attr...tatic-display/

    C-2 Greyhoung and E-2 Hawkeye! Both are aircraft carrier assets. This is going to be sweet!

  11. #111

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    https://www.stalberttoday.ca/local-n...uccess-1542487

    Aviation sector taking off with airshow success
    The Edmonton Airshow has grown since being launched in 2015 and since then the aviation sector as grown with it in the region
    about 11 hours ago by: Jeff Labine


    Capt. Brian Kilroy will pilot the Royal Canadian Air Force's (RCAF) 2019 Demo Jet coming to the Edmonton Airshow in August. The 2019 CF-18 Demo theme "To the Stars" celebrates the journey that led not only to a modern RCAF but the key cultural and technological innovations that led us to the stars. – Image by Corp. Arthur Ark / Aerial Imagery Specialist

    The aviation sector is taking flight in Sturgeon County thanks in part to the success of the Edmonton Airshow.


    The annual event, which launched in 2015, draws thousands to the Villeneuve Airport for two days of aerial showmanship. This year’s lineup includes staples like the Canadian Forces Snowbirds as well as some special guests like the A-10C Thunderbolt II demo team from Arizona.


    During a media conference on Wednesday, June 26, organizers and officials with Sturgeon County and the Edmonton International Airport (EIA) played up the economic benefit of developing the aviation industry in the area.


    Traci Bednard, a spokesperson with the EIA, said the economic impact of the event alone was more than $3 million while the Villeneuve Airport generates an economic output of $62 million and a gross domestic product (GDP) impact of $31 million based on 2017 numbers.


    Sturgeon County Mayor Alanna Hnatiw said there are a lot of components in place to see aviation in the area succeed, including excellent learning institutions for artificial intelligence and machinery.


    “We know we have the talent and we know we have space,” she said. “We have a skilled workforce that can diversify. If the opportunities are available, I really believe we’ll be able to attract the people and knowledge that isn’t here and then develop the knowledge that is here. I think it is an opportunity for people who live here to work in a sector that they otherwise wouldn’t have had an opportunity to.”


    Hnatiw said as the airshow has grown, so too has the aviation industry in the area. She said it’s the county’s job to support the industry as it continues to grow but she added council sets a high bar for not only themselves but for businesses as well.


    “It just makes sense that when you have like-minded people, you stand in when you can and support one another,” she said. “(It is) our jobs as leaders in the region to look at what is underdeveloped, what needs a little energy, a little attention and then let things take root.”


    The county isn’t providing any financial contribution to the airshow but instead in-kind support by providing services like emergency response.


    Richard Skermer, the organizer of the airshow, said he hopes to one day elevate the airshow to the same notoriety as the Calgary Stampede. Before a plane ever takes flight, he explained, men, women and companies all work together to put the aircraft together.


    “We want to be that networking event that is internationally recognized in order to attract investors and locate those businesses and jobs here,” he said. “We want to create a network where landowners and developers can source opportunities for their portfolio. We want to have investors come to the region and see our facilities like the international airport – augmented by the Villeneuve Airport – can be even bigger and better and even larger assets for Alberta as we’re open for business in the world.”


    The fifth annual airshow runs from Saturday, Aug. 17 and Sunday, Aug. 18. The airshow will also feature Jacquie B, the Erickson Collection, de Havilland DH-115 and Yellow Thunder. Tickets went on sale in May and can be purchased online at edmontonairshow.com.

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