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Thread: Walterdale Bridge Replacement | U/C

  1. #3001

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    Maybe a bunch of LED lights surrounding each bolting plate to accentuate the beautiful architectural design so they can be seen at night too. FCOL
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    I am late to the thread but have a question. I see the bridge is painted white or coated with some white material. Does this mean we are not getting a stainless steel bridge and the sheen of stainless still?

  3. #3003

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    Quote Originally Posted by EdmTrekker View Post
    I am late to the thread but have a question. I see the bridge is painted white or coated with some white material. Does this mean we are not getting a stainless steel bridge and the sheen of stainless still?

    Not sure if serious... but bridge is definitely not stainless. Not sure it ever was.

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    There was never any mention of stainless steel. The bridge arches were supposed to be seamless, or nearly so with no large bolts, rivets, or plates showing. That's clearly no longer the case.

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    The paint certainly has a metallic sheen to it, but yes, not SS.... that would have been amazing.
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    ^ Indeed, it would have been. Was it not stated, or at least inferred, that it would be stainless steel at some earlier juncture? There may even have been illustrations earlier in this thread showing that - most likely at the glitzy render stage, though. I guess we're left to ponder 'oh, what would've/could've been'.
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    The worst part about all of this is that they did remove the bolted connection on the bottom portion and weld it. It looks seamless and beautiful... unlike these bolted appendages.
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  8. #3008

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    I guess contractual obligations and specification are optional and at the discretion of the builder.

    The New Walterdale Bridge: A Charlie Brown "Signature" Project

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    Quote Originally Posted by howie View Post
    ^ Indeed, it would have been. Was it not stated, or at least inferred, that it would be stainless steel at some earlier juncture? There may even have been illustrations earlier in this thread showing that - most likely at the glitzy render stage, though. I guess we're left to ponder 'oh, what would've/could've been'.
    Stainless steel was never brought up or hinted at. It was always quite clearly white.

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    ^ Okay, my memory was a bit off, then.
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    Quote Originally Posted by IanO View Post
    The worst part about all of this is that they did remove the bolted connection on the bottom portion and weld it. It looks seamless and beautiful... unlike these bolted appendages.
    Seems union boys are a little bit timid about welding so high. Sub it out if there's money left.
    There was no need to change that plaque. We are the City of Champions.

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    twitter.com/ianoyeg
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  13. #3013

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    I see ugly connecting plates...
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  14. #3014

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    It truly is the bridge we deserve. Good intentions marred by poor planning & worse implementation.
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  15. #3015

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    Old Walterdale Bridge made with ugly riveted plates


    "NEW" Walterdale Bridge made with ugly riveted plates



    I don't buy the argument about the plates

    Argument #1
    "We can't get the welders up there."

    Then why did you not weld them before the arches went up?



    Argument #2
    "We can't get the welders up there."



    These guys are up there


    And how are they getting the painters up there?

    A long roller handle?
    Last edited by Edmonton PRT; 10-07-2017 at 08:51 AM.
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    Is it all the City's fault. Part of it's the delay in the steel from South Korea.
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    Quote Originally Posted by noodle View Post
    It truly is the bridge we deserve. Good intentions marred by poor planning & worse implementation.
    Wait which part of it was marred by poor planning? The plates and delay are both on the contractor. Unless you mean poor planning on the part of the contractor.

  18. #3018

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    Quote Originally Posted by seamusmcduffs View Post

    Wait which part of it was marred by poor planning? The plates and delay are both on the contractor. Unless you mean poor planning on the part of the contractor.
    Don't really care to split the hairs about who's planning is poor, but the whole project has been planned about as well as a junior high group presentation.
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  19. #3019

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    You should've seen some of my junior high group presentations. Much Wow. So amaze. 5/7. Would do again. No plates, no rivets. Much success.

  20. #3020

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    Please don't insult Junior High School presentations.

    I have seen some excellent ones, and they started on time and finished on time.
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  21. #3021

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    Medwards, you and I were thinking the exact same thing at the same time.

    Ever wonder if we were identical twins, separated at the hospital? LOL
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    Quote Originally Posted by noodle View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by seamusmcduffs View Post

    Wait which part of it was marred by poor planning? The plates and delay are both on the contractor. Unless you mean poor planning on the part of the contractor.
    Don't really care to split the hairs about who's planning is poor, but the whole project has been planned about as well as a junior high group presentation.
    "Planning" isn't really the right term. The City completely mismanaged the project by accepting a non-compliant low bid knowing full well it was non-compliant (other bidders told them as much), and didn't realize the repercussions of that decision until it was far too late to go back. They did get to trumpet how under budget they were, though! It's like someone walking in to a car dealership with 80k in their pocket to buy a BMW (or Mercedes or whatever), getting hoodwinked, and driving off with a Chevy Cruze for 60k and telling themselves they saved 20k. Well, no, you didn't.

  23. #3023

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    I'll cede to Marcel, consider my "planning" above changed to "management".
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  24. #3024

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    Hopefully our $60k Chevy Cruze Bridge won't rust out a few years after the warranty expires.
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  25. #3025

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    Quote Originally Posted by Edmonton PRT View Post
    Argument #1
    "We can't get the welders up there."

    Then why did you not weld them before the arches went up?
    Because the whole bridge needed to be set in place before welding.

    Quote Originally Posted by Edmonton PRT View Post
    Argument #2
    "We can't get the welders up there."

    These guys are up there

    And how are they getting the painters up there?

    A long roller handle?
    Painters don't need multi-hundred kilos of welding gear (this ain't farmer MIG welding) plus shrouding.
    I feel in no way entitled to your opinion...

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    Quote Originally Posted by Marcel Petrin View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by noodle View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by seamusmcduffs View Post

    Wait which part of it was marred by poor planning? The plates and delay are both on the contractor. Unless you mean poor planning on the part of the contractor.
    Don't really care to split the hairs about who's planning is poor, but the whole project has been planned about as well as a junior high group presentation.
    "Planning" isn't really the right term. The City completely mismanaged the project by accepting a non-compliant low bid knowing full well it was non-compliant (other bidders told them as much), and didn't realize the repercussions of that decision until it was far too late to go back. They did get to trumpet how under budget they were, though! It's like someone walking in to a car dealership with 80k in their pocket to buy a BMW (or Mercedes or whatever), getting hoodwinked, and driving off with a Chevy Cruze for 60k and telling themselves they saved 20k. Well, no, you didn't.
    Was it really a non-compliant bid? That's the first I've heard of that. What wasn't compliant about it? Surprised none of the other bidders took legal action.

  27. #3027

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    Quote Originally Posted by Spudly View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Edmonton PRT View Post
    Argument #1
    "We can't get the welders up there."

    Then why did you not weld them before the arches went up?
    Because the whole bridge needed to be set in place before welding
    Why? Do you have a technical reason why the pieces could not be welded first and then erected as they did instead, bolted them and then erected the sub assemblies.


    Quote Originally Posted by Edmonton PRT View Post
    Argument #2
    "We can't get the welders up there."

    These guys are up there

    And how are they getting the painters up there?

    A long roller handle?
    Painters don't need multi-hundred kilos of welding gear (this ain't farmer MIG welding) plus shrouding.
    Oh PLEASE teach me all you know about welding. I have been welding since I have been 16 years old and managing welding departments for decades.
    Last edited by Edmonton PRT; 11-07-2017 at 09:31 AM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Edmonton PRT View Post
    I have been welding since I have been 16 years old and managing welding departments for decades.



    And with that....

    all becomes clear.


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    Quote Originally Posted by Spudly View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Edmonton PRT View Post
    Argument #1
    "We can't get the welders up there."

    Then why did you not weld them before the arches went up?
    Because the whole bridge needed to be set in place before welding.

    Quote Originally Posted by Edmonton PRT View Post
    Argument #2
    "We can't get the welders up there."

    These guys are up there

    And how are they getting the painters up there?

    A long roller handle?
    Painters don't need multi-hundred kilos of welding gear (this ain't farmer MIG welding) plus shrouding.
    By this argument how was the Manhattan skyline ever erected?

    The whole notion that "Our welders couldn't get up there that high" lmao, is not adequately explained, substantiated, and the statements were without elaboration or questioning.

    Leaving us to ponder the shoddy work by a firm that was an infamous low bidder on the project. Perhaps its just shoddy work by a shoddy firm incapable of better.
    "if god exists and he allowed that to happen, then its better that he doesn't exist"

  30. #3030

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    I was on top a of a 136 ft tall catalytic cracker in Sarina with four welders and a half dozen riggers lowering a 96 foot long assembly being lowered into the top of the cracker under a 280 ft crane.

    Funny that the welders did not fear the heights at all. I was getting vertigo looking up at the assembly waving in the wind overhead but you are in a harness and tied off.

    Been there, done that.
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    Quote Originally Posted by seamusmcduffs View Post
    Was it really a non-compliant bid? That's the first I've heard of that. What wasn't compliant about it? Surprised none of the other bidders took legal action.
    I was told by an engineer from one of the unsuccessful bid teams, who knows what he's talking about and whom I have known a long time, that the bidders had received a quote from the South Korean steel supplier. It was significantly lower than the other supplier quotes, but something like 10-12 million. I'm not sure what the overall price for the steel was, but that's a huge gap on a project that was budgeted at around 130 million. The other bidders recognized that it was not compliant with the specifications, and chose to not carry the price in their bid. Acciona Pacer Joint Venture apparently chose to carry the price, whether because they didn't realize it was non-compliant, or because they felt it would give them a big advantage, I don't know. Some of the other bidders informed the City as such, and asked that APJV's price get tossed out because of it. The City decided to proceed with them anyways, because they liked the cheap price. Queue massive delays and significant additional certification costs as the City had to hire local engineers and/or fly their own people to South Korea to monitor the production of the arches.

    I would imagine that the other bidders elected not to pursue legal action because they didn't want to stir the pot further and potentially anger a very important client. Or perhaps there was some wiggle room in the specs and contract documents that made it less than an open and shut case. I don't have first hand knowledge of how everything went exactly. Court cases can take unexpected turns, and are never cheap. The more you stir crap, the more it stinks.

    That's my rough understanding of what transpired, and how we ended up where we are. And it's eerily similar to the various fiascos that happened with bridge rehabilitations: http://www.torontosun.com/2012/05/26/quesnell-quagmire

    When one bid is massively lower than the rest (and given the thin margins that general contractors have on large infrastructure projects, anything more than 2-3% difference is getting sketchy), a good project manager says to themselves "wait a minute, this doesn't make sense. What have they forgotten or screwed up, and how can this come back to bite me?" Apparently at the City of Edmonton, you just put out a press release about how much below budget the tender came in at, and hope for the best. I was told that for Quesnell bridge, ConCreate couldn't even get their own bonding and had to get their paving subcontractor to provide it. That alone should have been a massive warning sign.
    Last edited by Marcel Petrin; 11-07-2017 at 11:08 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Edmonton PRT View Post
    I was on top a of a 136 ft tall catalytic cracker in Sarina with four welders and a half dozen riggers lowering a 96 foot long assembly being lowered into the top of the cracker under a 280 ft crane.

    Funny that the welders did not fear the heights at all. I was getting vertigo looking up at the assembly waving in the wind overhead but you are in a harness and tied off.

    Been there, done that.
    Yes, so you should understand how much doing all that work costs...
    It was never about it being technically possible, it's about $$.

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    I'm sure one reason for the covers could be access to the cables. How do you adjust them?
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marcel Petrin View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by seamusmcduffs View Post
    Was it really a non-compliant bid? That's the first I've heard of that. What wasn't compliant about it? Surprised none of the other bidders took legal action.
    I was told by an engineer from one of the unsuccessful bid teams, who knows what he's talking about and whom I have known a long time, that the bidders had received a quote from the South Korean steel supplier. It was significantly lower than the other supplier quotes, but something like 10-12 million. I'm not sure what the overall price for the steel was, but that's a huge gap on a project that was budgeted at around 130 million. The other bidders recognized that it was not compliant with the specifications, and chose to not carry the price in their bid. Acciona Pacer Joint Venture apparently chose to carry the price, whether because they didn't realize it was non-compliant, or because they felt it would give them a big advantage, I don't know. Some of the other bidders informed the City as such, and asked that APJV's price get tossed out because of it. The City decided to proceed with them anyways, because they liked the cheap price. Queue massive delays and significant additional certification costs as the City had to hire local engineers and/or fly their own people to South Korea to monitor the production of the arches.

    I would imagine that the other bidders elected not to pursue legal action because they didn't want to stir the pot further and potentially anger a very important client. Or perhaps there was some wiggle room in the specs and contract documents that made it less than an open and shut case. I don't have first hand knowledge of how everything went exactly. Court cases can take unexpected turns, and are never cheap. The more you stir crap, the more it stinks.

    That's my rough understanding of what transpired, and how we ended up where we are. And it's eerily similar to the various fiascos that happened with bridge rehabilitations: http://www.torontosun.com/2012/05/26/quesnell-quagmire

    When one bid is massively lower than the rest (and given the thin margins that general contractors have on large infrastructure projects, anything more than 2-3% difference is getting sketchy), a good project manager says to themselves "wait a minute, this doesn't make sense. What have they forgotten or screwed up, and how can this come back to bite me?" Apparently at the City of Edmonton, you just put out a press release about how much below budget the tender came in at, and hope for the best. I was told that for Quesnell bridge, ConCreate couldn't even get their own bonding and had to get their paving subcontractor to provide it. That alone should have been a massive warning sign.
    In part, the issue resides in that the final financial decision (selection of contractor) rests with those that aren't always of sufficient experience to know the pitfalls.

    I'd be amenable to a Canadian law similar to the Brooks Act in the Unites States.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brooks_Act
    http://www.qbscanada.ca/qbs-canada.html

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    Quote Originally Posted by Marcel Petrin View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by seamusmcduffs View Post
    Was it really a non-compliant bid? That's the first I've heard of that. What wasn't compliant about it? Surprised none of the other bidders took legal action.
    I was told by an engineer from one of the unsuccessful bid teams, who knows what he's talking about and whom I have known a long time, that the bidders had received a quote from the South Korean steel supplier. It was significantly lower than the other supplier quotes, but something like 10-12 million. I'm not sure what the overall price for the steel was, but that's a huge gap on a project that was budgeted at around 130 million. The other bidders recognized that it was not compliant with the specifications, and chose to not carry the price in their bid. Acciona Pacer Joint Venture apparently chose to carry the price, whether because they didn't realize it was non-compliant, or because they felt it would give them a big advantage, I don't know. Some of the other bidders informed the City as such, and asked that APJV's price get tossed out because of it. The City decided to proceed with them anyways, because they liked the cheap price. Queue massive delays and significant additional certification costs as the City had to hire local engineers and/or fly their own people to South Korea to monitor the production of the arches.

    I would imagine that the other bidders elected not to pursue legal action because they didn't want to stir the pot further and potentially anger a very important client. Or perhaps there was some wiggle room in the specs and contract documents that made it less than an open and shut case. I don't have first hand knowledge of how everything went exactly. Court cases can take unexpected turns, and are never cheap. The more you stir crap, the more it stinks.

    That's my rough understanding of what transpired, and how we ended up where we are. And it's eerily similar to the various fiascos that happened with bridge rehabilitations: http://www.torontosun.com/2012/05/26/quesnell-quagmire

    When one bid is massively lower than the rest (and given the thin margins that general contractors have on large infrastructure projects, anything more than 2-3% difference is getting sketchy), a good project manager says to themselves "wait a minute, this doesn't make sense. What have they forgotten or screwed up, and how can this come back to bite me?" Apparently at the City of Edmonton, you just put out a press release about how much below budget the tender came in at, and hope for the best. I was told that for Quesnell bridge, ConCreate couldn't even get their own bonding and had to get their paving subcontractor to provide it. That alone should have been a massive warning sign.
    Wow.

    The city is both incredibly lucky/stupid if that is the case. It could have easily blown up in their faces, luckily there value as a client is worth more than what the other bidders perceived could be gained from a suit. I've rejected tenders before because of a missing signature/stamp, because the front door was under construction and the courier had to go around back and was a minute late, etc. Really minor stuff, but if any of those bids got accepted the repercussions would be a lot worse than a ****** off contractor. Going with sourcing from somewhere that doesn't meet specs is just asking for trouble.

    Although I guess it caught up to them either way.

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    Quote Originally Posted by The_Cat View Post
    I'm sure one reason for the covers could be access to the cables. How do you adjust them?
    An army of genetically engineered mice with strong front legs?
    Did my dog just fall into a pothole???

  37. #3037

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    Quote Originally Posted by DanC View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Edmonton PRT View Post
    I was on top a of a 136 ft tall catalytic cracker in Sarina with four welders and a half dozen riggers lowering a 96 foot long assembly being lowered into the top of the cracker under a 280 ft crane.

    Funny that the welders did not fear the heights at all. I was getting vertigo looking up at the assembly waving in the wind overhead but you are in a harness and tied off.

    Been there, done that.
    Yes, so you should understand how much doing all that work costs...
    It was never about it being technically possible, it's about $$.
    Yes, I understand. My crew could burn 400 pounds of sub-arc wire in a shift. Welding is not only costly, it is the most complex manufacturing process there is.

    It's all possible and done on high steel every day all over the world. Heck, they weld structures using hyperbaric welding practices a 1,000 feet under water.

    On this bridge, it is called cutting corners and saving $$$.

    Signature Bridge, what a load of BS.
    Last edited by Edmonton PRT; 11-07-2017 at 02:15 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Edmonton PRT View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by DanC View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Edmonton PRT View Post
    I was on top a of a 136 ft tall catalytic cracker in Sarina with four welders and a half dozen riggers lowering a 96 foot long assembly being lowered into the top of the cracker under a 280 ft crane.

    Funny that the welders did not fear the heights at all. I was getting vertigo looking up at the assembly waving in the wind overhead but you are in a harness and tied off.

    Been there, done that.
    Yes, so you should understand how much doing all that work costs...
    It was never about it being technically possible, it's about $$.
    Yes, I understand. My crew could burn 400 pounds of sub-arc wire in a shift. Welding is not only costly, it is the most complex manufacturing process there is.

    It's all possible and done on high steel every day all over the world. Heck, they weld structures using hyperbaric welding practices a 1,000 feet under water.

    On this bridge, it is called cutting corners and saving $$$.

    Signature Bridge, what a load of BS.
    You keep citing all these things that can be done. That's inconsequential, on this project it's called saving money, cutting corners, I wouldn't say that, maybe aesthetic corners. Functionally it's going to be a-ok.

  39. #3039

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    Quote Originally Posted by Edmonton PRT View Post
    Welding is not only costly, it is the most complex manufacturing process there is.
    LOL. I never knew welding was so glamorous...

  40. #3040

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    Quote Originally Posted by DanC View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Edmonton PRT View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by DanC View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Edmonton PRT View Post
    I was on top a of a 136 ft tall catalytic cracker in Sarina with four welders and a half dozen riggers lowering a 96 foot long assembly being lowered into the top of the cracker under a 280 ft crane.

    Funny that the welders did not fear the heights at all. I was getting vertigo looking up at the assembly waving in the wind overhead but you are in a harness and tied off.

    Been there, done that.
    Yes, so you should understand how much doing all that work costs...
    It was never about it being technically possible, it's about $$.
    Yes, I understand. My crew could burn 400 pounds of sub-arc wire in a shift. Welding is not only costly, it is the most complex manufacturing process there is.

    It's all possible and done on high steel every day all over the world. Heck, they weld structures using hyperbaric welding practices a 1,000 feet under water.

    On this bridge, it is called cutting corners and saving $$$.

    Signature Bridge, what a load of BS.
    You keep citing all these things that can be done. That's inconsequential, on this project it's called saving money, cutting corners, I wouldn't say that, maybe aesthetic corners. Functionally it's going to be a-ok.
    OK, how much did the city save?
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  41. #3041

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    Quote Originally Posted by barhonda View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Edmonton PRT View Post
    Welding is not only costly, it is the most complex manufacturing process there is.
    LOL. I never knew welding was so glamorous...
    And more complex than x-ray lithography!
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  42. #3042

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    Quote Originally Posted by barhonda View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Edmonton PRT View Post
    Welding is not only costly, it is the most complex manufacturing process there is.
    LOL. I never knew welding was so glamorous...
    Actually welding is almost an art form IMHO. It takes a lot of skill, dexterity and knowledge. You are dealing with metalurgy, physics, chemistry, electricity and more.

    A good welder is a tradesman who takes exceptional pride in producing a good bead.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Edmonton PRT View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by DanC View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Edmonton PRT View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by DanC View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Edmonton PRT View Post
    I was on top a of a 136 ft tall catalytic cracker in Sarina with four welders and a half dozen riggers lowering a 96 foot long assembly being lowered into the top of the cracker under a 280 ft crane.

    Funny that the welders did not fear the heights at all. I was getting vertigo looking up at the assembly waving in the wind overhead but you are in a harness and tied off.

    Been there, done that.
    Yes, so you should understand how much doing all that work costs...
    It was never about it being technically possible, it's about $$.
    Yes, I understand. My crew could burn 400 pounds of sub-arc wire in a shift. Welding is not only costly, it is the most complex manufacturing process there is.

    It's all possible and done on high steel every day all over the world. Heck, they weld structures using hyperbaric welding practices a 1,000 feet under water.

    On this bridge, it is called cutting corners and saving $$$.

    Signature Bridge, what a load of BS.
    You keep citing all these things that can be done. That's inconsequential, on this project it's called saving money, cutting corners, I wouldn't say that, maybe aesthetic corners. Functionally it's going to be a-ok.
    OK, how much did the city save?
    I wasn't involved in the bid, I can't answer that with any accuracy.

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    My guess is it will cost more with no savings, however the late penalty charge might mean the city will pay less in the end, however Edmontonians will pay more in lost fuel, brakes and lost time.

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    Quote Originally Posted by sundance View Post
    My guess is it will cost more with no savings, however the late penalty charge might mean the city will pay less in the end, however Edmontonians will pay more in lost fuel, brakes and lost time.
    Bolted connections are significantly cheaper to complete than welded.
    It may be that no bids were compliant for various reasons, some technical, some commercial (cost, schedule, T&Cs).
    That said, offshoring fabrication and using a bolted connection over welding, generally, provides a significant cost savings.

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    Quote Originally Posted by DanC View Post
    That said, offshoring fabrication and using a bolted connection over welding, generally, provides a significant cost savings.

    However, at best, the compromise in quality is considerable.

    At worst, it's Y-U-U-G-E.

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    Yea, there can definitely be issues...schedule can be a bit you know iffy...

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    Let alone a smooth exterior finish...
    Advocating a better Edmonton through effective, efficient and economical transit.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Edmonton PRT View Post
    Medwards, you and I were thinking the exact same thing at the same time.

    Ever wonder if we were identical twins, separated at the hospital? LOL
    no. I don't.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Edmonton PRT View Post
    Let alone a smooth exterior finish...
    Beat that horse, just beat it Micheal Jackson

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    Post 1956: 16-11-2015:6
    Quote Originally Posted by Legion View Post
    LOL WHAT just because it has plates on it it automatically makes it substandard jebus christ man you need to relax smoke some weed and wait to see what the FINSHED bridge will look like.
    So how did relaxing and smoking weed work out?
    Last edited by taylorc; 11-07-2017 at 09:42 PM.

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    Looks like the bridge is close to being paved.
    "Talk minus action equals zero." - Joe Keithley, D. O. A.

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    Quote Originally Posted by The_Cat View Post
    Looks like the bridge is close to being paved.
    Will wonders never cease?

    "if god exists and he allowed that to happen, then its better that he doesn't exist"

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    Quote Originally Posted by taylorc View Post
    Post 1956: 16-11-2015:6
    Quote Originally Posted by Legion View Post
    LOL WHAT just because it has plates on it it automatically makes it substandard jebus christ man you need to relax smoke some weed and wait to see what the FINSHED bridge will look like.
    So how did relaxing and smoking weed work out?
    I can't answer for Legion, but last time I tried smoking, plates on a bridge were the least of concerns I had. I was more worried about finding munchies.

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    Quote Originally Posted by taylorc View Post
    Post 1956: 16-11-2015:6
    Quote Originally Posted by Legion View Post
    LOL WHAT just because it has plates on it it automatically makes it substandard jebus christ man you need to relax smoke some weed and wait to see what the FINSHED bridge will look like.
    So how did relaxing and smoking weed work out?
    To answer on Legion's behalf,

    ..."yah man, s-p-l-i-f-f, I don't see no plates, I don't see no bridge but I can walk on water."
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    I was talking generally for the whole project. Any savings received from offshore fabrication were spent in delays and having to re-engineer some of the project. The city is/was suing the supplier for sub-standard work and materials.
    http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/edmont...eges-1.3511252

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    Quote Originally Posted by sundance View Post
    I was talking generally for the whole project. Any savings received from offshore fabrication were spent in delays and having to re-engineer some of the project. The city is/was suing the supplier for sub-standard work and materials.
    http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/edmont...eges-1.3511252
    Those impacts hit the contractor not the City.
    City sees additional savings as a result of liquidated damages.

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    Oh the city also sees a benefit of gas taxes. As we are sitting, wasting gas we spend more on it, but that isn't a good thing.

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    “You have to dream big. If we want to be a little city, we dream small. If we want to be a big city, we dream big, and this is a big idea.” - Mayor Stephen Mandel, 02/22/2012

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    twitter.com/ianoyeg
    www.decl.org

    Ottawa-Edmonton-Vancouver-Edmonton

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    Now that's an 'urban' shot

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    "Talk minus action equals zero." - Joe Keithley, D. O. A.

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