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Thread: Would you use Uber here?

  1. #101
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    They're going to park their car over there. You're going to park your car over here. Get it?

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    Journal did a feature on Uber on weekend in insight section.

    http://www.edmontonjournal.com/What+...273/story.html


    One comment I read that a driver "was completely surprised" after driving for several days then finding out that his insurer would have not covered an accident as he did not report, did not tell insurer that he was driving commercially and did not up his coverage. He stated he was not aware of any of this and yet was driving for Uber.

    Next, the woman driver in article seems like a nice lady but seems entirely in the dark about potential dangers. In fact whens the last time you ever saw a female cab driver, ever? Really I rarely have and for obvious reasons. Cab companies would warn prospective female drivers of the dangers. Uber? forget about it.
    Despite dangers to Uber drivers being far more pronounced as they don't even have partition shields. Don't have an emergency light, etc.

    Anybody think that Uber ever lets prospective drivers know that this is one of the most dangerous professions on earth?

    Yeah I don't think they do either.
    Last edited by Replacement; 18-01-2015 at 01:44 PM.
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  3. #103

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    Gee, why would Uber think about the safer of women?

    According to BuzzFeed News, the Uber promotion in Lyon, France, was in partnership with an app called “Avions de chasse,” which loosely translates into “fighter jets” but also doubles as a colloquialism for “sexy girls.” The app itself doesn’t appear to do much, other than send photos of attractive women to the user on a daily basis. (What, French dudes can’t figure out how to use Instagram?)

    As part of the partnership with Avions de chasse, Uber riders were able to enter the code UBERAVIONS to get a 20-minute ride with one of Avions de chasse’s models. (Why 20 minutes? Is it a sex joke? Your guess is as good as mine, but a 20-minute limit is frustrating if you’re trying to go farther than a couple miles in the city.) There was also apparently a video advertising the promotion, which featured close-up shots of young female drivers’ cleavage.

    http://www.dailydot.com/business/uber-france-sexism/

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    Replacement, are you seriously trying to say women shouldn't be cab or Uber drivers? That it's 'too dangerous' for women?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Channing View Post
    Replacement, are you seriously trying to say women shouldn't be cab or Uber drivers? That it's 'too dangerous' for women?
    Given that its the case why wouldn't I say that. Cab driving is the most dangerous legal occupation for males. You think it wouldn't be as dangerous or even more dangerous for females?

    Do I have produce the list of murdered Cab Drivers in Canada yet again? This is a notoriously dangerous profession and with it being even more dangerous to pursue in a boozing boomtown.

    A lady driver could make more working in any restaurant in the city earning tips in a safe and monitored environment. Taking huge non taxable $ home each shift. Any place in the city is begging for waitresses.

    As a female why take the risk entering into the highest risk legal profession?
    Last edited by Replacement; 18-01-2015 at 03:06 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Replacement View Post
    Given that its the case why wouldn't I say that.
    Because it's super sexist.

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    And yet women work jobs where they are required to be scantily dressed and flirt with the customers. And I'm not talking about strip bars here. That's dangerous also.

    Eve

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    "Men never do evil so completely and cheerfully as when they do it from religious conviction" - Blaise Pascal

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    Quote Originally Posted by Channing View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Replacement View Post
    Given that its the case why wouldn't I say that.
    Because it's super sexist.
    You can't be serious. There was nothing sexist about that except whatever you decided to read into it.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Replacement View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Channing View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Replacement View Post
    Given that its the case why wouldn't I say that.
    Because it's super sexist.
    You can't be serious. There was nothing sexist about that except whatever you decided to read into it.
    yeah okay

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    Quote Originally Posted by Channing View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Replacement View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Channing View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Replacement View Post
    Given that its the case why wouldn't I say that.
    Because it's super sexist.
    You can't be serious. There was nothing sexist about that except whatever you decided to read into it.
    yeah okay

    You're the one flinging unsubstantiated sexist accusation. Another option is not doing that or admitting that you have no grounds in which to make that accusation.
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    How about you google the definition of sexism. Or wait, let me post it for you. From wikipedia:

    Sexism or gender discrimination is prejudice or discrimination based on a person's sex or gender.[1] Sexist attitudes may stem from traditional stereotypes of gender roles,[2][3] and may include the belief that a person of one sex is intrinsically superior to a person of the other.[4] Extreme sexism may foster sexual harassment, rape and other forms of sexual violence.[5]

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    Quote Originally Posted by Channing View Post
    How about you google the definition of sexism. Or wait, let me post it for you. From wikipedia:

    Sexism or gender discrimination is prejudice or discrimination based on a person's sex or gender.[1] Sexist attitudes may stem from traditional stereotypes of gender roles,[2][3] and may include the belief that a person of one sex is intrinsically superior to a person of the other.[4] Extreme sexism may foster sexual harassment, rape and other forms of sexual violence.[5]
    In what way did I engage in any of that?

    Still waiting.

    That wasn't the purpose or intent whatsoever. In the journal article(print issue had a more complete story) I cited the women was saying that she had been looking for jobs and said she couldn't find any and took an Uber job instead as a fall back option That is the ONLY reason I mentioned that she could have had a waitress job instead. Nice of you to assume the worst re my position.
    You read in any sexist intent there.
    Last edited by Replacement; 18-01-2015 at 08:07 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Replacement View Post
    Next, the woman driver in article seems like a nice lady but seems entirely in the dark about potential dangers. In fact whens the last time you ever saw a female cab driver, ever? Really I rarely have and for obvious reasons. Cab companies would warn prospective female drivers of the dangers. Uber? forget about it. .
    All of this right here.

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    Seriously, these statements:

    A lady driver could make more working in any restaurant in the city earning tips in a safe and monitored environment. Taking huge non taxable $ home each shift. Any place in the city is begging for waitresses.

    As a female why take the risk entering into the highest risk legal profession?
    Adding gender into this is just sexism. Change 'lady' or 'female' to 'male' and the same thing is true or no?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Channing View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Replacement View Post
    Next, the woman driver in article seems like a nice lady but seems entirely in the dark about potential dangers. In fact whens the last time you ever saw a female cab driver, ever? Really I rarely have and for obvious reasons. Cab companies would warn prospective female drivers of the dangers. Uber? forget about it. .
    All of this right here.
    Maybe humor me and clarify what part is sexist. Dangers exists for all cab drivers but danger through sexual abuse or misogynist abuse is an added danger for female cab drivers. Indeed theres been cases of female cab drivers being killed as an adjunct to rape or misogyny(instances that have involved horrific hate multiple stabbings that indicated rage)

    I suppose now you're going to say its sexist to suggest females may be at greater risk of sexual abuse or hateful targeting then men.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Channing View Post
    Seriously, these statements:

    A lady driver could make more working in any restaurant in the city earning tips in a safe and monitored environment. Taking huge non taxable $ home each shift. Any place in the city is begging for waitresses.

    As a female why take the risk entering into the highest risk legal profession?
    Adding gender into this is just sexism. Change 'lady' or 'female' to 'male' and the same thing is true or no?
    Again in the Journal print edition it stated the lady was unemployed (I guess you also consider lady a sexist term) and that she was having trouble finding work and looking for a job. I simply suggested that theres other safer jobs out there. What a terrible thing to suggest...

    Maybe look for your witchunt somewhere else. Oh wait, I said with and not warlock....

    string me up
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    Quote Originally Posted by Replacement View Post
    I suppose now you're going to say its sexist to suggest females may be at greater risk of sexual abuse or hateful targeting then men.
    None of that is sexist. That's fact.

    But you shouldn't get to decide what another person deems as an activity that they should or should not do, based on their gender.

    And for you, as a man ('m making an assumption here), to decide that a women shouldn't get to do 'risky' work, is just patriarchal behavior, and sexism.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Replacement View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Channing View Post
    Seriously, these statements:

    A lady driver could make more working in any restaurant in the city earning tips in a safe and monitored environment. Taking huge non taxable $ home each shift. Any place in the city is begging for waitresses.

    As a female why take the risk entering into the highest risk legal profession?
    Adding gender into this is just sexism. Change 'lady' or 'female' to 'male' and the same thing is true or no?
    Again in the Journal print edition it stated the lady was unemployed (I guess you also consider lady a sexist term) and that she was having trouble finding work and looking for a job. I simply suggested that theres other safer jobs out there. What a terrible thing to suggest...

    Maybe look for your witchunt somewhere else. Oh wait, I said and not warlock...

    string me up
    No it's terrible to suggest that as a women that it's not an acceptable job, but you never answered if it was okay as a man.

    But I see your answer.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Channing View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Replacement View Post
    I suppose now you're going to say its sexist to suggest females may be at greater risk of sexual abuse or hateful targeting then men.
    None of that is sexist. That's fact.

    But you shouldn't get to decide what another person deems as an activity that they should or should not do, based on their gender.

    And for you, as a man ('m making an assumption here), to decide that a women shouldn't get to do 'risky' work, is just patriarchal behavior, and sexism.
    In what way am I deciding for another?

    Really I'm at a loss here with your continued misdirection. You just admitted in your first sentence that it wasn't sexist for me to consider the danger factors involved which was all that I was doing.

    Also keep in mind that my stated consistent theme in the thread is that cab driving is inherently dangerous for anybody. I would counsel anybody not to do this job. But Women would be exposed to greater risks as already covered.
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    Yes, if a woman has model good looks, she will get the types of jobs with great tips that you're talking about. Not so much if she does not have model good looks. And it really isn't up to you to decide what risks are acceptable for "young ladies".

    I encountered much the same rhetoric when I was studying Engineering in 1972. "The work is too dangerous for fragile young women and besides we don't have proper washroom facilities.".

    Yes, it's sexist.

    I've taken several cab rides in Alberta (more in Calgary than in Edmonton), and I've also noticed that the demographic range is very limited among cabdrivers. That may be more relevant than women not choosing cab driving as a profession.

    Eve

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    Quote Originally Posted by Channing View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Replacement View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Channing View Post
    Seriously, these statements:

    A lady driver could make more working in any restaurant in the city earning tips in a safe and monitored environment. Taking huge non taxable $ home each shift. Any place in the city is begging for waitresses.

    As a female why take the risk entering into the highest risk legal profession?
    Adding gender into this is just sexism. Change 'lady' or 'female' to 'male' and the same thing is true or no?
    Again in the Journal print edition it stated the lady was unemployed (I guess you also consider lady a sexist term) and that she was having trouble finding work and looking for a job. I simply suggested that theres other safer jobs out there. What a terrible thing to suggest...

    Maybe look for your witchunt somewhere else. Oh wait, I said and not warlock...

    string me up
    No it's terrible to suggest that as a women that it's not an acceptable job, but you never answered if it was okay as a man.

    But I see your answer.
    I don't view cab driving OK for ANYBODY which is patently obvious if one notes that I've cited a link (3 times) that lists the many cab driver murders in Canada. Or that I've questioned throughout why anybody would want to take on the most dangerous legal occupation that exists.

    Again I would counsel anybody not to do this job and not to engage in its risks.

    Trouble is Uber has very limited interface in screeing, application, orientation, etc. None of the risks, dangers, problems are elucidated. Cab companies on the other hand have full orientation, 3 day specific cab training preparing people for the job.
    Last edited by Replacement; 18-01-2015 at 08:28 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Replacement View Post
    I don't view cab driving OK for ANYBODY which is patently obvious if one notes that I've cited a link (3 times) that lists the many cab driver murders in Canada.

    Again I would counsel anybody not to do this job and not to engage in its risks.
    Then don't gender your posts, and you won't be being sexist.

    This is my last reply to you on this.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Channing View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Replacement View Post
    I don't view cab driving OK for ANYBODY which is patently obvious if one notes that I've cited a link (3 times) that lists the many cab driver murders in Canada.

    Again I would counsel anybody not to do this job and not to engage in its risks.
    Then don't gender your posts, and you won't be being sexist.

    This is my last reply to you on this.
    I wasn't being sexist. You decided to make that baseless accusation. That's your behavior, not mine.

    Done as well.
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    Quote Originally Posted by EveB View Post
    Yes, if a woman has model good looks, she will get the types of jobs with great tips that you're talking about. Not so much if she does not have model good looks. And it really isn't up to you to decide what risks are acceptable for "young ladies".

    I encountered much the same rhetoric when I was studying Engineering in 1972. "The work is too dangerous for fragile young women and besides we don't have proper washroom facilities.".

    Yes, it's sexist.

    I've taken several cab rides in Alberta (more in Calgary than in Edmonton), and I've also noticed that the demographic range is very limited among cabdrivers. That may be more relevant than women not choosing cab driving as a profession.

    Eve
    If theres any sexist agenda to be found re: Uber its in the blatant sexist advertising in France which myself and another poster linked. One would think that would stir up more concern given that was abject marginalization of females.

    But not one concern echoed about that.
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    OK, I get it. I'm at fault too. Yes, I saw the French ad, it was taken down quickly.

    Eve

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    Quote Originally Posted by EveB View Post
    OK, I get it. I'm at fault too. Yes, I saw the French ad, it was taken down quickly.

    Eve
    Nobodies at fault. Nobody needed to be pointing fingers stating posters comments were sexist either.

    Just seems to me that any claim about sexism in the thread topic would have naturally been in relation to the uber advertising which I found to be blatantly offensive enough to cite it. Which nobody like Channing even commented on.

    Channing did a patented assumptive drive by for which this board is famous and you piled on. For whatever reason.
    Last edited by Replacement; 18-01-2015 at 10:02 PM.
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    You said that women should not be cabdrivers. How do you define sexism?

    Eve

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    Quote Originally Posted by EveB View Post
    You said that women should not be cabdrivers. How do you define sexism?

    Eve
    Don't put misleading words in my mouth. That is not what was stated.

    In the context of my statement it was implicitly made clear my concerns were related to the danger of the occupation, of the extra dangers that women would be exposed to in the position. Which is why I took the time and effort to state my position clearly from the outset.

    Uber driving is a solo activity that afford ZERO protection. Not even a partition between fare and driver.

    My comments were clear. Indelibly by the time you entered the thread with your rhetoric.

    It was clear all along my concern was regarding the danger to the driver. That was stated in my first post on that theme.

    Upon more careful reading, and you can review, theres no reason to call me out on sexism for anything I've stated.

    Although I am by now offended by empty accusation and suggestion.

    As you've demonstrated you would be too on the board if this was directed your way.

    I don't take kindly, at all, to unsubstantiated suggestions that I am engaging in sexist commentary.

    Perhaps its inappropriate to willfully malign other posters with such blanket, and uncalled for accusation.
    Last edited by Replacement; 18-01-2015 at 10:22 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Replacement View Post
    Channing did a patented assumptive drive by for which this board is famous and you piled on. For whatever reason.
    I didn't assume anything other than your own gender. The rest you wrote. Your gendered posts about this not being a career for women is sexist.

    It sucks to be called out, I get it. But look at what you said, understand why it's sexist, and learn a bit. Seriously, I'm not even asking you to apologize. But continuing to try to rationalize it and defend yourself isn't helping.
    Last edited by Channing; 18-01-2015 at 11:58 PM. Reason: removed a remark

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    Quote Originally Posted by Channing View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Replacement View Post
    Channing did a patented assumptive drive by for which this board is famous and you piled on. For whatever reason.
    I didn't assume anything other than your own gender. The rest you wrote. Your gendered posts about this not being a career for women is sexist. This isn't the first time you've been sexist on the board either.

    It sucks to be called out, I get it. But look at what you said, understand why it's sexist, and learn a bit. Seriously, I'm not even asking you to apologize. But continuing to try to rationalize it and defend yourself isn't helping.
    Oh wait what?

    I wonder if this is as presumptive and specious as what you're calling me out for in this thread.

    More to the point this is about conduct and each of us deciding what nature of board we want this to be.

    Most visitors to this board are lurkers by a vast majority and stay that way. More of a proportion of lurkers than I've ever noted before Largely due to the unpleasantness and nature of driveby that you exhibited in this thread, which you were not even participating in to that point.

    You can look at your own behavior in this, or not. I'm not holding my breath here.

    edit to edit. lol. You presumptively suggest that I'm a sexist , state that I've exhibited that before, you continue to have no claim or substantiation for either, then state "I'm not even expecting you to apologize"

    wow
    Last edited by Replacement; 19-01-2015 at 12:05 AM.
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    ^Sorry I edited that out before you posted. I shouldn't have added that piece. It didn't add to my point.

    edit: but it wasn't why I brought it up this time. I'm gonna call out sexism when I see it sometimes. No matter who.
    Last edited by Channing; 19-01-2015 at 12:02 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Channing View Post
    ^Sorry I edited that out before you posted. I shouldn't have added that piece. It didn't add to my point.

    edit: but it wasn't why I brought it up this time. I'm gonna call out sexism when I see it sometimes. No matter who.
    About time you stated you were sorry.

    I'll be generous and apply that to your entire action here in the thread given that you've also admitted to making false claims of alleged previous behavior that are unsubstantiated and that you shouldn't have made.

    I agree.

    Theres no reason for this nature of exchange.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Replacement View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Channing View Post
    ^Sorry I edited that out before you posted. I shouldn't have added that piece. It didn't add to my point.

    edit: but it wasn't why I brought it up this time. I'm gonna call out sexism when I see it sometimes. No matter who.
    About time you stated you were sorry.

    I'll be generous and apply that to your entire action here in the thread given that you've also admitted to making false claims of alleged previous behavior that are unsubstantiated and that you shouldn't have made.

    I agree.

    Theres no reason for this nature of exchange.
    Oh my.

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    Uber’s main goal is not to have easy access for vehicles, their main goal is to make money for their shareholders. - Michael Oshry
    Umm Michael last time I checked most of the taxi companies are private companies who's main goal is to make money as well. ... Duh.

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    Quote Originally Posted by EveB View Post
    OK, I get it. I'm at fault too. Yes, I saw the French ad, it was taken down quickly.

    Eve
    But it wasn't just an ad, it was a promotion with a model agency. You could specifically request one of the models as your driver. What sort of management would come up with something like that and use close up shots of their cleavage in the promo?

    Would they do something similar with male drivers and focus on their crotch?

    A bad idea all around and quite reflective of the corporate mind set at Uber. Check out some of the horror stories. The company management needs a cleaning right from the top. Imagine the worst rich douchebags you see at a high end bar running a company.

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    So, ok, kkozoriz, what do you want of me? The world is full of that sort of promotion, I don't have time to react to it all.

    Eve

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    Quote Originally Posted by EveB View Post
    So, ok, kkozoriz, what do you want of me? The world is full of that sort of promotion, I don't have time to react to it all.

    Eve
    You did have enough time to suggest I was sexist. Which was specious.

    just saying.

    Nobody is expecting anybody to be up on anything. Its a messageboard discussion forum. But I think we could start limiting derisive comments made to each other on what is a community based civic board.

    All that said I'm fine with moving on.
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  39. #139

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    Of course it is Eve, that doesn't make it right. This is in connection to such a promotion being used by Uber. It's just one more piece of information that shows their corporate values, right up there with all the other shortcomings that have been uncovered.

    Can driving, which is essentially is, is a dangerous profession. Adding a sexual element to it helps make it more so, especially when someone can specifically request one of the models. Imagine how a cab company would react if someone called for a can and requested a 20 something, attractive, busty blond for a driver. Don't you think that might set off some alarm bells?

  40. #140
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    My point wasn't that it wasn't silly and wrong. My point is that it's the sort of thing that is so common that I'm almost weary of it. You know there are services (I believe I read about a branch moving to Alberta) of an agency that will rent out women to clean you house or apartment while they're in their skivvies? Most nightclubs (some highly regarded at C2E) hire women whose job it is to be eye candy and flirt with the customers.

    I'm not a supporter of Uber. I don't usually use taxis. I rarely ride in private cars because I really do prefer transit. I'm curious about how it is going to play out from the point of using contractors vs employees. But it's mostly private curiosity.

    Yes, driving is an essentially a dangerous profession. So is providing homecare (there have been homicides there), so is healthcare (many assaults have been recorded). But it is a legitimate profession. Perhaps when freelancers start to engage in it, more sympathy will be extended to what taxi-drivers put up with on a daily basis (and I'm not referring even to homicides here).

    Also, I support the ambitions of women that elect to join dangerous professions if they're motivated that way. Professions like firefighting, police, military, and, yes, taxi driving.

    But if you're looking for my indignation about issues that you find important, then I'm sorry, I'm suffering from indignation fatigue.

    Eve

  41. #141

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    Of course it's legitimate. However, it, unlike most that you mentioned, is also one where you're alone and can disappear quite quickly. In healthcare (not home care necessarily) or even at a strip bar, there's other people around and usually dedicated security as well. This is not to say that women shouldn't want be drivers or should be banned from doing so, just that it's a situation where it can turn very bad very quickly and, unfortunately, women are more likely to be the victim. A company doing a promotion that would put a woman into a sexually charged situation under those circumstances is being utterly irresponsible.

  42. #142
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    Quote Originally Posted by EveB View Post
    My point wasn't that it wasn't silly and wrong. My point is that it's the sort of thing that is so common that I'm almost weary of it. You know there are services (I believe I read about a branch moving to Alberta) of an agency that will rent out women to clean you house or apartment while they're in their skivvies? Most nightclubs (some highly regarded at C2E) hire women whose job it is to be eye candy and flirt with the customers.

    I'm not a supporter of Uber. I don't usually use taxis. I rarely ride in private cars because I really do prefer transit. I'm curious about how it is going to play out from the point of using contractors vs employees. But it's mostly private curiosity.

    Yes, driving is an essentially a dangerous profession. So is providing homecare (there have been homicides there), so is healthcare (many assaults have been recorded). But it is a legitimate profession. Perhaps when freelancers start to engage in it, more sympathy will be extended to what taxi-drivers put up with on a daily basis (and I'm not referring even to homicides here).

    Also, I support the ambitions of women that elect to join dangerous professions if they're motivated that way. Professions like firefighting, police, military, and, yes, taxi driving.

    But if you're looking for my indignation about issues that you find important, then I'm sorry, I'm suffering from indignation fatigue.

    Eve
    If this is partially directed at me Eve I have sympathies and inate awareness for people working in all dangerous fields of which I am one.

    Out of respect for those that Rest In Peace I won't mention names of heroes that I have known but my heart goes out to them and the individuals that presently pursue a dangerous profession everyday including the two RCMP officers yesterday one of whom I've met professionally.

    So a very sad day yesterday and the many times severe events like this occur in this region.

    I back all your concerns re: industries that require women to be marginalized and treated like chattel.

    More than you would know.

    But I also regret we live in a society with unending vice, crime, hate, targeting that make uber a prime target both of allowing perpetration of abuse by driver, and by fare. Indeed that on uber users can match is a scary prospect that is poorly conceived and thought out. AS mentioned a Uber driver also has the names of his fares with this being a deplorable arrangement that has led to sexual assaults and threats of death if reported.
    Last edited by Replacement; 19-01-2015 at 11:52 AM.
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  43. #143
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    No it wasn't directed at you, Replacement. Not even partially.

    Eve

  44. #144
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    Quote Originally Posted by kkozoriz View Post
    Of course it's legitimate. However, it, unlike most that you mentioned, is also one where you're alone and can disappear quite quickly. In healthcare (not home care necessarily) or even at a strip bar, there's other people around and usually dedicated security as well. This is not to say that women shouldn't want be drivers or should be banned from doing so, just that it's a situation where it can turn very bad very quickly and, unfortunately, women are more likely to be the victim. A company doing a promotion that would put a woman into a sexually charged situation under those circumstances is being utterly irresponsible.
    A home care worker has the potential provision of setting up a precautionary alert and safety plan with superiors, coworkers, including all information of worker appts, locations, times, (GPS as well) and including check in two way oncalls to ensure the homecare worker is OK on interval basis or if any irregularity is noted. Anybody working this homecare role that doesn't have this provision should advocate for it immediately. People should also feel confident in declining or questioning certain referrals and in demanding that every reasonable safeguard is put into place and including such things as two worker coverage if required. Also important to have as much information as possible on referrals and request more. Specifically when referral agent has last been in home and what circumstance is. Also phoning client immediately prior to homevisits makes good sense to assess present functioning, orientation, sobriety, mental health, etc. Many seasoned homevisit workers due this much to mitigate danger as much as possible. Everybody should.

    Also NO homecare worker should be home responding or going out to calls prior to a complete orientation, taking safety workshops, home visitor safety workshop, and having an assigned buddy mentor and supervisor to show them the ropes. Uber will send out any driver alone within days of filling out an application and with no such safety diligence or preparation.

    I actually advocate professionally for home first responders safety and have been in multidisciplinary focus groups working on maximizing inhome safety for decades.
    A large reason why it disgusts me that such Uber haphazard orgs like this fly off the seat of their pants making poor decisions while putting people in significant, (and unknown to them) dangers.

    Which they just keep doing.
    Last edited by Replacement; 19-01-2015 at 12:28 PM.
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    Do Edmonton’s UberX drivers really know what they’re getting themselves into?
    Sanchez seems comfortable with having only personal insurance, instead of the city-regulated commercial insurance, because Uber backs him with $5 million of “contingent auto liability insurance covering bodily injury and property damage,” according to its news release.

    But how valid would that be in court? Considering the car was being used commercially, and to qualify for commercial insurance one needs better than a Class 5 licence (and even if one does qualify, could they justify the premiums with a casual job?), possibly not valid at all.

    http://metronews.ca/voices/footnotes...emselves-into/
    As Replacement mentioned in an earlier post, some Uber drivers are really naive when it comes to rules and regulations of operating a taxi.

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    I remember a point where I was naïve about the difference between commercial and personal use, only this time with a personal computer. Back in the old days, I had a computer break down and the shop I bought it from giving me the run-around.

    So naïve little me, I tried to get action by pursuing the warranty through the Consumer Rights Act (I went to visit the govt office). Well, I was told that because I used the computer to earn a living, I wasn't covered by the legislation and the office couldn't help me. I eventually had to go hire a lawyer.

    Stuff like this is going to crop up where people are doing odd jobs via these new online job broker outfits. There are unanticipated costs to being a freelance operator. I have a feeling that a lot of these people are going to discover that they're getting the worst of both the self-employment and employee worlds.

    Eve

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    ^ I can understand you being naive about your work computer because at the time computers were a new tool.

    But anyone old enough to hold a driver's licence should know the difference between personal car insurance and commercial-use insurance. Even whenever you insure a new vehicle, the agent will ask if it's for commercial use. Doesn't matter if you use your jalopy to deliver apples or to drive drunks home, you need commercial vehicle insurance.

    Mr. Sanchez in the Metro article seems relived he doesn't need to register his car as a work vehicle. Insurance companies are difficult to deal with on good days. He better hope to never get into an accident because the insurance company will string him up and spit him out.

  48. #148

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    Quote Originally Posted by North Guy66 View Post
    Do Edmonton’s UberX drivers really know what they’re getting themselves into?
    Sanchez seems comfortable with having only personal insurance, instead of the city-regulated commercial insurance, because Uber backs him with $5 million of “contingent auto liability insurance covering bodily injury and property damage,” according to its news release.

    But how valid would that be in court? Considering the car was being used commercially, and to qualify for commercial insurance one needs better than a Class 5 licence (and even if one does qualify, could they justify the premiums with a casual job?), possibly not valid at all.

    http://metronews.ca/voices/footnotes...emselves-into/
    As Replacement mentioned in an earlier post, some Uber drivers are really naive when it comes to rules and regulations of operating a taxi.
    The thing is this is all speculation until tried in court. Uber is currently making more than most insurance companies.... what would a court case look like, what do we do about the fact the judges tend to side against insurance companies?

    I venture to say that Uber is actually looking for a such a fight.

    Your home insurance is personal insurance as well.. but most policies have changed over tehyears to allow for small commercial activity, some at no change, some offer commercial liability and small additional charges and other allow for activities such as short term rentals, house sharing and the like.

    How do we get surge coverage and part time cabs, as per the city report, if the start up costs of doing so make it un economical. The avergage person cannot become an owner operator... before you have made any money you need to find a taxi plate and then cough up 100,000 for it... then you have car, insurance and the fees you pay to one of the select few taxi organizations in town... not to mention city fees.

    the system is broken and if we really care about promoting transport via anyhting else OTHER than the ppa with an occupancy of basically one per car.... we need to change something.

    Lets not forget in the city report.. the city agency who runs the city department who has a vested interest in maintaining their job at the city has recommended that developing a city ubber app be explored... with our money and to ensure that their jobs remain. I have great issue that the report on city cabs was preformed by the city and not an outside body..
    Last edited by edmonton daily photo; 19-01-2015 at 04:44 PM.
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  49. #149

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    Quote Originally Posted by North Guy66 View Post
    Do Edmonton’s UberX drivers really know what they’re getting themselves into?
    Sanchez seems comfortable with having only personal insurance, instead of the city-regulated commercial insurance, because Uber backs him with $5 million of “contingent auto liability insurance covering bodily injury and property damage,” according to its news release.

    But how valid would that be in court? Considering the car was being used commercially, and to qualify for commercial insurance one needs better than a Class 5 licence (and even if one does qualify, could they justify the premiums with a casual job?), possibly not valid at all.

    http://metronews.ca/voices/footnotes...emselves-into/
    As Replacement mentioned in an earlier post, some Uber drivers are really naive when it comes to rules and regulations of operating a taxi.
    Uber should be making sure that their drivers have all the necessary coverage, licences and documentation.

  50. #150

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    Did anyone read the kottke.org posts about Uber? http://kottke.org/tag/Uber
    I was taken with the Richard Stallman: don't use Uber post ( https://stallman.org/uber.html ). Not that I take a lot of taxis to do my nefarious deeds (I usually walk for those LOL), it was the 'freedom' aspect which spoke to me. A far tangent from YEG licences, insurances and all the superficial political crap which concerns drivers more than users.

  51. #151

  52. #152

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    ^

    Flouting Law, Uber Suspends Drivers For Properly Registering Cars

    Uber has suspended a number of its drivers because they took steps to comply with California vehicle registration laws, escalating a showdown over ride-hailing regulations in the nation’s most populous state.
    Late last month, according to records and interviews, the company cut off at least a dozen drivers who had registered their new cars as commercial vehicles and told them in order to be able to work for Uber again, they must change to a personal use auto registration.

    http://www.buzzfeed.com/kenbensinger...3nn#.ioK4rekwN

  53. #153
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    Quote Originally Posted by HenryC View Post
    Did anyone read the kottke.org posts about Uber? http://kottke.org/tag/Uber
    I was taken with the Richard Stallman: don't use Uber post ( https://stallman.org/uber.html ). Not that I take a lot of taxis to do my nefarious deeds (I usually walk for those LOL), it was the 'freedom' aspect which spoke to me. A far tangent from YEG licences, insurances and all the superficial political crap which concerns drivers more than users.
    I've addressed pretty much every one of these concerns in the thread and the reasons why people should not accept this global takeover multinational into the marketplace.

    How people can just feel comfortable giving up any of their privacy and personal information to an org that has been shown to treat it with contempt is beyond me.

    That this divulging of passenger ID and personal information is a relationship that severely compromises passengers rights, freedom, even safety is obvious.
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  54. #154

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    Quote Originally Posted by Replacement View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by kcantor View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Replacement View Post
    I have no idea what you mean there Ken. Commercial drivers require a Police check and in most cases a Vulnerability Police check. afairc this is not required for regular class 5 drivers.

    Its not the same dynamic as cab drivers either, its not the same at all. Because a prospective cab driver isn't nearly as likely part time or a temp, or casual. The prospective cab drivers that obtain police checks are a pretty finite number.. A lot more people would be potential Uber drivers and just sporadically try it out meanwhile tying up police resources getting spurious checks.

    Could you explain?
    from the quoted article (again):

    Last weekend’s incident is raising concerns about the city’s taxi industry, particularly since background checks are conducted on only a fraction of all the taxi drivers...
    How is that remotely relevant to the Edmonton discussion?

    I'm looking at the Edmonton Cab requirement application PDF right now. Police security check no older than 60days is required. For ALL enlisting Cab drivers.

    Heres some other differences not required of Uber drivers;

    Claims experience record (would indicate any driving claims against driver in last 3yrs)

    Proof of English competency exam.

    Road Safety and City knowledge exam

    Completion of Defensive driver training

    AMA driver evaluation

    1Day Computer training orientation

    3day new cab driver training course.

    Specific Cab driver road test.

    Meeting with supervisor to screen candidate after all prerequisites have been completed.

    Ongoing supervision and monitoring.


    Uber doesn't have anything close to this process and at no point in uber training is there even a face to face screening. none.


    I question if some of these processes are even followed with Taxi operators.

    Proof of English competency?

    Road Safety And City Knowledge?

    AMA Driver evaluation?

    Defensive driving?

    Notice there is no method of feedback on the specific driver, or what quality of vehicle that picks you up. Russian Roulette, you may get an unwashed smelly impossible to understand driver who answers calls and texts while driving, rolls thru stop signs, with a dirty run down worn shock jalopy taxi.

    Actually that about describes every ride I have ever taken with Capital, Barrel and most of Coop Taxi.


    I would be fine if Uber operators are held to the above listed standards, along with full criminal background checks.

    The problem is in my experience the existing Taxi operators aren't, so isn't that a problem that should be dealt with as well?

  55. #155
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    Re: Road Safety and City Knowledge. I can't speak to Edmonton but in Calgary it was downright ridiculous:

    During transit strike I needed to go from the apartment in west downtown to the Petro-Canada Tower (at the time the tallest building in town) which was down 5th Ave about 11 blocks. Half the time I had to give directions.

    For a job interview, I had a numbered address on a numbered street near downtown. I took a cab so I wouldn't be tired and flustered. Driver paused at *each* intersection to ask me for directions which I didn't have because I don't drive at all and I'd never actually been to that address. To say nothing of the one-ways.

    Many other stories.

    Eve

  56. #156

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    i think uber's days are over, with so many bad incidents and cities not wanting them or getting rid of them
    Last edited by SpongeG; 29-01-2015 at 02:40 AM.

  57. #157

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    Except, Uber is growing. What cities want and what people want are very different things. Uber is like the war on drugs, but with transportation. The only way to effectively deal with it is to legalize it, regulate it, and let people use it.
    "Men never do evil so completely and cheerfully as when they do it from religious conviction" - Blaise Pascal

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    I like the shake up that Uber is providing to our old fashioned, minimum effort taxi system.
    the technologies that they are using should and will be expanded to regular taxi services.

    I liken the Taxi industry to the Telecomm industry in canada. no competition and no incentive to improve service. just keep upping the prices for the same garbage service.
    be offended! figure out why later...

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    Hailo seems like an interesting response to Uber. It has Uber like functionality but you calling actual cabs. It appears to have started in London for calling black cabs there.

    https://www.hailoapp.com

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  60. #160

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    Quote Originally Posted by Paul Turnbull View Post
    Hailo seems like an interesting response to Uber. It has Uber like functionality but you calling actual cabs. It appears to have started in London for calling black cabs there.

    https://www.hailoapp.com

    Comparing the quality of London black cabs and Edmonton Taxis is a farce.

    Besides, an app like Halio doesn't fix the core problem with the Edmonton system - a lack of quality cabs and drivers.

  61. #161

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    From the Korea Herald...

    Two Uber Korea officials have been booked for violating the local transport law, Seoul police said Tuesday, amid growing controversy over the legality of the business.

    Uber Korea’s branch manager and his subordinate official were accused of taking commissions on connecting rental car drivers through a smartphone application since August 2013. The company took a 20 percent commission fee from the ride fares, the police said.

    Under the Korean transport law, providing unpermitted or unlicensed transportation is banned.


    link

  63. #163

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    City's temporary injunction again Uber denied:

    "Dave Lazzarino @SUNDaveLazz · 1h 1 hour ago
    #yeg court rules in favour of Uber, turning down city's temp. injunction application. Permanent injunction app. still in the works. #yegcc"
    www.decl.org

  64. #164

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    ^Good.

    Crashed Ice: two friends needed rides home. One used a cab. It had dried vomit on the back seat. The other used Uber. They were picked up by a guy wearing a suit in a polished Mercedes GLK 350. And it was cheaper than the cab.
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  65. #165

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    I've had good experiences in both. I think there are more bad experiences with cabs just because Uber hasn't been around that long. But I do like having the option of Uber.
    www.decl.org

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    Yeah that polished Mercedes is unlikely to last past the first person who vomits in the back seat.

    Eve

  67. #167

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    I took a cab home that night and it was fine. I feel bad for whoever requested a cab at Sutton Place hotel though, because we lifted it
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    Good in the sense that the industry needs shaking up but I am interested to see how things work out in the long run. There will likely need to be some regulation involved. I wonder if the City will now go directly after drivers for not having the correct license and such? I believe that has happened in other jurisdictions.

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    Taxi Apps Poised To Challenge Uber In Korea

    Of course, I don't know how much of Uber there is to challenge over here since, as noted above, the company itself has disbanded its ride-share service.

  70. #170

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    Quote Originally Posted by EveB View Post
    Yeah that polished Mercedes is unlikely to last past the first person who vomits in the back seat.

    Eve
    Seen lots of Mercedes Ubers in NYC

    Ratings on Uber goes both ways. the driver can report you and you may lose your Uber privileges. The dual rating system is what makes Uber uber great.
    Advocating a better Edmonton through effective, efficient and economical transit.

  71. #171

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    Quote Originally Posted by KC View Post
    I'm just curious if any one has used Uber and if you see a big role for it in Edmonton as an alternative to traditional cab calling.
    I generally refrain from using the word "uber" to describe anything. I find using "super", "massive", and on occasion, "ultra" to be sufficient adjectives to describe things.

  72. #172

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    Quote Originally Posted by Darendor View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by KC View Post
    I'm just curious if any one has used Uber and if you see a big role for it in Edmonton as an alternative to traditional cab calling.
    I generally refrain from using the word "uber" to describe anything. I find using "super", "massive", and on occasion, "ultra" to be sufficient adjectives to describe things.
    I find it über used über alles.
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  73. #173

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    I used Uber on the weekend. $16 from Oxford to Jasper Ave. That's normally a $30 cab ride. Best part? I didn't know the address of my origin, yet the app had him pull up to the right house first try.
    "Men never do evil so completely and cheerfully as when they do it from religious conviction" - Blaise Pascal

  74. #174

  75. #175

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    competition is always better, of course the old guard is going to complain but oh well. People shouldn't always be trying to protect older institutions just because thats how its always been done.

  76. #176

  77. #177

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    Dang. Can't even claim ignorance anymore. I am ok with paying more for UberX to cover the cost of commercial insurance, if that's what it takes. At least it's convenient and consistent service, unlike our taxi cartel.

    Alberta warns Uber drivers to get more insurance

  78. #178

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    I don't mind paying more for Uber. It's cheap, but the real draw is that the service is better than our current taxi service.

    Hopefully as Uber becomes more legit it gets taxi companies to step up their game.

  79. #179

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    Quote Originally Posted by anduin View Post
    competition is always better, of course the old guard is going to complain but oh well. People shouldn't always be trying to protect older institutions just because thats how its always been done.
    Quote Originally Posted by bolo View Post
    Dang. Can't even claim ignorance anymore. I am ok with paying more for UberX to cover the cost of commercial insurance, if that's what it takes. At least it's convenient and consistent service, unlike our taxi cartel.

    Alberta warns Uber drivers to get more insurance
    Caught part of an interesting interview with Jonathan Kay with Walrus on CBC radio this morning. September issue of Walrus will apparently cover the story.

    Basically uber is taking away the taxi services' profitable customers and leaving them with the unprofitable customers. He added that it's an aspect of the change that has been ignored because the users and reporters have failed to understand that they aren't fully representative of the range of taxi service customers and so are/were quite ignorant of the service taxis provide to society...

    Basically the same old, same old story we hear over and over: 'If I like/dislike, use/can't use, want/don't want something, then my opinion/experience applies to everyone.'
    Last edited by KC; 17-08-2015 at 08:57 AM.

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    Basically uber is taking away the taxi services' profitable customers and leaving them with the unprofitable customers.

    Who are the profitable and unprofitable customers? Is it defined according to length of ride?

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    Length of ride. "Experienced" riders, i.e., riders that know how to use a system efficiently (i.e., have charge cards that actually work or money is proper denominations, don't have to run into house to get roommates to pay), people who tip.

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    My friend has been an Uber driver in LA for about a week, and he said the money is horrible. He'll spend all day driving and end up with $40 profit at the end of it (after gas, and the Uber fees are subtracted). He said that nearly all his fares have been short distances, and result in low fares (keep in mind no one walks in LA - he said some people he's driven are going a couple of blocks to get lunch, seriously).
    They're going to park their car over there. You're going to park your car over here. Get it?

  83. #183

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    Quote Originally Posted by overoceans View Post
    Basically uber is taking away the taxi services' profitable customers and leaving them with the unprofitable customers.

    Who are the profitable and unprofitable customers? Is it defined according to length of ride?
    I was busy and only half caught it but I thought heard him say that assisting some customers takes 1/2 hour and so a cab driver might be losing money through the week and then make it up on the weekend hauling young, healthy people around. ...and reporters tend to be younger and healthier (or not disabled, or whatever he said) and so reporters have missed the story...

    You'll be able to get it straight shortly...

    "Jonathan Kay gets behind the wheel to find out the truth about Uber; "
    http://thewalrus.ca/category/issues/september-2015/

    The above link is now dead.

    Here's a new one:


    http://thewalrus.ca/category/issues/2015-09/




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    ~
    Last edited by KC; 19-08-2015 at 04:42 PM.

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    I have used Uber 7 times. 1 time I waited 30 minutes and I watched the guy go in circles on my Uber phone app and I gave up and called Co-op but Uber charged me anyway. The times I did get a driver not one of them had any experience and all used their gps for guidance - which on 1 occasion was the fastest route and the other times I took over and provided direction. All were male drivers, all new cars, some expensive cars and hybrids. One guy was working 3 jobs to feed his family. All were nice and trying hard to please. I would use them again without hesitation and do in my travels. Frankly they are easier to get than a taxi in many places.

  85. #185
    I'd rather C2E than work!
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    Residents looking to make some extra cash by driving for Uber could find themselves with a fine of up to $25,000.


    http://www.therecord.com/news-story/...terloo-region/
    Edmonton Rocks Rocks Rocks

  86. #186

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    I've used uber lots but the story out of Toronto is a bit worrying. An uber driver got in an accident with a fare and uber isn't helping him with repairing his vehicle and his insurance told him to get lost. So much for the $5 million liability Insurance for all drivers.

  87. #187

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    It's archaic having to call a dispatcher (and getting a phone charge from it), being promised someone will come in 15 mins when it actually takes 1-2 hours if they come at all, then hoping the driver will actually take you to your destination (I've been refused trips to the suburbs) and uses an efficient route (instead of trying to milk you) and doesn't demand cash (cause the credit card machine is always broken, you know).

    Taxi companies need to adopt Uber-like technology (account linked to credit card), real-time GPS tracking, GPS routing, driver reviews, smartphone apps, etc...

    Even if uber doesn't make it, I hope this is a wakeup call for the taxi industry.

  88. #188
    C2E Stole my Heart!!!!
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    Yellow Cab has had from what I understand a pretty good app for over a year now, with real time tracking and the like (I haven't used it, I just call). Not sure if you can pick drivers, though. I haven't used Uber personally, but everyone that I know who has loved it. Generally I've had reasonably good service from Yellow Cab. Not sure if it's because I live downtown, or if it's because I've had the same number for 15 years and have never been a no-show, or what. But even today I was in the Calgary Trail and 54 avenue area dropping my car off and my ride fell through. Called Yellow Cab, and they were there in under 5 minutes.

  89. #189
    I'd rather C2E than work!
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    Yellow has been fine for me as well. don't take a ton of cabs, but I've never really had a problem getting one outside of busy holidays. When I am on Whyte and need a cab I just walk down to the strip mall on 99/82 and can usually grab one right there. I have no philisophical issues with uber but wouldn't use it until all the nuts & bolts are sorted out.

    The worst cabs I have been in (in North America) were in cities like Milwaukee and St Louis. Not just unpleasant, sometimes downright terrifying. Our cabs in Edmonton are all Rolls Royces in comparison
    Parkdale

  90. #190
    C2E Hard Core Contributor
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    I don't take many cabs, but by far I've been able to head over to the local hotel taxi stand and pick the first in line. It helps that I've always lived downtown near a hotel of some kind.

    My complaints about cabs when I arrived in Calgary was that a lot of them seemed to be pushing personal boundaries and they didn't know the city. The knowing the city thing is better now because they have GPS. I haven't taken enough Edmonton taxis (two or three) to really have a good idea but I don't remember anything totally negative.

  91. #191
    I'd rather C2E than work!
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    Quote Originally Posted by 240GLT View Post
    When I am on Whyte and need a cab I just walk down to the strip mall on 99/82 and can usually grab one right there.
    Yeah, that's the Capital taxi stand. I always call them if I'm going somewhere by cab because they're quick to my place.
    They're going to park their car over there. You're going to park your car over here. Get it?

  92. #192

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    Quote Originally Posted by gwill211 View Post
    I've used uber lots but the story out of Toronto is a bit worrying. An uber driver got in an accident with a fare and uber isn't helping him with repairing his vehicle and his insurance told him to get lost. So much for the $5 million liability Insurance for all drivers.
    How about a link to that...
    "Men never do evil so completely and cheerfully as when they do it from religious conviction" - Blaise Pascal

  93. #193

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    Taxis are great when they're conveniently waiting to pick me up (taxi stands, hotels). They absolutely suck balls the rest of the time.
    "Men never do evil so completely and cheerfully as when they do it from religious conviction" - Blaise Pascal

  94. #194

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    City of Edmonton may pass a by-law motion to make Uber legal in Edmonton.

    CTV News at 12 o'clock.

    http://edmonton.ctvnews.ca/city-prop...ally-1.2548462
    Last edited by Gemini; 04-09-2015 at 12:10 PM.
    "The man who does not read has no advantage over the man who cannot read." –Mark Twain

  95. #195

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    ^I don't understand why taxis haven't taken some of the technology in uber (like cashless pre approved fares), and try to compete. These rules by governments to try and protect an industry that is not providing the service customers want, are very sad.

  96. #196
    C2E Stole my Heart!!!!
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    Quote Originally Posted by moahunter View Post
    ^I don't understand why taxis haven't taken some of the technology in uber (like cashless pre approved fares), and try to compete. These rules by governments to try and protect an industry that is not providing the service customers want, are very sad.
    Do you always post without reading anything in a thread? Yellow cab has apparently been adopting some of the technology for around a year now. information that is contained above in the very same page you posted on.
    "if god exists and he allowed that to happen, then its better that he doesn't exist"

  97. #197

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    ^my bad lol, I thought said illegal. Good for COE.

  98. #198

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    Looks like all the local Taxi companies have smartphone apps. That's really good to see. There are also some apps that purport to work with all dispatchers. Gonna have to try those out the next time around.
    Last edited by bolo; 04-09-2015 at 02:04 PM.

  99. #199
    C2E Hard Core Contributor
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    It is good to see. I just loaded the Yellow Cab android app onto my phone. I take a cab maybe once a year, but it will be nice not to have to try to find a phone number if I am ever stuck somewhere.

  100. #200

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    Quote Originally Posted by Gemini View Post
    City of Edmonton may pass a by-law motion to make Uber legal in Edmonton.

    CTV News at 12 o'clock.

    http://edmonton.ctvnews.ca/city-prop...ally-1.2548462
    Not just that, but a complete overhaul of vehicle for hire:
    Removal of late night surcharge
    Removal of van surcharge
    Universal vehicle for hire requirements - criminal record check, class 4 or better license, insurance requirements, and annual maintenance check
    Unlimited vehicle for hire licenses
    Shields become optional

    If this passes, it will put taxis, Uber, Lyft, and anyone with a car and a desire to drive on a level playing field. I'm interested to see how the taxi companies will react to this. Those plates they paid for will be rendered worthless. Competition will be fierce.

    I can't wait!
    "Men never do evil so completely and cheerfully as when they do it from religious conviction" - Blaise Pascal

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