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Thread: Parking, neighbourhoods and walkable, local options.

  1. #1
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    Default Parking, neighbourhoods and walkable, local options.

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  2. #2

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    Anyone have seating capacities for both venues? Can't be that high. Parking is going to need to be delt with as this city grows. Public parking is public. There is a tonne of street parking within 1 block of that new building. Someone needs to call Bunt and get a traffic analysis into the City now.

    EDIT: Ugh, nevermind. Apparently one was done but the neighbours overruled it. What's the point then?
    Last edited by GenWhy?; 24-07-2018 at 05:01 PM.
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  3. #3
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    On-street parking in neighbourhoods is a privilege, not a right and a parking study was done... a permit was APPROVED and then revoked?

    Something smells.
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  4. #4

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    Everything in this article makes me mad... Ben Henderson said speeding was an issue because he beleived they (those cars) were looking for parking. So is the issue parking, street design, speeds, parking for commercial vs residential use, people using their garage vs street, distance to park in relation to one's house, hours of use for street parking... etc. Or is it simply that everyone wants / expects to park right in front of the door they wish to enter?
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  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by IanO View Post
    Ridiculous...

    i voted "no" on Elise's survey but the issue isn't as black and white as a "yes or no" survey nor as simple as dismissing it as "ridiculous...".

    if the deli relies on customers being able to park and there is insufficient parking to support the business, it will be a short term problem for the neighbors (assuming the deli isn't hiring 6 staff who all park on the street ), that will take care of itself.

    the real problem is less being able to park as being able to park for either short or long periods of time. residents should be able to park for extended periods in their neighborhood and should have a sticker or placard displayed in order to park for extended periods. others would be restricted to say 2 hours during the day and 4 hours "after hours" to allow for visitors to access businesses or homes.

    those not using a placard for their vehicle should be able to make it available to visitors/caregivers and perhaps there could be a maximum number of placards available per residence which would solve the one home/six cars concern that is often the real issue.

    perhaps the city could even partner with the province so that placards could be issued based on the registered address of the vehicle owner for the first placard for each address with additional ones having to be requested in person or on-line. the end result should be a manageable relationship for both residents and businesses and anyone needing more parking than permitted in a reasonably regulated and administered fashion (resident or visitor) would simply have to find off-street parking or use transit so the system starts to encourage "better behavior".
    Last edited by kcantor; 24-07-2018 at 05:14 PM.
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  6. #6

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    The Ritchie development did not face this and the area is so much "worse".
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  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by IanO View Post
    On-street parking in neighbourhoods is a privilege, not a right and a parking study was done... a permit was APPROVED and then revoked?

    Something smells.
    no, according to the article the permit was not approved so nothing to smell here. the recommendation of the transportation department to issue a permit was changed from yes to no based on subsequent neighborhood input.

    you just have to love "public consultation" as soon as it moves past motherhood and apple pie and starts to interfere instead of support (too often the rule rather than the exception).

    for what it's worth, it's often worth setting the initial uses for the most stringent (i.e. food and liquor outlets) and then if there's a subsequent change it's to something less restrictive. my guess is if this had been the initially requested use on the original application, the original application would have been approved just as readily and there wouldn't be a subsequent issue.
    "If you did not want much, there was plenty." Harper Lee

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    Quote Originally Posted by GenWhy? View Post
    The Ritchie development did not face this and the area is so much "worse".
    it's often less the "better or worse" than it is simply the subsequent change that becomes problematic.

    the ritchie development's brewery and food uses were in the originally approved application if i recall correctly. if it had been done as general retail and then tried to change to the brewery and food, the fight would have been much the same as this one and would face the same uphill battle.
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  9. #9

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    The curb lane right in front of this building should be short-term parking round the clock. It's not needed to move the limited traffic volumes that 106ave has. That would help.

    Beyond that, the sooner we get away from the idea that we all have a right to free parking near our houses the better. I'm sure residents of the apartments are parking on the street because it's free while the building's parking comes at a monthly cost. Which it should, since there's a cost to providing it.
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  10. #10

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    Also consider that this place is across the alley from Hilltop Pub, which brings its own parking demands on the neighbourhood.
    I am in no way entitled to your opinion...

  11. #11

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    How far do people travel for a pub/café/deli? Maybe all this place needs is an avenue that's safe and comfortable to cross to convince people from south off 106 to walk there instead of drive.
    There can only be one.

  12. #12

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    The Hilltop has a parking lot. More importantly The Hilltop has bike parking - Cartago does not. Cartago is also in an unfriendly street crossing spot. They should do something about their bike parking.

  13. #13

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    Parking on 106 Ave in front of the building is only restricted during morning rush hour. And kcantor, true about the changes after as opposed to what they initially go in with. As for bike parking you can write to the City and request one. I've done it a few times and they're quite quick about it if you write a good letter.
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  14. #14

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    Pedestrian road crossings are at 83 & 81 streets.
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  15. #15

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    Quote Originally Posted by GenWhy? View Post
    As for bike parking you can write to the City and request one. I've done it a few times and they're quite quick about it if you write a good letter.
    You should pass that advice along to Ms. Ingraham. On second thought, considering the things I've seen her write lately perhaps she should stick to running a restaurant.

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    Quote Originally Posted by kcantor View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by IanO View Post
    On-street parking in neighbourhoods is a privilege, not a right and a parking study was done... a permit was APPROVED and then revoked?

    Something smells.
    no, according to the article the permit was not approved so nothing to smell here. the recommendation of the transportation department to issue a permit was changed from yes to no based on subsequent neighborhood input.

    you just have to love "public consultation" as soon as it moves past motherhood and apple pie and starts to interfere instead of support (too often the rule rather than the exception).

    for what it's worth, it's often worth setting the initial uses for the most stringent (i.e. food and liquor outlets) and then if there's a subsequent change it's to something less restrictive. my guess is if this had been the initially requested use on the original application, the original application would have been approved just as readily and there wouldn't be a subsequent issue.
    I should clarify and apologize, Transportation supported the permit application, a permit was not approved.
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  17. #17

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    This statement, in light of all the other things swirling around the person/business this week, is the one that bothers me the most in the article: "But Ingraham said there’s only so much a business can do"

    It feels so much like the business doesn't want to be an active member of the community. I can appreciate, you are a business and there IS only so much you can do, but come on, it doesn't sound like she wants to do anything to work with the community on this to become a valued business/partner in the neighborhood.

  18. #18

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    ^ kinda odd that all those defending their social media response on the common instagram thing that we should give them a pass because of all the hard work they do for the community - but no one can point out exactly what they've done for the community outside of profiting from having a business...

  19. #19

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    ^kudos

    Its really quite amazing as well the owner is complaining to the press about this and on front page news the same week that she was complaining about some customer reviews while doing all she can do....

    One would think a few things;

    1)She would have enough sense not to have opened her big yap just this past week entering into a stupid online fray that was only going to backfire.

    2)She can't possibly think readers reading the paper today had much of any thought other than "oh heres the xxxxxx" right on the front page. Upon glancing I had immediately thought it was just a further on Restoreviewgate. lol that its about the same owner complaining about something else. This time biting the city.

    3)Personally when I think of Cartagu I think of an owner blasting a customer review online and publicly attempting to blame name shame an honest review. Really I think of a bully. The picture doesn't do it enough justice. Yeah, she's doing all she can to put herself out of business. This could be one block away from where I live and I wouldn't go there now.
    Last edited by Replacement; 25-07-2018 at 11:57 AM.
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  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Replacement View Post
    ^kudos

    Its really quite amazing as well the owner is complaining to the press about this and on front page news the same week that she was complaining about some customer reviews while doing all she can do....

    One would think a few things;

    1)She would have enough sense not to have opened her big yap just this past week entering into a stupid online fray that was only going to backfire.

    2)She can't possibly think readers reading the paper today had much of any thought other than "oh heres the xxxxxx" right on the front page. Upon glancing I had immediately thought it was just a further on Restoreviewgate. lol that its about the same owner complaining about something else. This time biting the city.

    3)Personally when I think of Cartagu I think of an owner blasting a customer review online and publicly attempting to blame name shame an honest review. Really I think of a bully. The picture doesn't do it enough justice. Yeah, she's doing all she can to put herself out of business. This could be one block away from where I live and I wouldn't go there now.
    she applied for a development permit for existing vacant space last october!!!

    that's now coming up on 10 months!!! with possibly 2 or 3 more before it goes to sdab and she'll know what the result is or what her options are. i'm not sure what her agreement is with her landlord but she's probably long past any fixturing or free rent period she may have negotiated.

    doesn't anyone think that this might be applying a bit of abnormal pressure that might be affecting what her normal responses might be? maybe the review just seemed like more piling on that she could at least respond to in a manner that you can't respond to the city?

    so yeah, one could think of a few things, particularly if one chooses to be charitable in passing judgements on the actions and choices of another. maybe she really has done all she can do and simply doesn't know how to move forward with something that's not in her control.

    kudos? i think not. at worst the lady made a mistake and exercised some poor judgement but she isn't the only one here who has done that.
    Last edited by kcantor; 25-07-2018 at 01:20 PM.
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  21. #21

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    Well, she doubled down on her mistake online and in continuing some contemptful comments that were made about a diner, online. That was nothing more than jumping on bullying and it was deplorable.

    The timing that I raised was not her zoning application. It was when she decided to go to the press with this and her timing of looking like a jerk online just this week, as a restaurateur ironically critical of diners, is at best inane. Unless this development was Fawlty Towers.

    If she has recanted or apologized somewhere online I would consider that.



    To say much of anything online is to exercise poor judgement.. If you want to take it to that extent, we should all know better. heh
    Last edited by Replacement; 25-07-2018 at 01:49 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Medwards View Post
    ^ kinda odd that all those defending their social media response on the common instagram thing that we should give them a pass because of all the hard work they do for the community - but no one can point out exactly what they've done for the community outside of profiting from having a business...
    Fingers crossed that they never get to expand solely on Katy being an ignorant entitled b***h with that whole Common thing.

  23. #23

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    Quote Originally Posted by Terry_H View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Medwards View Post
    ^ kinda odd that all those defending their social media response on the common instagram thing that we should give them a pass because of all the hard work they do for the community - but no one can point out exactly what they've done for the community outside of profiting from having a business...
    Fingers crossed that they never get to expand solely on Katy being an ignorant entitled b***h with that whole Common thing.
    This does what for City Building?
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  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by GenWhy? View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Terry_H View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Medwards View Post
    ^ kinda odd that all those defending their social media response on the common instagram thing that we should give them a pass because of all the hard work they do for the community - but no one can point out exactly what they've done for the community outside of profiting from having a business...
    Fingers crossed that they never get to expand solely on Katy being an ignorant entitled b***h with that whole Common thing.
    This does what for City Building?
    Why should bad people get opportunities? Maybe if she apologized for her immature comments and actions... but she just wants pity and sympathy.

  25. #25

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    Parking considerations for mixed-use buildings in mature neighbourhoods with abundant free street parking should be subjectively considered based upon the business operator's past Instagram posts from now and into the future and be used as a precedent in land-use and zoning decisions for the city as a whole as we trancend the 20th century in the 21st in building sustainable and integrated neighbourhoods?

    Serious question, I'm not being facetious or condescending what-have-you.
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  26. #26

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    Quote Originally Posted by Replacement View Post
    ^kudos

    Its really quite amazing as well the owner is complaining to the press about this and on front page news the same week that she was complaining about some customer reviews while doing all she can do....

    One would think a few things;

    1)She would have enough sense not to have opened her big yap just this past week entering into a stupid online fray that was only going to backfire.

    2)She can't possibly think readers reading the paper today had much of any thought other than "oh heres the xxxxxx" right on the front page. Upon glancing I had immediately thought it was just a further on Restoreviewgate. lol that its about the same owner complaining about something else. This time biting the city.

    3)Personally when I think of Cartagu I think of an owner blasting a customer review online and publicly attempting to blame name shame an honest review. Really I think of a bully. The picture doesn't do it enough justice. Yeah, she's doing all she can to put herself out of business. This could be one block away from where I live and I wouldn't go there now.
    Do you have any quotations and links on this?

    I doubt the owner had any control over the front page placement.

    Are the negative reviews recent and are they possibly being posted as a result of this dispute? (People can do somebody really nasty things to small businesses while keeping their true agenda hidden.)
    Last edited by KC; 03-08-2018 at 04:15 PM.

  27. #27

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    Quote Originally Posted by kcantor View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by IanO View Post
    Ridiculous...

    i voted "no" on Elise's survey but the issue isn't as black and white as a "yes or no" survey nor as simple as dismissing it as "ridiculous...".

    if the deli relies on customers being able to park and there is insufficient parking to support the business, it will be a short term problem for the neighbors (assuming the deli isn't hiring 6 staff who all park on the street ), that will take care of itself.

    the real problem is less being able to park as being able to park for either short or long periods of time. residents should be able to park for extended periods in their neighborhood and should have a sticker or placard displayed in order to park for extended periods. others would be restricted to say 2 hours during the day and 4 hours "after hours" to allow for visitors to access businesses or homes.

    those not using a placard for their vehicle should be able to make it available to visitors/caregivers and perhaps there could be a maximum number of placards available per residence which would solve the one home/six cars concern that is often the real issue.

    perhaps the city could even partner with the province so that placards could be issued based on the registered address of the vehicle owner for the first placard for each address with additional ones having to be requested in person or on-line. the end result should be a manageable relationship for both residents and businesses and anyone needing more parking than permitted in a reasonably regulated and administered fashion (resident or visitor) would simply have to find off-street parking or use transit so the system starts to encourage "better behavior".
    This seems sensible. Moreover this has to have been an ongoing issue throughout the city for many decades now. As business and commercial areas have expanded they’ve long encroached on residential areas. Such transition zones must be all over the city so isn’t there a fairly standardized process of time restrictions and placards/stickers that would come into play? (Eg Windsor Park has it due to the UofA.)

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