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Thread: President Donald Trump What Now

  1. #1801

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dave View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Spudly View Post
    Or that he didn't have a clue what Abe was talking about?

    https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/...ce-translation
    He kept on calling him Donald - I found that very odd. I thought the Japanese were more formal and considered formality to be a sign of respect.

    But Japanese is his first language - it's hard to pronounce "Tlump"

  2. #1802

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    Quote Originally Posted by MrOilers View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Spudly View Post
    It's a common Trumpian manoeuvre, really one of any BSer:

    And, when discussions get bogged down in details, the president has been known to quickly change the subject — to "seem in control at all times,"
    http://www.politico.com/story/2017/0...sidency-234879

    Donald Trump purposely inserts obvious mistakes in his contracts that the other party will find and distract them from the bigger and more important details. In essence, Trump fleeces them while they pat themselves on the back for catching the "mistakes".
    Oddly, there was nothing in The Art of the Deal about this tactic - and he bragged about a lot of his tactics there. Where is this revealed? Perhaps just an excuse for his scattershot approach? Did he ever actually write any contracts? He has lawyers for that.
    I feel in no way entitled to your opinion...

  3. #1803

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    Quote Originally Posted by Spudly View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by MrOilers View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Spudly View Post
    It's a common Trumpian manoeuvre, really one of any BSer:

    And, when discussions get bogged down in details, the president has been known to quickly change the subject — to "seem in control at all times,"
    http://www.politico.com/story/2017/0...sidency-234879

    Donald Trump purposely inserts obvious mistakes in his contracts that the other party will find and distract them from the bigger and more important details. In essence, Trump fleeces them while they pat themselves on the back for catching the "mistakes".
    Oddly, there was nothing in The Art of the Deal about this tactic - and he bragged about a lot of his tactics there. Where is this revealed? Perhaps just an excuse for his scattershot approach? Did he ever actually write any contracts? He has lawyers for that.
    Everybody and his dog, including every constitutional lawyer and every academic in the country and every blogger and taking head is analyzing Trump's every move and utterance. Nothing's going to be missed. Nothing made public wil be missed that is. There's probably already been secret approvals made for all kinds of citizen and foreign surveillance etc. So it's a two way street. Everyone of us on c2e probably has a dossier where we've all been labelled and shoved into some algorithmically driven box.
    Last edited by KC; 10-02-2017 at 05:57 PM.

  4. #1804

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    Quote Originally Posted by KC View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Spudly View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by MrOilers View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Spudly View Post
    It's a common Trumpian manoeuvre, really one of any BSer:

    And, when discussions get bogged down in details, the president has been known to quickly change the subject — to "seem in control at all times,"
    http://www.politico.com/story/2017/0...sidency-234879

    Donald Trump purposely inserts obvious mistakes in his contracts that the other party will find and distract them from the bigger and more important details. In essence, Trump fleeces them while they pat themselves on the back for catching the "mistakes".
    Oddly, there was nothing in The Art of the Deal about this tactic - and he bragged about a lot of his tactics there. Where is this revealed? Perhaps just an excuse for his scattershot approach? Did he ever actually write any contracts? He has lawyers for that.
    Everybody and his dog, including every constitutional lawyer and every academic in the country and every blogger and taking head is analyzing Trump's every move and utterance. Nothing's going to be missed. Nothing made public wil be missed that is. There's probably already been secret approvals made for all kinds of citizen and foreign surveillance etc. So it's a two way street. Everyone of us on c2e probably has a dossier where we've all been labelled and shoved into some algorithmically driven box.
    You know when I make an obbious mistake, that's my tactic too! Here I thought Donald was just A D D or sloppy. Maybe Trumplestillskin is more clever than thought.

  5. #1805

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    Or he's just kidding? That was a fave excuse for a while.
    I feel in no way entitled to your opinion...

  6. #1806

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    Quote Originally Posted by JayBee View Post
    Kellyanne Conway Tells Americans To Buy Ivanka Trump's Products

    Jim Zarroli 2010


    A worker cleaned the windows of the Ivanka Trump Collection in the lobby of Trump Tower in New York last month.
    Andrew Harnik/AP
    Updated at 8 p.m. ET

    Kellyanne Conway, a top adviser to President Trump, may have violated federal ethics rules Thursday when she urged shoppers to buy Ivanka Trump's retail brand, following the decision by several retail companies to drop the line because of poor sales.

    "Go buy Ivanka's stuff, is what I was [saying] — I hate shopping and I'm going to go get some myself today," Conway said in an interview on Fox & Friends.

    "This is just [a] wonderful line," she added. "I'm going to give a free commercial here. Go buy it today, everybody. You can find it online."

    Her comments drew sharp criticism from the chairman of the House Oversight Committee, Republican Jason Chaffetz. "That is absolutely wrong, wrong, wrong. It is over the top," Chaffetz told reporters.
    http://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-w...rumps-products


    Completely indefensible, but just watch below:
    I have nothing whatsoever against Ivanka Trump. She seems like the genuine article. What the Hillary crowd is doing to her and her clothing line is just asinine. Hoards of lefties on social media asking people not to buy her line. Then there is Kellyanne Conway. The women looks like a shipwreck most days and dresses like a cheap pole dancer on others. She will do more harm to Ivanka's line than anybody. Whatever it is you are wearing Kellyanne looks like it came off a Halloween scarecrow. Your in the public eye, get help dressing.
    "The man who does not read has no advantage over the man who cannot read." –Mark Twain

  7. #1807
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    The japanese are discussing with trump the possibility of working with him to bring major manufacturing to the us. The initial figure I hear is 700,000 well paying jobs.(Fortune Magazine) with more to come.
    Last edited by Drumbones; 10-02-2017 at 07:32 PM.

  8. #1808

  9. #1809

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    ^This is for PR on Intel's behalf - Trump really had nothing to do with it except the announcement. Intel is restarting a fab they put on hold a couple years ago, and likely replacing an old fab. It's 7nm technology, which has already been surpassed by 5nm, but Intel needs it.

    An interesting strategy - announce something that you're going to do anyway, or have been thinking of doing, or assume the new administration will make favourable, and announce with the country's biggest shill (while he isn't totally stinky yet) and get the big PR bump because... (maybe) jobs.

    You can start with https://politics.slashdot.org/story/...oy-3000-people to get nerd perspectives and links.
    Last edited by Spudly; 10-02-2017 at 08:28 PM.
    I feel in no way entitled to your opinion...

  10. #1810

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    Quote Originally Posted by Drumbones View Post
    The japanese are discussing with trump the possibility of working with him to bring major manufacturing to the us. The initial figure I hear is 700,000 well paying jobs.(Fortune Magazine) with more to come.
    Isn't there a song that goes something like ' turning Japanese, I think I'm turning Japanese, I really think so'. Trump's new intro song.
    "The man who does not read has no advantage over the man who cannot read." –Mark Twain

  11. #1811

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    I really feel sorry for the writers for Saturday Night Live. They must be going crazy trying to take all the material that they were gifted with by Trump, Sean Spicer, Kellyanne Conway and the rest of the White House gave them to use this week. It must be so difficult to cram the whole week into one show. What to pick and what to throw?
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  12. #1812
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    live for happiness because without it everything seems ho hum

  13. #1813

    Default Spammers are helping to Make America Great Again

    from an hour ago in my GMail Spam folder:

    Date: Sat, 11 Feb 2017 12:22:23 +0900 (JST)
    From: "Mrs. Melania Trump" <"melania."@helen.ocn.ne.jp>
    Reply-To: "Mrs. Melania Trump" <[email protected]>


    ATTENTION ATTENTION ATTENTION.


    Donald John Trump is an American businessman and the President-elect
    of the United States, he has pleaded with the whole world who voted
    him in for a compensation notice. My Husband is doing this for the
    world cause of his happiness concerning the presidential Election that
    took place on the date of (08/11/2016).


    I am Mrs Melania Trump ,am the wife of the new president Mr Donald
    John Trump. we are offering the sum of $ 500,000.00 ( USD) to the
    whole world who has contributed on the election that took place on the
    date of 08/11/2016.My husband has assured the whole people in the
    world who has voted him in to stand a chance of receiving the sum
    $500,000.00 ( USD). the amount will be delivered to you through the
    Speed Height Delivery Service or the DHL service or even Fedex courier
    service.


    The office will not charge any much fees on the delivery but just the
    registration fees as noted amount is ( $ 380 USD ) must be paid to an
    agent who based here in the U.S.A. once the payment is done, the
    tracking code will be given to you immediately.
    So try and fill the below details of you and your families members who
    also voted, they are all allowed to receive this funds too.


    First name :
    Last name :
    Address :
    City :
    Country :
    Zip code :
    Age :
    Mobile number :
    Next of king :
    Mother's middle name :


    Once we have the above info, then you will be give the Western Union
    payment information on where to send the above sum before the delivery
    will be registered.


    NOTE : you are not to send any penny after the first payment and you
    are also not to share your cash with any agent once the delivery is
    done.Just make sure you do not delay to fill the receiver's info, this
    is very important and you must do this within the next 48 hours cause
    we have just 2 months to get the whole money sent to whom so ever has
    complied with the massage.




    Thanks.
    Mrs. Melania Trump.


    Last edited by Spudly; 10-02-2017 at 11:06 PM. Reason: added smiley
    I feel in no way entitled to your opinion...

  14. #1814

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    I signed up.

    Make sure you give them your SIN number and VISA card security code and pin number.

    It saves them a lot of time.
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  15. #1815

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    You Sir are a True Patriot(TM) MAGA!
    I feel in no way entitled to your opinion...

  16. #1816
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    Gee, walls are catching on. I guess they are going to build one around the Eiffel tower now. Trump, snap!

  17. #1817

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    Quote Originally Posted by hello lady View Post
    Gee, walls are catching on. I guess they are going to build one around the Eiffel tower now. Trump, snap!
    At first I though this was just false news but no, it's apparently true. It's not going to be as intrusive or as butt ugly as the one Trump is proposing along the Mexican border but it ticks me off that due to terrorism some of the worlds landmarks are going to start being marred by barriers/walls/obstacles etc. just to keep chit heads from destroying them. Nothing says nice holiday photo's like an unobstructed view of a particular landmark or national treasure. Now how will these barriers etc. blend in, I'm thinking not to well.

    https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...inst-terrorism
    "The man who does not read has no advantage over the man who cannot read." –Mark Twain

  18. #1818
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gemini View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by hello lady View Post
    Gee, walls are catching on. I guess they are going to build one around the Eiffel tower now. Trump, snap!
    At first I though this was just false news but no, it's apparently true. It's not going to be as intrusive or as butt ugly as the one Trump is proposing along the Mexican border but it ticks me off that due to terrorism some of the worlds landmarks are going to start being marred by barriers/walls/obstacles etc. just to keep chit heads from destroying them. Nothing says nice holiday photo's like an unobstructed view of a particular landmark or national treasure. Now how will these barriers etc. blend in, I'm thinking not to well.

    https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...inst-terrorism
    It was on Global National last night, butt ugly is right!

  19. #1819
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    Lots of people coming across our border now too. Freezing their fingers off etc. wait till summertime they'll be flooding in. Starting to get an idea how people living along the Mexican border must feel, but that's millions and millions. Never really thought about it before. In the west ours is just open range for thousands of kms. Once word gets out how royally they get treated there may be millions coming. Another wall?
    Last edited by Drumbones; 11-02-2017 at 05:45 PM.

  20. #1820

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    Angela Merkel now wants to pay immigrants/refugees to return to their home country.
    After she fri**ed things up so badly with her open door policy and paying millions if not billions in social payments to house/feed/medicate etc all these immigrants/refugees she now is spending more tax dollars to pay them to leave. Not only did she unleash this cr*p on the German people she subjected the rest of the E U to it. What a *****. Second worse PM Germany has ever had.


    http://www.express.co.uk/news/world/...portation-bamf
    "The man who does not read has no advantage over the man who cannot read." –Mark Twain

  21. #1821

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    A decent article here...




    A look at deportation policy in Germany | Germany | DW.COM | 09.02.2017

    http://m.dw.com/en/a-look-at-deporta...any/a-37475912


    And another good read:

    The Paris attacks: a reminder of social media′s power to misinform | Science | DW.COM | 16.11.2015

    But there have also been intentional attempts at misinformation, including one example featuring Canada-based Sikh, Veerender Jubbal.


    http://m.dw.com/en/the-paris-attacks...orm/a-18853420
    Bolding was mine
    Last edited by KC; 11-02-2017 at 10:20 PM.

  22. #1822

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    Quote Originally Posted by Drumbones View Post
    Lots of people coming across our border now too. Freezing their fingers off etc. wait till summertime they'll be flooding in. Starting to get an idea how people living along the Mexican border must feel, but that's millions and millions. Never really thought about it before. In the west ours is just open range for thousands of kms. Once word gets out how royally they get treated there may be millions coming. Another wall?
    The fact that they are freezing their fingers off, indicates something about their unfamiliarity about our climate. If they were more familiar with it they would either be more prepared or wait until summer. Therefore, I doubt our seasons will change the inflow that much.

    Of course, the second very important point is that the "open range for thousands of kms" is our border with the US. The people coming across that border would have to cross a very large ocean to get to the US first or travel all the way across the US. There is a very simple reason Canada does not have the huge inflow of refugees or immigrants that Europe or the US deal with - it is called geography.

    There is a lot of fear mongering about refugees and immigrants in many places these days which is recent, but geography does not change. The same thing is true in the UK as here. Of that flood of Syrian refugees to parts of Europe, have made it to the UK? Very, very few.

    While we are not an island, we remain one of the hardest countries in the world for such people to travel to.

  23. #1823

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    Refugees fleeing the US because if they get deported back to their home country they are at a severe risk of being tortured and killed.

    They risk everything for freedom.

    When have you risked your life or even losing a finger to frostbite to see your next birthday?
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  24. #1824

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    What the Kellyann Conway 'Fatal Attraction' spoof tonight on SNL.

    http://www.mediaite.com/online/creep...-ignored-jake/

    Spine tingling...
    Last edited by Edmonton PRT; 11-02-2017 at 11:13 PM.
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  25. #1825

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    Let's make Edmonton better.

  26. #1826

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    Quote Originally Posted by Edmonton PRT View Post
    Refugees fleeing the US because if they get deported back to their home country they are at a severe risk of being tortured and killed.

    They risk everything for freedom.

    When have you risked your life or even losing a finger to frostbite to see your next birthday?
    Well mass deportations from the US have not begun yet, if they ever will. Even if it happens, the people most likely to be deported will be Mexicans - the people who came across the border to Canada were from Africa. The people coming here may be coming here more in fear or anticipation of problems in the US. It would be a sad irony to lose a finger to frostbite in fear of something that does come to pass, but fear is such a powerful and irrational emotion and seems to consume many people on all sides of issues these days. It sometimes causes people to react in a way that is not in their best interests rather than in a rational way.

  27. #1827
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    Dave, check your google earth and you will see that the 49th is probably the easiest border in the world to just saunter across. There are roads leading right up to it almost every mile, except of course in BC. With over 14 million illegal Mexicans and peoples from virtually every country in the world living illegally in the usa on top of that and...they decide they must get out and the easiest way is to walk into Canada we may double our population soon. Lol. Companies could start big time manufacturing here with all those hands.
    Last edited by Drumbones; 12-02-2017 at 02:15 AM.

  28. #1828

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    Quote Originally Posted by Drumbones View Post
    Dave, check your google earth and you will see that the 49th is probably the easiest border in the world to just saunter across. There are roads leading right up to it almost every mile, except of course in BC. With over 14 million illegal Mexicans and peoples from virtually every country in the world living illegally in the usa on top of that and...they decide they must get out and the easiest way is to walk into Canada we may double our population soon. Lol. Companies could start big time manufacturing here with all those hands.
    I think you missed my points. It is not the ease of crossing the US/Canada border, it is the distance this border is from where the immigrants or refugees come from that presents the real difficulty. As far as I know none of the people who crossed in Manitoba were Mexican, but refugees from Africa. It is a long way to travel from California or Arizona to Canada. Actually some Mexicans are leaving the US, but they are going back to Mexico not to Canada, which is closer and is where their families are.

    However, I doubt the deportations will become massive. The loss of 14 million workers would destroy the US economy.

  29. #1829

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    Alec Baldwin's Donald Trump impersonation fools Dominican newspaper
    El Nacional mistakenly publishes a photo of the actor in a blond wig above the caption: ‘Donald Trump, president of the USA’

    https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/...ican-newspaper


    LOL
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  30. #1830

    Default

    "Fact checker, fact checker" song here.
    Randy Rainbow

    Fact-checker, fact-checker, find me some facts - Home | The Sunday Edition | CBC Radio

    Click on the video:
    http://www.cbc.ca/radio/thesundayedi...acts-1.3977040

  31. #1831

    Default

    "“We don’t have a pecking order where we fight anti-Semitism first and then all other forms of discrimination second,” Goldstein explained about the Anne Frank Center’s mission. “We fight anti-Semitism with everything we’ve got, and we fight other forms of discrimination with everything we’ve got. Islamophobia is as grotesque to us as anti-Semitism. Evil is evil is evil. The ban on Muslim refugees is evil. The wall that targets Mexican immigrants is evil. The Jewish principle of Tikkun Olam requires us to view all prejudice as evil.”"
    “There’s anti-Semitism in the White House”: What made the Anne Frank Center get political on Twitter

    http://www.salon.com/2017/02/11/ther...f4OIM.facebook

    Meanwhile, let's not forget who the American Nazi Party and the KKK endorsed for President.
    Last edited by kkozoriz; 12-02-2017 at 01:47 PM.

  32. #1832
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    Default The Spy Revolt Against Trump Begins

    Now those concerns are causing problems much closer to home—in fact, inside the Beltway itself. Our Intelligence Community is so worried by the unprecedented problems of the Trump administration—not only do senior officials possess troubling ties to the Kremlin, there are nagging questions about basic competence regarding Team Trump—that it is beginning to withhold intelligence from a White House which our spies do not trust.
    I previously warned the Trump administration not to go to war with the nation’s spies, and here’s why. This is a risky situation, particularly since President Trump is prone to creating crises foreign and domestic with his incautious tweets. In the event of a serious international crisis of the sort which eventually befalls almost every administration, the White House will need the best intelligence possible to prevent war, possibly even nuclear war. It may not get the information it needs in that hour of crisis, and for that it has nobody to blame but itself.

    http://observer.com/2017/02/donald-trump-administration-mike-flynn-russian-embassy/
    Last edited by Glenco; 12-02-2017 at 02:42 PM.
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  33. #1833

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    Quote Originally Posted by kkozoriz View Post
    "“We don’t have a pecking order where we fight anti-Semitism first and then all other forms of discrimination second,” Goldstein explained about the Anne Frank Center’s mission. “We fight anti-Semitism with everything we’ve got, and we fight other forms of discrimination with everything we’ve got. Islamophobia is as grotesque to us as anti-Semitism. Evil is evil is evil. The ban on Muslim refugees is evil. The wall that targets Mexican immigrants is evil. The Jewish principle of Tikkun Olam requires us to view all prejudice as evil.”"
    “There’s anti-Semitism in the White House”: What made the Anne Frank Center get political on Twitter

    http://www.salon.com/2017/02/11/ther...f4OIM.facebook

    Meanwhile, let's not forget who the American Nazi Party and the KKK endorsed for President.
    There's discrimination and prejudice in the White House.

  34. #1834

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dave View Post
    ...fear is such a powerful and irrational emotion and seems to consume many people on all sides of issues these days. It sometimes causes people to react in a way that is not in their best interests rather than in a rational way.
    The fear is hardly irrational. Undocumented Mexican's are being expelled in such high numbers, that ICE won't even verify those numbers that had already been independently corroborated. Given the climate regarding Muslims, it's not too grand a leap to think that mass expulsion is on the horizon. For these people who are likely to face death if returned to their countries, the irrational move would be to wait until expulsions start happening. Their fear is well founded, and it's likely that they are well aware of the risks associated with being a refugee. It's an interesting study to see posters such as yourself try to paint them as irrational, when this is real life for these people.

  35. #1835
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    Maybe those illegals should of entered United States legally like the 100 Million immigrants who entered the country last 200 years and they would have no fears.
    live for happiness because without it everything seems ho hum

  36. #1836
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    Legal is legal and illegal is illegal. I had a good hand pulled off the job one day by immigration. He had bought a house here and everything. They locked him up, then took him to the airport. His house still sits empty and I never saw him since. A citizen of the UK. Canada has been doing this all through the years. I don't know why people now think it's so strange that the US is too.

  37. #1837

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    Americans used to be proud.

    The plaque at the base of the Statue of Liberty reads: "Give me your tired, your poor, your huddled masses yearning to breathe free, the wretched refuse of your teeming shore. Send these, the homeless, tempest-tossed to me, I lift my lamp beside the golden door!""
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  38. #1838
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    That was a long long time ago and those people already came. This is a different time, a different world, and a different set of peoples. To play by those rules in today's world would be super naive. Ask Angela Merkel. How much is she willing to pay people to leave again? $1 million would probably be a bargain. lol

  39. #1839

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    Quote Originally Posted by Edmonton PRT View Post
    Americans used to be proud.

    The plaque at the base of the Statue of Liberty reads: "Give me your tired, your poor, your huddled masses yearning to breathe free, the wretched refuse of your teeming shore. Send these, the homeless, tempest-tossed to me, I lift my lamp beside the golden door!""
    Did they ever put that to a vote?


    So much for any belief that all people can live peacefully together within any borders:

    "She is an important forerunner of the Zionist movement. She argued for the creation of a Jewish homeland thirteen years before Theodor Herzl began to use the term Zionism.[15]"

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Emma_Lazarus
    Last edited by KC; 13-02-2017 at 07:39 AM.

  40. #1840

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    Quote Originally Posted by Drumbones View Post
    Legal is legal and illegal is illegal. I had a good hand pulled off the job one day by immigration. He had bought a house here and everything. They locked him up, then took him to the airport. His house still sits empty and I never saw him since. A citizen of the UK. Canada has been doing this all through the years. I don't know why people now think it's so strange that the US is too.
    Because they are so transparently not doing it for reasons of safety but for political gain. Trump specifically called out 9/11 when he signed his Executive Order and yet the three countries where the hijackers came from are not on the banned list. They're flailing wildly, trying to appear tough and strong and just looking uncoordinated and confused. And when a judge and later a panel of judges call what they're doing illegal, they take it as a personal attack and double down.

    5 year olds are being handcuffed. Men and women who ricked their lives to work with the Americans in Iraq are being turned away. And American born NASA scientist, returning from an electric vehicle race overseas, is detained until he turns over his government issued phone and PIN so the border agents can go through it because he has an unusual name.

    Be prepared for the price of vegetable to start going up as migrants disappear. Already there are crops rotting in the fields in Alabama.

    And ISIS couldn't be happier.

  41. #1841

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    Quote Originally Posted by kkozoriz View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Drumbones View Post
    Legal is legal and illegal is illegal. I had a good hand pulled off the job one day by immigration. He had bought a house here and everything. They locked him up, then took him to the airport. His house still sits empty and I never saw him since. A citizen of the UK. Canada has been doing this all through the years. I don't know why people now think it's so strange that the US is too.
    Because they are so transparently not doing it for reasons of safety but for political gain. Trump specifically called out 9/11 when he signed his Executive Order and yet the three countries where the hijackers came from are not on the banned list. They're flailing wildly, trying to appear tough and strong and just looking uncoordinated and confused. And when a judge and later a panel of judges call what they're doing illegal, they take it as a personal attack and double down.

    5 year olds are being handcuffed. Men and women who ricked their lives to work with the Americans in Iraq are being turned away. And American born NASA scientist, returning from an electric vehicle race overseas, is detained until he turns over his government issued phone and PIN so the border agents can go through it because he has an unusual name.

    Be prepared for the price of vegetable to start going up as migrants disappear. Already there are crops rotting in the fields in Alabama.

    And ISIS couldn't be happier.
    The bottom line though is that millions upon millions have managed to get into the US over the years. So many that even after a couple amnesties the totals are again in the millions. Enough people there are illegal immigrants to populate large cities all by themselves. Even if the percentages are infinitesimally small, in absolute numbers it is indicative of something not working very well. Moreover, with e ear simmering animosity towards politicians forever promising but not delivering border enforcement everyone should have expected a knee-jerk reaction at some point in time. That's how things often work.

  42. #1842

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    Quote Originally Posted by kkozoriz View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Drumbones View Post
    Legal is legal and illegal is illegal. I had a good hand pulled off the job one day by immigration. He had bought a house here and everything. They locked him up, then took him to the airport. His house still sits empty and I never saw him since. A citizen of the UK. Canada has been doing this all through the years. I don't know why people now think it's so strange that the US is too.
    Because they are so transparently not doing it for reasons of safety but for political gain. Trump specifically called out 9/11 when he signed his Executive Order and yet the three countries where the hijackers came from are not on the banned list. They're flailing wildly, trying to appear tough and strong and just looking uncoordinated and confused. And when a judge and later a panel of judges call what they're doing illegal, they take it as a personal attack and double down.

    5 year olds are being handcuffed. Men and women who ricked their lives to work with the Americans in Iraq are being turned away. And American born NASA scientist, returning from an electric vehicle race overseas, is detained until he turns over his government issued phone and PIN so the border agents can go through it because he has an unusual name.

    Be prepared for the price of vegetable to start going up as migrants disappear. Already there are crops rotting in the fields in Alabama.

    And ISIS couldn't be happier.
    As the song goes

    The Apprentice that you've seen
    On your television screen
    Show his legislative talents at a glance.
    Should Americans pick crops? Donald says "no,
    'cause no one but a Mexican would stoop so low."
    And after all, even in Egypt, the pharaohs
    Had to import
    Hebrew braceros.


    Recorded July 1965 (edits by me)

    Read more: Tom Lehrer - George Murphy Lyrics | MetroLyrics
    Last edited by Edmonton PRT; 13-02-2017 at 08:06 AM.
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  43. #1843
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    In that case it would be a boon for mechanization.

  44. #1844

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    Right, you have a machine that can pick strawberries?

    Farms are already highly mechanized but many crops cannot be picked by machine or need gleaners to pick over the crops that the machines missed. Then there is tending of vineyards and pruning of trees. Moreover, food processing needs workers too.

    People cannot be easily be replaced and the importance of immigrants, both legal and illegal is one reason we have a low cost food supply. The other is the amount of mechanization on farms.


    http://www.21stcentech.com/agricultu...pe-disruption/

    Last edited by Edmonton PRT; 13-02-2017 at 08:18 AM.
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  45. #1845

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    Real issues


    From the 2004 satire movie, A Day Without a Mexican - Trailer




    PHOENIX — The steady stream of immigrant workers who used to line up at Tim Dunn's Arizona farm, ready to pick vegetable seed crops like black-eyed peas and garbanzo beans, has mostly dried up.

    "We just don't see people walking up, looking for jobs like they used to," he says. Now he has to pay a labor contractor to find enough people to tend his 2,200 furrowed acres under the harsh Sonoran sun near Yuma, in the southwestern corner of Arizona.


    The dwindling supply of labor available to Mr. Dunn illustrates a significant shift in migration from Mexico, which has caused illegal immigration to drop to its lowest levels.

    Even as states loudly debate new immigration restrictions – including Arizona's proposed armed, all-volunteer state militia to keep Mexicans from sneaking across the US-Mexican border – research suggests the illegal immigration has slowed.

    The migration explosion that since the 1970s had pushed millions of men, women, and children into the United States has fizzled, says Douglas Massey, a sociologist at Princeton University and codirector of the long-term, binational Mexican Migration Project. "We're at a turning point, and what unfolds in the future remains to be seen. But I think the boom is over."


    Mr. Massey's research shows that after the US recession hit, the illegal population fell from about 12 million to 11 million, where it has hovered since 2009. (About 60 percent of the illegal population is Mexican.)


    Similarly, Homeland Security estimates released in March suggest that while the number of unauthorized immigrants living in the US grew 36 percent between 2000 and 2011, from 8.5 million to 11.5 million, that growth plateaued in 2010 and 2011.


    "With no change in either direction, we're roughly at a net zero," says Massey, and adds that it's something unseen since the late 1950s.


    The 2004 movie "A Day Without a Mexican," in which the state of California grinds to a halt when Mexican laborers suddenly disappear, satirized a thesis that is now a subject of real-life debate among experts.


    What if the workers that farmers, hotels, and restaurants have relied on for decades don't come back? Will crops rot, beds stay unmade, and dirty dishes pile high in restaurants? Those sectors can't outsource labor; so will they slow, downsize, and will that create ripple effects across the already straitened US economy?


    Experts agree that illegal immigration has declined sharply in recent years and cite the overall lack of work as the main reason many Mexicans choose to stay home.


    But the big debate is how permanent the trend is. Most experts expect the flow to return once the US economy rebounds. But some say there are other factors at play that could keep Mexicans home, including more access to legal US work visas, border enforcement efforts on the US side and drug-war insecurity on the Mexican side, demographic shifts in Mexico, and growing economic incentives there.


    The shrinking labor pool already is having an impact in agricultural fields scattered throughout the US, some say. For example, a University of Georgia report projects that, when 2011 figures are tallied, the state economy will show a $391 million loss due to farm labor shortages. Georgia is one of several states that – following Arizona's footsteps – recently passed laws aimed at illegal immigration. Farmers across the country are experiencing near-term crop losses and scaling back operations, confirms Libby Whitley, president of Mid-Atlantic Solutions in Lovingston, Va. Her company handles visa applications for 600 employers who use temporary legal workers, mostly from Mexico.
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  46. #1846

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    Quote Originally Posted by Drumbones View Post
    Legal is legal and illegal is illegal.
    Yup. I don't understand how anyone can support people who purposely disobey laws. Getting angry at president Trump for enforcing laws that are in the books and have been enforced up until recently is ridiculous.

    The USA under President Trump still allows immigration, but now everyone has to follow the law, which is fair.

  47. #1847

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    Quote Originally Posted by Edmonton PRT View Post
    Right, you have a machine that can pick strawberries?

    Farms are already highly mechanized but many crops cannot be picked by machine or need gleaners to pick over the crops that the machines missed. Then there is tending of vineyards and pruning of trees. Moreover, food processing needs workers too.

    People cannot be easily be replaced and the importance of immigrants, both legal and illegal is one reason we have a low cost food supply. The other is the amount of mechanization on farms.


    http://www.21stcentech.com/agricultu...pe-disruption/

    Yeah, greed and self-interest affects everyone's perception. Like "blood diamonds" and all the other abusive activities that yield cheaper goods that everyone loves. Nonetheless, illegal immigrants might pump more and more profits into food producers pockets while proving cost savings to consumers, but they are still illegal. So while the immigration is somewhat humaine treatment of people that were so desperate that they risked everything to make their way to the US, that's not America's responsibility and inequality has always been the impact of borders and restrictions on the free flow of labour. Some people have better lives than others, because of those borders and because of differing systems of government and differing natural resources (Jared Diamond stuff).

    The general public down there seems very tired of the officials and politicians looking the other way while existing laws are blatantly ignored or are unenforceable. They need to create a different or better open and officially sanctioned system. Say a better Temporary Foreign Worker (TFW) system that offers the public an improved sense that there is oversight and governance looking after the average citizen's interests and job security. Instead, they had let things get so volatile and even sanctioned volatility by Greenspan, that the 2008/09 crisis woke up millions of Americans to how vulnerable their lives are to disruption by events seemingly unconnected to them. (The 1930s did the same.)
    Last edited by KC; 13-02-2017 at 10:37 AM.

  48. #1848
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    ^^Exactly correct. And maybe some of these corporate farms will hire immigration lawyers to do paperwork and help people to come in legally if they need them so bad instead of taking advantage of illegals and paying them $25 a day and such things that you hear about.

  49. #1849
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    Sigh food costs were higher in the 60's and 70's because in those times most families were one wage earner and families were much larger than today and supermarket workers were union making better wages . And as you see the costs dropping corresponds with the increase of 2 working homes and unions ending . Now go list day care costs from same era's
    live for happiness because without it everything seems ho hum

  50. #1850

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    Not having to pay taxes, employment insurance, and all those other pesky national interest issues often lead to falling prices.

    Then there's all the other factors that can reduce over time the prices of all kinds of things:


    Heroin, Mexico Becomes The Largest Exporter To United States Drug Addicts
    NOVEMBER 30, 2011

    excerpt:
    As the Mexican drug smuggling culture had grown while becoming more specialized with a captive audience just across the border the financial incentives only further fueled our unholy alliance. During the 1960’s period Mexico became a Major exporter of Marijuana and Heroin to the U.S. population. Efforts that were taken on our European counterparts smuggling operations only strengthened Mexico’s hand as in the early 1970 period they became the number 1 drug exporter. It was noted that in 1974 at least 75% of the U.S. Heroin Market was of Mexican
    origin.

    It was not as if the United States government had not taken notice of this problem as in 1969 Mexico grabbed the dubious distinction as being the primary distributor of illicit drugs to our country. ..."

    https://slowdecline.wordpress.com/20...-drug-addicts/


    https://slowdecline.files.wordpress....rug-price1.jpg
    Last edited by KC; 13-02-2017 at 10:58 AM.

  51. #1851

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    Quote Originally Posted by Drumbones View Post
    ^^Exactly correct. And maybe some of these corporate farms will hire immigration lawyers to do paperwork and help people to come in legally if they need them so bad instead of taking advantage of illegals and paying them $25 a day and such things that you hear about.
    Americans and Canadians won't mind paying 3x for their strawberries and such, if there's anyone to pick them at all. Out of work rustbelt folks won't mind moving to California to stoop over rows of cauliflower to make minimum wage, and go home to shacks outside Oxnard or Bakersfield that they share with another family. Their wives and daughters can bus a couple hours each way to be employed as housekeepers and nannies, their husbands and sons likewise to be janitors and busboys. It'll be good honest work. And when they see their great leader jet off to Mar A Lago for a weekend of golf at his resort, or to his gilded New York tower they'll be grateful for their chance to help Make America Great Again.

    Won't they?
    I feel in no way entitled to your opinion...

  52. #1852

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    Quote Originally Posted by Spudly View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Drumbones View Post
    ^^Exactly correct. And maybe some of these corporate farms will hire immigration lawyers to do paperwork and help people to come in legally if they need them so bad instead of taking advantage of illegals and paying them $25 a day and such things that you hear about.
    Americans and Canadians won't mind paying 3x for their strawberries and such, if there's anyone to pick them at all. Out of work rustbelt folks won't mind moving to California to stoop over rows of cauliflower to make minimum wage, and go home to shacks outside Oxnard or Bakersfield that they share with another family. Their wives and daughters can bus a couple hours each way to be employed as housekeepers and nannies, their husbands and sons likewise to be janitors and busboys. It'll be good honest work. And when they see their great leader jet off to Mar A Lago for a weekend of golf at his resort, or to his gilded New York tower they'll be grateful for their chance to help Make America Great Again.

    Won't they?
    No one likes to pay more for anything. It's always a balancing act. Look at all the environmental regulations that were introduced in the 1970s that likely pushed up prices of things. If there's enough pushback then vested interests will lobby for a backing off of law enforcement.

    Same things happen all the time. Priests and other influential community members molesting kids but not being arrested or investigated despite there being laws in place. Lots of laws aren't strictly enforced, or not enforced on on people equally, for any number of reasons. It's the push and pull of society at work. Right now the pendulum has temporarily swung the opposite direction for a bit and people want to see broad enforcement of current laws and some other method i.e. a wall) to prevent people from skirting the laws.
    Last edited by KC; 13-02-2017 at 11:51 AM.

  53. #1853

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    Two excellent books on the subject by Eric Schlosser


    Fast Food Nation

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fast_Food_Nation

    Reefer Madness (2003 book)

    Chapter 2: In the Strawberry Fields, he explores the exploitation of illegal immigrants as cheap labor, arguing that there should be better living arrangements and humane treatment of the illegal immigrants America is exploiting in the fields of California.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reefer...ss_(2003_book)
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  54. #1854

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    Trudeau and Trump meet today

    IMHO
    Trump's speech was short and shallow
    Trudeau's speech was long winded but made some pointed facts and really upstaged Trump.

    Trump just commented during the questioning that he won by a large amount on the Electoral College vote.

    Trump just can't help himself in his fragile world from bringing up things unrelated to the meeting today.
    Last edited by Edmonton PRT; 13-02-2017 at 01:37 PM.
    Advocating a better Edmonton through effective, efficient and economical transit.

  55. #1855

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    The interesting thing is that if you take away cheap labour, minimum wage will rise.

  56. #1856

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    Not necessarily But that does not mean that anyone will take up picking crops as a career path
    Advocating a better Edmonton through effective, efficient and economical transit.

  57. #1857

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    Is Trump ready to fire his national security adviser for apparently lying about contact with Russia?
    The White House has stopped defending national security adviser Michael Flynn after reports late last week said he discussed sanctions with a Russian official, something he repeatedly denied.
    https://www.thestar.com/news/world/2...th-russia.html

    Advocating a better Edmonton through effective, efficient and economical transit.

  58. #1858

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    Quote Originally Posted by KC View Post
    The interesting thing is that if you take away cheap labour, minimum wage will rise.
    As will prices, which will then cause wage pressure, to drive up prices more.

    Among this, there's the non-trivial issue of getting Americans to lower their standards enough to first uproot themselves and their families and move to these low-wage areas (because the areas can't move), and then accept toiling in fields for minimum wages and living in shacks like their farming ancestors did.

    If they are willing to Believe Him and sacrifice a generation of themselves to Make America Great Again then it could work.
    I feel in no way entitled to your opinion...

  59. #1859

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Edmonton PRT View Post
    Is Trump ready to fire his national security adviser for apparently lying about contact with Russia?
    The White House has stopped defending national security adviser Michael Flynn after reports late last week said he discussed sanctions with a Russian official, something he repeatedly denied.
    https://www.thestar.com/news/world/2...th-russia.html
    Firing anyone he's hired is an admission of his error, and Der Donald isn't inclined to admit he was wrong, so he'll have to find another way to have him moved out. Perhaps a sudden illness?
    I feel in no way entitled to your opinion...

  60. #1860

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    Sudden illness?

    Cement-shoe-itis?
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    Quote Originally Posted by Edmonton PRT View Post
    Trudeau and Trump meet today

    IMHO
    Trump's speech was short and shallow
    Trudeau's speech was long winded but made some pointed facts and really upstaged Trump.

    Trump just commented during the questioning that he won by a large amount on the Electoral College vote.

    Trump just can't help himself in his fragile world from bringing up things unrelated to the meeting today.
    Lol seen thru blinders Trudeau skirted all questions. Also people better realize real quick 75% of exports from Canada go to the states so pumping chests is pretty fn dumb why Trump made sure to point out his great weekend with Japan leader in other words don't worry Trudeau we can get those goods elsewhere. Canada relies on USA a hell of a lot more then they rely on us.
    live for happiness because without it everything seems ho hum

  62. #1862

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    Quote Originally Posted by Spudly View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by KC View Post
    The interesting thing is that if you take away cheap labour, minimum wage will rise.
    As will prices, which will then cause wage pressure, to drive up prices more.

    Among this, there's the non-trivial issue of getting Americans to lower their standards enough to first uproot themselves and their families and move to these low-wage areas (because the areas can't move), and then accept toiling in fields for minimum wages and living in shacks like their farming ancestors did.

    If they are willing to Believe Him and sacrifice a generation of themselves to Make America Great Again then it could work.
    Social supports could be reduced forcing people to seek employment further afield (no pun intended).

    I recall reading years and years ago how little in the way of social support was available in Hong Kong and so people did whatever they could to survive. That was back in the days when Hong Kong was a powerful colonial economy.

  63. #1863
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    Have not see the interview yet, 1) how many Ahh's and uMM's did JT say ? 2) Did he answer any questions in French ?

  64. #1864

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    Quote Originally Posted by buildthemhigh View Post
    Lol seen thru blinders Trudeau skirted all questions. Also people better realize real quick 75% of exports from Canada go to the states so pumping chests is pretty fn dumb why Trump made sure to point out his great weekend with Japan leader in other words don't worry Trudeau we can get those goods elsewhere. Canada relies on USA a hell of a lot more then they rely on us.
    Yeah, Japan has huge oil reserves and buying from Japan Makes America Great Again...
    Advocating a better Edmonton through effective, efficient and economical transit.

  65. #1865

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    Quote Originally Posted by Edmonton PRT View Post
    Sudden illness?

    Cement-shoe-itis?
    Something Flynn will be "encouraged" to admit himself. Anything that reflects well on Der Donald and lets him bring up random unrelated boasts again during the press conference.
    I feel in no way entitled to your opinion...

  66. #1866

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    1) lots (does it matter?)
    2) of course

  67. #1867
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    Canada was never on Trumps radar imho. Trudeau was a little long winded, but both of them knew ( like Obama and Harper ) that they need to agree to disagree. It remains to be seen if JTs carbon tax will hurt our economy..

  68. #1868
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    Quote Originally Posted by Edmonton PRT View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by buildthemhigh View Post
    Lol seen thru blinders Trudeau skirted all questions. Also people better realize real quick 75% of exports from Canada go to the states so pumping chests is pretty fn dumb why Trump made sure to point out his great weekend with Japan leader in other words don't worry Trudeau we can get those goods elsewhere. Canada relies on USA a hell of a lot more then they rely on us.
    Yeah, Japan has huge oil reserves and buying from Japan Makes America Great Again...
    Fool on PRT http://www.usatoday.com/story/money/...exas/94013292/ they don't need our Oil either. Thanks for playing I am ignorant of anything out of my bubble
    live for happiness because without it everything seems ho hum

  69. #1869

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by KC View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Spudly View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by KC View Post
    The interesting thing is that if you take away cheap labour, minimum wage will rise.
    As will prices, which will then cause wage pressure, to drive up prices more.

    Among this, there's the non-trivial issue of getting Americans to lower their standards enough to first uproot themselves and their families and move to these low-wage areas (because the areas can't move), and then accept toiling in fields for minimum wages and living in shacks like their farming ancestors did.

    If they are willing to Believe Him and sacrifice a generation of themselves to Make America Great Again then it could work.
    Social supports could be reduced forcing people to seek employment further afield (no pun intended).

    I recall reading years and years ago how little in the way of social support was available in Hong Kong and so people did whatever they could to survive. That was back in the days when Hong Kong was a powerful colonial economy.
    It could be Grapes of Wrath 2017. The trick will be to spin it to his base that it's either Yuuugely Noble, or Someone Else's Fault. He's already got his foot in their credibility door so that's a start.
    I feel in no way entitled to your opinion...

  70. #1870

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    Quote Originally Posted by buildthemhigh View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Edmonton PRT View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by buildthemhigh View Post
    Lol seen thru blinders Trudeau skirted all questions. Also people better realize real quick 75% of exports from Canada go to the states so pumping chests is pretty fn dumb why Trump made sure to point out his great weekend with Japan leader in other words don't worry Trudeau we can get those goods elsewhere. Canada relies on USA a hell of a lot more then they rely on us.
    Yeah, Japan has huge oil reserves and buying from Japan Makes America Great Again...
    Fool on PRT http://www.usatoday.com/story/money/...exas/94013292/ they don't need our Oil either. Thanks for playing I am ignorant of anything out of my bubble

    Right, The U.S. goods trade deficit with Canada was $15 billion in 2015.



    China - $579 billion traded with a $347 billion deficit.
    Canada - $545 billion traded with a $11 billion deficit.
    Mexico - $525 billion with a $63 billion deficit.
    Japan - $196 billion traded with a $69 billion deficit.
    Germany - $164 billion traded with a $65 billion deficit.

    https://www.thebalance.com/trade-def...county-3306264
    Last edited by Edmonton PRT; 13-02-2017 at 02:29 PM.
    Advocating a better Edmonton through effective, efficient and economical transit.

  71. #1871

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    Quote Originally Posted by Edmonton PRT View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by buildthemhigh View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Edmonton PRT View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by buildthemhigh View Post
    Lol seen thru blinders Trudeau skirted all questions. Also people better realize real quick 75% of exports from Canada go to the states so pumping chests is pretty fn dumb why Trump made sure to point out his great weekend with Japan leader in other words don't worry Trudeau we can get those goods elsewhere. Canada relies on USA a hell of a lot more then they rely on us.
    Yeah, Japan has huge oil reserves and buying from Japan Makes America Great Again...
    Fool on PRT http://www.usatoday.com/story/money/...exas/94013292/ they don't need our Oil either. Thanks for playing I am ignorant of anything out of my bubble

    Right, The U.S. goods trade deficit with Canada was $15 billion in 2015.



    China - $579 billion traded with a $347 billion deficit.
    Canada - $545 billion traded with a $11 billion deficit.
    Mexico - $525 billion with a $63 billion deficit.
    Japan - $196 billion traded with a $69 billion deficit.
    Germany - $164 billion traded with a $65 billion deficit.

    https://www.thebalance.com/trade-def...county-3306264
    "Canada relies on USA a hell of a lot more then they rely on us." - buildthemhigh

    Canada does well with the US, and they do well with Canada.

    However, we could survive if the free trade deal was torn up. Substantial trade with the USA would continue and since we deal largely in commodities and those commodities are desired all around the world other trade would occur and expand. Our dollar would fall and we'd be more price competitive. Maybe we'd have a depression while we adjusted but life would go on and we'd recover soon enough.

    So we'd take a big hit initially, but like Brexit, new opportunities would have to be opened up.
    Last edited by KC; 13-02-2017 at 02:40 PM.

  72. #1872

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    Well stated KC
    Advocating a better Edmonton through effective, efficient and economical transit.

  73. #1873
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    Quote Originally Posted by Edmonton PRT View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by buildthemhigh View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Edmonton PRT View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by buildthemhigh View Post
    Lol seen thru blinders Trudeau skirted all questions. Also people better realize real quick 75% of exports from Canada go to the states so pumping chests is pretty fn dumb why Trump made sure to point out his great weekend with Japan leader in other words don't worry Trudeau we can get those goods elsewhere. Canada relies on USA a hell of a lot more then they rely on us.
    Yeah, Japan has huge oil reserves and buying from Japan Makes America Great Again...
    Fool on PRT http://www.usatoday.com/story/money/...exas/94013292/ they don't need our Oil either. Thanks for playing I am ignorant of anything out of my bubble

    Right, The U.S. goods trade deficit with Canada was $15 billion in 2015.



    China - $579 billion traded with a $347 billion deficit.
    Canada - $545 billion traded with a $11 billion deficit.
    Mexico - $525 billion with a $63 billion deficit.
    Japan - $196 billion traded with a $69 billion deficit.
    Germany - $164 billion traded with a $65 billion deficit.

    https://www.thebalance.com/trade-def...county-3306264
    Let me explain this to you in laymans terms . Usa buys 75 % of our exports we buy 17% of theirs we exported 331 billion dollars worth of goods to usa imported 241 billion don't know where you're getting your numbers from . http://atlas.media.mit.edu/en/profile/country/usa/ this was 2014 so the imbalance has been huge so quit acting like they rely on us more , because farthest from the truth
    Last edited by buildthemhigh; 13-02-2017 at 02:48 PM.
    live for happiness because without it everything seems ho hum

  74. #1874
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    People really need a dose of reality compared to hyperbole like KC just spit out business around the world is tight even if our dollar drops other bigger currency manipulators with cheaper labour does us in. This is reality folks . So get ready to work for a 10 $ a day for KC plan to work lol. here is your reality US trade deficit with Canada since 2012 245 Billion dollars. So lay mans terms again don't bite the hands that feed you to virtue signal . http://www.statcan.gc.ca/tables-tabl...lec02a-eng.htm
    Last edited by buildthemhigh; 13-02-2017 at 03:01 PM.
    live for happiness because without it everything seems ho hum

  75. #1875

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by KC View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Edmonton PRT View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by buildthemhigh View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Edmonton PRT View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by buildthemhigh View Post
    Lol seen thru blinders Trudeau skirted all questions. Also people better realize real quick 75% of exports from Canada go to the states so pumping chests is pretty fn dumb why Trump made sure to point out his great weekend with Japan leader in other words don't worry Trudeau we can get those goods elsewhere. Canada relies on USA a hell of a lot more then they rely on us.
    Yeah, Japan has huge oil reserves and buying from Japan Makes America Great Again...
    Fool on PRT http://www.usatoday.com/story/money/...exas/94013292/ they don't need our Oil either. Thanks for playing I am ignorant of anything out of my bubble

    Right, The U.S. goods trade deficit with Canada was $15 billion in 2015.



    China - $579 billion traded with a $347 billion deficit.
    Canada - $545 billion traded with a $11 billion deficit.
    Mexico - $525 billion with a $63 billion deficit.
    Japan - $196 billion traded with a $69 billion deficit.
    Germany - $164 billion traded with a $65 billion deficit.

    https://www.thebalance.com/trade-def...county-3306264
    "Canada relies on USA a hell of a lot more then they rely on us." - buildthemhigh

    Canada does well with the US, and they do well with Canada.

    However, we could survive if the free trade deal was torn up. Substantial trade with the USA would continue and since we deal largely in commodities and those commodities are desired all around the world other trade would occur and expand. Our dollar would fall and we'd be more price competitive. Maybe we'd have a depression while we adjusted but life would go on and we'd recover soon enough.

    So we'd take a big hit initially, but like Brexit, new opportunities would have to be opened up.
    The big hit would likely be in parts of Canada that export goods/manufactured items to the US. I think it would hurt parts of Canada greatly, which is why our government is eager to avoid it or mitigate it as much as possible. There are several hopeful signs for Canada though - the almost balanced trade between Canada and the US is helpful as is the fact that Trump has not shown any animosity to Canada.

    I think even Trump realizes he can not antagonize everyone and it would not be in the US's interest to have a hostile neighbour to the south and then also create another hostile one to the north. He definitely does not like multi lateral trade agreements, but he may be more willing to have bilateral ones with countries he feels are not a low wage threat to the US, such as Canada, the UK and Japan.

  76. #1876

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Gemini View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Edmonton PRT View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by noodle View Post
    http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/...ticle33948451/

    As Prime Minister Justin Trudeau prepares for his first encounter with Donald Trump at the White House, a new poll conducted for The Globe and Mail shows Canadians expect him to stand up to the President’s aggressive America-first strategy even if it leads to a trade war with Canada’s biggest trading partner.
    Well if it is a fight they want, Justin is prepared...



    Just have to have enough reach to get over Trump's belly...
    Trudeau the 3 pound weakling.
    Well today, the three pound weakling came more prepared and 'schooled' Trump on NAFTA and bilateral relations. Even conservatives applaud Trudeau on how he handled Trump.

    First round goes to Trudeau.
    Advocating a better Edmonton through effective, efficient and economical transit.

  77. #1877

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    I am so glad that Justin didn't say anything stupid.

  78. #1878

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    I guess that would best compliment that we could expect from you.
    Last edited by Edmonton PRT; 13-02-2017 at 05:26 PM.
    Advocating a better Edmonton through effective, efficient and economical transit.

  79. #1879

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    What does that mean?

    Justin is a terrible speaker, and puts his foot in his mouth repeatedly when he talks to Canadians. I have little confidence in him, and I was a little afraid that he would say something that would harm our relations with the USA. I am glad he didn't. What's wrong with that?

  80. #1880

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    Even the leader of the opposition complimented Trudeau

    Opposition Conservative leader Rona Ambrose said that discipline is a smart move given how paramount relations with the US are to Canada.
    "This is a delicate situation here. I don't think it would help anyone in this country if the prime minister went to the US and started a fight," she told reporters in Ottawa.
    http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-38960968
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  81. #1881

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by buildthemhigh View Post
    People really need a dose of reality compared to hyperbole like KC just spit out business around the world is tight even if our dollar drops other bigger currency manipulators with cheaper labour does us in. This is reality folks . So get ready to work for a 10 $ a day for KC plan to work lol. here is your reality US trade deficit with Canada since 2012 245 Billion dollars. So lay mans terms again don't bite the hands that feed you to virtue signal . http://www.statcan.gc.ca/tables-tabl...lec02a-eng.htm
    No need to live in fear. This is just trade and economics. Now if it was war, then there'd be more reason to be concerned but if you lose your job, you get up and go out and find something else to do. I've been there and done that just like millions of others. My parents and family all went through the Great Depression and they survived.

    Despite the dire warnings about Brexit the UK will adjust. Canada will to. Moreover, we aren't like Greece with a common currency noose around our necks, our currency can drop to make us more competitive. That or we get wage deflation in our exporting and associated sectors. We've done that before when commodity prices have tumbled. Again, it's nothing new for us.

    Additionally businesses aren't stupid. They will adjust to any reduced sales to the US by pursuing other opportunities.
    Last edited by KC; 13-02-2017 at 08:02 PM.

  82. #1882

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    I was expecting Tater Tot to come back to Canada sporting a giant wedgie. I guess if a mediocre meeting is what was wanted that's what was had. The usually Who Shot John. Not very interesting if you ask me. Hardly earth shattering.



    https://www.thestar.com/news/world/2...ashington.html
    "The man who does not read has no advantage over the man who cannot read." –Mark Twain

  83. #1883
    I'd rather C2E than work!
    Join Date
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    Edmonton area.
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    Default

    A cautious and cordial approach was warranted and fulfilled. Great job JT!

  84. #1884

    Default

    Kellyanne Conway's interview tricks, explained
    Vox 144,678 views

    "Published on Feb 13, 2017Kellyanne Conway has a supernatural ability to derail any interview that paints Donald Trump in a negative light. How does she do it"

    https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=C-7fzHy3aG0

  85. #1885
    C2E Hard Core Contributor
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gemini View Post
    I was expecting Tater Tot to come back to Canada sporting a giant wedgie. I guess if a mediocre meeting is what was wanted that's what was had. The usually Who Shot John. Not very interesting if you ask me. Hardly earth shattering.



    https://www.thestar.com/news/world/2...ashington.html
    Nothing on climate change then.

  86. #1886

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by hello lady View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Gemini View Post
    I was expecting Tater Tot to come back to Canada sporting a giant wedgie. I guess if a mediocre meeting is what was wanted that's what was had. The usually Who Shot John. Not very interesting if you ask me. Hardly earth shattering.



    https://www.thestar.com/news/world/2...ashington.html
    Nothing on climate change then.
    No need to. Trump already had that 'dam'ned problem out west to deal with.



    https://d3i6fh83elv35t.cloudfront.ne...1-1024x683.jpg
    Last edited by KC; 13-02-2017 at 09:14 PM.

  87. #1887

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    Flynn resigned. Maybe this explains Trump's friendly demeanour to Trudeau.



    "Misled"

    No, no, no. Just "inadvertently" presented alternative facts.

    http://www.slate.com/blogs/the_slate...ail_after.html


    NONSENSE! Trump National Security Advisor General Mike Flynn is No Criminal. Period.
    by Philip Holloway | 9:03 pm, February 13th, 2017

    http://lawnewz.com/high-profile/nons...iminal-period/




    The element of surprise seems to have hit the White House. How a top official could resign without warning though, seems incredibly reckless. What about national security.


    "However, Monday did see the White House supporting Flynn, including assurances that he still enjoys “the full confidence of President Trump” from Kellyanne Conway. Jennifer Griffin of Fox News quoted the White House denouncing rumors that Flynn would be fired or resign by the end of the week as “wrong,” “gossip,” and “palace intrigue.” This response also seems to question the word of yet another anonymous official in the White House who said that Flynn apologized to Vice President Mike Pence by telephone for misleading him."

    http://www.breitbart.com/national-se...michael-flynn/
    Last edited by KC; 13-02-2017 at 10:43 PM.

  88. #1888

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    Also interesting:

    FEB. 11 2017 11:53 AM
    Russia Reportedly Considering Handing Over Edward Snowden as “Gift” to Trump
    By Elliot Hannon

    http://www.slate.com/blogs/the_slate...rump_gift.html

  89. #1889

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Spudly View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Edmonton PRT View Post
    Is Trump ready to fire his national security adviser for apparently lying about contact with Russia?
    The White House has stopped defending national security adviser Michael Flynn after reports late last week said he discussed sanctions with a Russian official, something he repeatedly denied.
    https://www.thestar.com/news/world/2...th-russia.html
    Firing anyone he's hired is an admission of his error, and Der Donald isn't inclined to admit he was wrong, so he'll have to find another way to have him moved out. Perhaps a sudden illness?
    Flynn resigning works too, with an Oopsy, My Bad.

    http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/2...ians/97878198/
    I feel in no way entitled to your opinion...

  90. #1890

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Edmonton PRT View Post
    Even the leader of the opposition complimented Trudeau

    Opposition Conservative leader Rona Ambrose said that discipline is a smart move given how paramount relations with the US are to Canada.
    "This is a delicate situation here. I don't think it would help anyone in this country if the prime minister went to the US and started a fight," she told reporters in Ottawa.
    http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-38960968

    Where's the compliment?

  91. #1891

    Default

    Yeah, this fawning over Trudeau because he met with Trump is OTT. It comes across as patronizing. Now Justin, be a good boy and eat your sprouts and when you come back to Canada we'll treat you like a long lost war hero. Pfft...........
    "The man who does not read has no advantage over the man who cannot read." –Mark Twain

  92. #1892

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by hello lady View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Gemini View Post
    I was expecting Tater Tot to come back to Canada sporting a giant wedgie. I guess if a mediocre meeting is what was wanted that's what was had. The usually Who Shot John. Not very interesting if you ask me. Hardly earth shattering.



    https://www.thestar.com/news/world/2...ashington.html
    Nothing on climate change then.
    No, just a meet and greet, smile for the camera' s, I'm a pretty boy type meeting. Although to hear some people talk you would think it was the second coming of Christ.
    "The man who does not read has no advantage over the man who cannot read." –Mark Twain

  93. #1893
    C2E Hard Core Contributor
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Gemini View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by hello lady View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Gemini View Post
    I was expecting Tater Tot to come back to Canada sporting a giant wedgie. I guess if a mediocre meeting is what was wanted that's what was had. The usually Who Shot John. Not very interesting if you ask me. Hardly earth shattering.



    https://www.thestar.com/news/world/2...ashington.html
    Nothing on climate change then.
    No, just a meet and greet, smile for the camera' s, I'm a pretty boy type meeting. Although to hear some people talk you would think it was the second coming of Christ.

    It was very vanilla...Shrug,

  94. #1894

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    Justin Trudeau's handshake with Donald Trump the 'biggest display of dominance in the history of Canada'
    Watch | Trudeau meets Trump at the White House



    00:33

    LIVE
    m
    Adam Boult Chris Graham
    14 FEBRUARY 2017 • 12:23AM
    No longer are diplomatic power struggles between nations played out in intense negotiations and high stakes summits. Instead, it's all in the handshake.

    Donald Trump had left Shinzo Abe, the Japanese prime minister, reeling after a 19 second handshake last week in the White House.

    Before that, the US president had grasped Theresa May's hand in an act that was splashed across the front pages as a sign of the "special relationship"...
    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017...rumps-awkward/
    Let's make Edmonton better.

  95. #1895

    Default




    Ivanka TrumpVerified account
    ‏@IvankaTrump

    Follow
    More
    A great discussion with two world leaders about the importance of women having a seat at the table! ��������

    RETWEETS
    10,277
    LIKES
    45,844
    Elizabeth MardanySusan B AdamsGhetty RevlettKathy MarcheseHerb TabinElla GussPhil Hall LUFC.June ChamberlinFrank Altadonna
    2:36 PM - 13 Feb 2017
    5,732 replies 10,277 retweets 45,844 likes
    Reply 5.7K Retweet 10K
    Like 46K
    https://twitter.com/IvankaTrump/stat...rc=twsrc%5Etfw




    5:53pm
    Ivanka Trump opens roundtable of women in business
    At the start of the White House meeting with the US and Canadian leaders, as well as business executives from both countries, Mr Trump suggested that his daughter speak first. She is seated next to Mr Trudeau, and took her most active role yet in a meeting with a foreign leader.
    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017...donald-trump1/
    Let's make Edmonton better.

  96. #1896
    C2E Hard Core Contributor
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    Great photo of Ivanka.

  97. #1897

    Default

    Trump turns Mar-a-Lago Club terrace into open-air situation room
    https://www.washingtonpost.com/polit...=.868a11c4eb1b
    By David A. Fahrenthold and Karen DeYoung February 13 at 12:19 PM

    It was Saturday night, and Palm Beach’s tony Mar-a-Lago Club was packed. There was a wedding reception in the ballroom. There was a full house for dinner on the terrace.

    And at one table on the terrace, there was the president and the leader of a major U.S. ally, hashing out a national security problem in the open air.

    “Someone opened up a laptop, and at the table . . . a group of Japanese people stood around the prime minister and Donald, and they were all looking at the laptop,” said Jay Weitzman, a member of President Trump’s Mar-a-Lago Club and founder of the Pennsylvania-based parking management company Park America. He was sitting three tables away from Trump and Japanese Prime Minister Shinzo Abe on Saturday evening.

    “Whoa,” Weitzman remembered thinking. “What’s going on?”

    “Turns out, it was a missile launch,” he said Monday.

    As Weitzman and other patrons watched Saturday evening, Trump and Abe remained at the table and discussed their response to a ballistic missile test by North Korea. While waiters came and went — and while one club member snapped photos — the two leaders reviewed documents by the light of an aide’s cellphone.

    That strange scene — in which Trump turned his table into an al fresco situation room — astounded White House veterans, who were used to presidents retiring to private, secured settings to hash out such an event.


    Trump became president, in part, because of Democrat Hillary Clinton’s neglect of information security. During the 2016 campaign, Trump repeatedly called for Clinton to be jailed — and his crowds at rallies often chanted “Lock her up!” — for her use of a private email server to handle government business while she was secretary of state.

    Now, Trump is drawing fire from Democrats for his own seemingly loose attitude toward information security. He has continued to use an insecure cellphone, according to the New York Times. He may have left a key to classified information on his desk while visitors were in the Oval Office, according to a tweet from a Democratic senator.
    Advocating a better Edmonton through effective, efficient and economical transit.

  98. #1898

    Default

    Paul Ryan states that Trump demanded Flynn's resignation
    Advocating a better Edmonton through effective, efficient and economical transit.

  99. #1899

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Edmonton PRT View Post
    Trump turns Mar-a-Lago Club terrace into open-air situation room
    https://www.washingtonpost.com/polit...=.868a11c4eb1b
    By David A. Fahrenthold and Karen DeYoung February 13 at 12:19 PM

    It was Saturday night, and Palm Beach’s tony Mar-a-Lago Club was packed. There was a wedding reception in the ballroom. There was a full house for dinner on the terrace.

    And at one table on the terrace, there was the president and the leader of a major U.S. ally, hashing out a national security problem in the open air.

    “Someone opened up a laptop, and at the table . . . a group of Japanese people stood around the prime minister and Donald, and they were all looking at the laptop,” said Jay Weitzman, a member of President Trump’s Mar-a-Lago Club and founder of the Pennsylvania-based parking management company Park America. He was sitting three tables away from Trump and Japanese Prime Minister Shinzo Abe on Saturday evening.

    “Whoa,” Weitzman remembered thinking. “What’s going on?”

    “Turns out, it was a missile launch,” he said Monday.

    As Weitzman and other patrons watched Saturday evening, Trump and Abe remained at the table and discussed their response to a ballistic missile test by North Korea. While waiters came and went — and while one club member snapped photos — the two leaders reviewed documents by the light of an aide’s cellphone.

    That strange scene — in which Trump turned his table into an al fresco situation room — astounded White House veterans, who were used to presidents retiring to private, secured settings to hash out such an event.


    Trump became president, in part, because of Democrat Hillary Clinton’s neglect of information security. During the 2016 campaign, Trump repeatedly called for Clinton to be jailed — and his crowds at rallies often chanted “Lock her up!” — for her use of a private email server to handle government business while she was secretary of state.

    Now, Trump is drawing fire from Democrats for his own seemingly loose attitude toward information security. He has continued to use an insecure cellphone, according to the New York Times. He may have left a key to classified information on his desk while visitors were in the Oval Office, according to a tweet from a Democratic senator.
    I wonder though, if the "secured settings" really are secure or if they are more like known, compromised targets for some other country's intelligence agency.

  100. #1900

    Default

    ^it makes sense this time, Japan is heavily invested in North Korean issues, so its logical to share news with them.

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