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Thread: Strathearn Heights Development restarted

  1. #101
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    Quote Originally Posted by buildings View Post
    I have a friend who works for Strathearn Heights and they've told me: 1) they have been gearing up internally to go (i.e. not renewing leases in some of the existing buildings), and 2) the owner (or perhaps the major stake holder?), suffered a major stroke while in Europe sometime in the last 7 to 10 days and now they are unsure of the future of the development.
    I think I know who that would be, he had some serious health issues. Hopefully not too serious and truly a great guy, I will have to send him an email.
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  2. #102

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    Quote Originally Posted by ajs View Post
    I had to laugh at the idea of the police performing a "sting" on the place. It could have been renamed The Strathearn Pub: Where smoking pot out front is perfectly legal.
    I think the pot was a side issue. Ched said the "father and son team" who run the bar were busted with cocaine and stolen merchandise used in barter for drugs.

  3. #103
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    Everyone knows Strathearn pub is drug den filled with sketchy people. The Police are ridiculous.

    Live in the apts and head on down for a good night of beer and blow!

    These guys at the apts are all talk no action, still really hoping it happens but no longer convinced.

  4. #104

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    Wow, only looking at the redevelopment plans and not spending much time in Strathearn, that came from Saturn.
    Let's make Edmonton better.

  5. #105
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    The apts attract all kinds, but there is a reason someone is living in a fairly low rent old apt building. Unfortunately one of those reasons is substance abuse or other choices/issues that can have a negative effect to surrounding area.

    It's part of the mix that is there, not the dominant part...but is there.

  6. #106

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    Quote Originally Posted by DanC View Post
    Everyone knows Strathearn pub is drug den filled with sketchy people. The Police are ridiculous.

    Live in the apts and head on down for a good night of beer and blow!

    These guys at the apts are all talk no action, still really hoping it happens but no longer convinced.
    What's your take? Why the lack of confidence?

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    Quote Originally Posted by JayBee View Post
    15 years ago:

    3.2 million passengers a year from international airport
    Klein rumbles about taking over and reopening YXD
    Office tower vacancy hovers near 20%
    Tim Hortons has not yet bothered to open downtown
    empty old Bay building contemplated for demolition
    Open mockery of the city in the Globe and Mail
    Unemployed former provincial bureaucrats flood job market or leave province
    LRT stopped dead in its tracks at University Station, no active plans for extension
    More panhandlers than pedestrians on Jasper every evening and weekend
    Hall D, Commonwealth concourse expansion, and Odyssium expansion are the "good" news.

    Thankfully, I already don't recognise this place!
    In 1995, news media referred to Edmonton as the future Las Vegas North when Baccarat Casino project was announced. I still remember them saying that.

  8. #108
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    I predict that if this development is built as the renderings show and with LRT there ... minutes from downtown it will be the most successful development in Edmonton's history.

  9. #109
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    ^This development could be extremely important if done right. LRT especially is the key.
    LRT is our future, time to push forward.

  10. #110

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    Quote Originally Posted by buildings View Post
    I have a friend who works for Strathearn Heights and they've told me: 1) they have been gearing up internally to go (i.e. not renewing leases in some of the existing buildings), and 2) the owner (or perhaps the major stake holder?), suffered a major stroke while in Europe sometime in the last 7 to 10 days and now they are unsure of the future of the development.

    Did anyone have any more info on this project? Is it on hold?

  11. #111
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    Last I heard (at the Strathearn Jane's Walk), they are planning to co-ordinate construction with the Valley Line LRT construction, so it's still in the works, but no shovels in the ground for another year or two.

  12. #112
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    What I heard from the developer as well.
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    Maybe part of the delay is related to one of the investment partners having a heart attack or stroke a few months back.

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    Any word on the status of this?

  15. #115
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    For sale
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  16. #116

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    Boo. Hopefully someone pics it up and puts some nice stuff in the area. If a 12-18 floor nice (mid to high end) condo tower were to go up as part of the redevelopment, I would for sure consider penthouse or sub penthouse (depending on available amenities in the redevelopment). Strathearn is still my fav neighbourhood in the city with some of the best views of DT.

  17. #117

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    ^^That must be a very recent development.

  18. #118
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    Nope.
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  19. #119
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    Frustrating.

  20. #120
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    Disappointing as this would have been a great development. Oh well, one day something will happen on the site, and with future LRT etc it will be a great location.

  21. #121

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    Some of the retail portion has legs. Supposedly, ground floor CRU's, offices and rentals above.

  22. #122

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    I don't think another developer will buy the lot until the LRT is under consrtuciton.
    Edmonton first, everything else second.

  23. #123
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    It will happen.
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  24. #124

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    No doubt. Too prime of realestate not to.

  25. #125

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    Quote Originally Posted by ctzn-Ed View Post
    No doubt. Too prime of realestate not to.
    Perhaps Strathearn residents will be lucky enough to get one of those easily demolished, mediocre-at-best, suburban wastelands you seem to favour. After all, we should be glad our developer overlords want to build anything at all, right ctzn-Ed?

  26. #126
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    Talked to the developers last night at the Strathearn Sessions/Community League AGM. They bought the southeast corner bit that they didn't own before (Ralph's Handimart, etc.) and are doing a minor re-design to incorporate that section into the project. Planning to start construction with that section in spring 2016.

  27. #127
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    Good to hear... curious to know who is all involved now.
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  28. #128
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    Looked like the same guys as always. Nearctic or whatever they're called.

  29. #129
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    Partnered with a group from MTL last I recall, Rockwell.
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  30. #130
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    Don't feed the trolls!

  31. #131
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    They (Nearctic) were pitching the site for sale for awhile. I wonder if they have landed someone?

  32. #132
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    ^^I see that and raise you


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    My understanding is it was some kind of Nearctic internal re-organizing that scuttled the "sale". The strip mall will become CRU's with several storey's of rental units above.

    There was another consultant at the Strathearn CL AGM pitching a nice-looking infill development on 91st across from Red OX/Wired Cup. Two lots becoming 12/13 units.

  34. #134
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    Please.

    I love my hood. This is the icing on an already delicious cake.

  35. #135

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    Public meeting about the Strathearn Heights altered DC2 application is scheduled for Sept. 29 at Gabrielle Roy school.

  36. #136
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    Curious to see what changes there are.
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  37. #137

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    While the seemingly endless wait for development begins, Juniper Cafe and Bistro is close to opening in the Strathearn Centre strip mall (in the old Strathearn Pub space). The paper is off the windows and it looks fantastic.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ajs View Post
    While the seemingly endless wait for development begins, Juniper Cafe and Bistro is close to opening in the Strathearn Centre strip mall (in the old Strathearn Pub space). The paper is off the windows and it looks fantastic.
    The old Crack den and brothel being something anyone normal wants to go to is a big step.
    Too bad the rest of the development is taking no steps... Any time now!

  39. #139

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    In the meantime however, Strathearn Centre is experiencing quite a renaissance. The Alberta Council for Ukrainian Arts moved in, Cohen Corner (bookstore/cafe) has lingered longer than I expected, and of course Juniper Bistro. Short/no leases and discounted, older CRU's seem to be a recipe required for small time entrepreneurs to take a chance.
    It's ironic that as the mall inches closer to destruction the vibrancy quotient appears to be on an upward tick.

    ^Strathearn Pub was never as bad as it's reputation.

  40. #140
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    Quote Originally Posted by ajs View Post
    In the meantime however, Strathearn Centre is experiencing quite a renaissance. The Alberta Council for Ukrainian Arts moved in, Cohen Corner (bookstore/cafe) has lingered longer than I expected, and of course Juniper Bistro. Short/no leases and discounted, older CRU's seem to be a recipe required for small time entrepreneurs to take a chance.
    It's ironic that as the mall inches closer to destruction the vibrancy quotient appears to be on an upward tick.

    ^Strathearn Pub was never as bad as it's reputation.
    It was bad. It deserves its reputation.

  41. #141

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    Juniper Cafe and Bistro opens on Friday. Woot! Woot!

  42. #142
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    Strathearn back before Council Jan 25 with some changes.

    5.7
    Bylaw 17501 - To allow for the development of a transit oriented development integrated with a future LRT stop, Strathearn
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  43. #143
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    Where are they now? A look at 10 Edmonton developments that haven't gone ahead yet
    http://edmontonjournal.com/business/...gone-ahead-yet

    Strathearn redevelopment, 95 Avenue and 87 Street

    Background: An ambitious scheme to put up four high-rise towers and more than a dozen smaller buildings on nine hectares occupied by aging walkup apartments was approved in 2008, but never went ahead because of the recession.
    City council passed an updated plan in 2013 that would allow up to 1,900 rental and condo units and align with the Valley Line LRT, creating one of the largest redevelopments in a mature Edmonton neighbourhood.
    Update: Nearctic Developments, partner in the scheme with Rockwell Investments, has bought a key commercial property at the corner of 95 Avenue and 87 Street, near the future Strathearn LRT station.
    They’re still co-ordinating their construction schedule with the LRT work, and to a lesser extent the coming neighbourhood rehabilitation, but the installation of sewers, waterlines and other infrastructure is expected to start early next spring.
    This will take about six months, followed by the two years needed to build the project’s first phase of retail outlets and about 300 residential units. The entire development won’t be completed for eight to 10 years.
    “You have to dream big. If we want to be a little city, we dream small. If we want to be a big city, we dream big, and this is a big idea.” - Mayor Stephen Mandel, 02/22/2012

  44. #144
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    Such a great project from a design perspective, from a new local amenity perspective, from a TOD perspective and from a diversity of housing options perspective. This might be my favourite project outside of the Downtown.
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  45. #145
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    I'd live there.

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  47. #147

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    I don't know how that ground level will be that busy if those towers are that short.

    On the other hand, perhaps that will keep leases low enough for some more funky independants.

    Okay, I guess I like it.
    Let's make Edmonton better.

  48. #148
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    TOD
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  49. #149
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    Yeah, there will be an LRT station literally right in front of their door. I'm sure they could be very successful.

  50. #150

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    Still with the LRT they'd need the TOD to magnetise people. Easier said than done. I'd "just" add density to the development -- guarantees a captive audience. (Also easier said than done, naturally.)
    Let's make Edmonton better.

  51. #151
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    That's only two of the towers - there will be bigger ones in back of that eventually.

  52. #152
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    Please.
    Not as nice as other renderings so maybe it's coming closer to reality...you know because things generally lose the really really nice stuff when they actually go ahead.

  53. #153

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    I received a phone call from the '80s. They want their drawing back.
    Aside from that, the project looks alright.
    Edmonton first, everything else second.

  54. #154
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    A proposal for the City to pay some of the infrastructure costs for the Strathearn Heights redevelopment is going to Council's Urban Planning Committee next week (Agenda Item 6.10).

    In the current economic environment, the owners have indicated that the project’s infrastructure costs are still too high to allow development to proceed. They have requested a partnership with the City similar to the model of the Muttart site project adjacent to the Stadium LRT station. There, the developer has agreed to build public infrastructure supportive of the transit oriented development, with the City reimbursing the developer for agreed infrastructure items. In the Muttart case, the developer must start construction of residential or mixed use buildings to obtain the full amounts included in the agreement

    http://sirepub.edmonton.ca/sirepub/m...doctype=AGENDA

    So far nothing is happening on the Muttart site despite the City subsidy. If the underlying economics don't support proceeding with a private development at this time, the City shouldn't be trying to kickstart development using tax dollars. Before long there could be a line-up of other developers at City Hall wanting similar deals.

  55. #155
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    These guys, year ten still can't get it going.

  56. #156
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    http://edmontonjournal.com/news/loca...e-construction

    The company behind a much-delayed Strathearn Heights redevelopment wants the city to reimburse the cost of a $13-million pedestrian main street.

    The project is key to Edmonton’s LRT dreams for the area and was first given the green light through rezoning in 2008. But owners Rockwell Group and Nearctic Property Group said they just can’t make it work without city help.

    “We can’t borrow money to build a city street. That’s the financial obstacle,” said Patrick Adams, chief operating officer for Nearctic.

    Council’s urban planning committee approved talks with the developer Wednesday.

    Any deal would go to council for approval and could include paying for the street with the increased property taxes the redevelopment would generate. That’s similar to how the city handles contaminated land and how it funded downtown upgrades with Rogers Place.
    “Son, one day this will be an iconic structure shaping Edmonton’s skyline.”

  57. #157
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    Interesting turn of events. What about the revised valuation given the up zoning?
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    Yeah I agree.

  59. #159
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    Interesting turn in year 10 to bring this forward...

    Maybe this time, will be the time!

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    Quote Originally Posted by IanO View Post
    Interesting turn of events. What about the revised valuation given the up zoning?
    okay, what about it?

    you're assuming it went up aren't you? and that it's financeable even if it did.

    on the first assumption, maybe it's easier to look at a downtown office site to illustrate...

    if you have a cca zoned site downtown west of 100 street today, it has an allowable density of 12.0 fsr and a maximum height of 150m with an additional 50m available on discretionary basis (but no additional discretionary density so we can put that aside).

    if it takes $300 psf in hard costs plus $100 psf in soft costs to build something and the land was bought for $240 psf (or $20 psf buildable), you're probably not going to build anything if you can only sell it for $340 psf or if you can only rent it for $15 psf.

    if you doubled the density on the site to 24 fsr, the land wouldn't in fact be worth any more than it was at 12 fsr because it's still not economical to even build to the previous density. the net present value of the additional density when its something that is never going to happen is zero.

    now, compound that by saying that in exchange for that additional 12 fsr, before you start building anything at all on the site you have to provide an additional $20 in street improvements and/or landscaping and/or public art and/or affordable housing etc. now the net present value of what you're talking about isn't zero, it's less than zero - you're actually poorer off than you were before you "got" the "up zoning".

    which does make it an interesting turn of events indeed.
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  61. #161

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    Quote Originally Posted by DanC View Post
    These guys, year ten still can't get it going.
    Suburban high rises generally just don't work in Edmonton - Century Park is a failed illustration of that, also all the VFC delays. Downtown they do. People aren't dumb, they won't pay more for a 1,000 sq foot condo than for a 2,000 sq foot house a block away.

  62. #162

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    Moahunter, not everyone wants to shovel a driveway.
    Edmonton first, everything else second.

  63. #163

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    Quote Originally Posted by ThomasH View Post
    Moahunter, not everyone wants to shovel a driveway.
    Which is why downtown condo's sell well. Suburban ones are just a bad investment versus a house, unless cheap and dirty stick ones.

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    Quote Originally Posted by moahunter View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by DanC View Post
    These guys, year ten still can't get it going.
    Suburban high rises generally just don't work in Edmonton - Century Park is a failed illustration of that, also all the VFC delays. Downtown they do. People aren't dumb, they won't pay more for a 1,000 sq foot condo than for a 2,000 sq foot house a block away.
    High rises aside, town houses, the retail component, none of it has gone forward.
    Maybe the only way it's viable to them is as a whole, maybe some of the lower density items are still dependent on infrastructure upgrades.
    The City has now literally invested in this project, by gifting them an LRT station. A far more direct and likely cost effective route would have been up Connors road. The LRT was built around some what these folks have been talking about delivering. I'm actually amazed (no I'm not) that the City seems to have painted itself into a corner here of having to now adjust the infrastructure financing model to make this happen to make the LRT route the most viable.
    There is a lot of eggs in this basket.
    After 10 years though, it's just hard to think that items keep coming up or the market wasn't right at some point that prevented anything from starting.

  65. #165

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    ^too close to the refineries in the E? Or maybe just, too mature of a neighborhood? Not sure, hopefully the LRT will give the area a boost. Its a lot easier, and more of a sure bet though, to build townhomes and similar in a brand new neighborhood like Greisbach or Windermere, where you know home buyers will be checking out the show homes and similar. Same for rentals.
    Last edited by moahunter; 06-04-2017 at 06:41 PM.

  66. #166
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    Posted by Dan C:
    High rises aside, town houses, the retail component, none of it has gone forward.
    Maybe the only way it's viable to them is as a whole, maybe some of the lower density items are still dependent on infrastructure upgrades.
    The City has now literally invested in this project, by gifting them an LRT station. A far more direct and likely cost effective route would have been up Connors road. The LRT was built around some what these folks have been talking about delivering. I'm actually amazed (no I'm not) that the City seems to have painted itself into a corner here of having to now adjust the infrastructure financing model to make this happen to make the LRT route the most viable.
    There is a lot of eggs in this basket.
    After 10 years though, it's just hard to think that items keep coming up or the market wasn't right at some point that prevented anything from starting.
    I agree. Plus proximity to the river valley should make this an attractive redevelopment site. Plus the site already has a network of public streets.

    The City has already bent over backward to accommodate the demands of this developer. If they refuse to start redeveloping the site without a public subsidy perhaps it's time for them to put the property up for sale to someone who will.

  67. #167

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    There's no way the city should do more for these guys than they did for 104st, or have promised to do for 105 Ave....
    Build the streetscape improvements and make adjacent property owners who get a value boost from the improvements pay it back with an additional levy on top of their taxes.

    The owners of strathern heights get an LRT station from the city free of charge - and the detour from Connors road that massively benefits this property was decided partially based on the increased density this development would bring at the expense of a shorter route that would cost less.

    These owners are trying to make their side of the bargain count twice. Screw 'em.
    Last edited by Highlander II; 06-04-2017 at 07:30 PM.
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  68. #168
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    Quote Originally Posted by moahunter View Post
    ^too close to the refineries in the E? Or maybe just, too mature of a neighborhood? Not sure, hopefully the LRT will give the area a boost. Its a lot easier, and more of a sure bet though, to build townhomes and similar in a brand new neighborhood like Greisbach or Windermere, where you know home buyers will be checking out the show homes and similar. Same for rentals.
    What are you talking about? Refineries are 50 blocks away...you would have no idea living here about any of that.
    The rest of your post makes it sound like they built something to look at and people aren't coming. There's nothing to look at, not even firm renderings let alone floor plan.
    Just a really plain strip mall and some well kept but very old apartments, blocks of them.

  69. #169

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    Quote Originally Posted by ThomasH View Post
    Moahunter, not everyone wants to shovel a driveway.
    Even the City's most optimistic & unrealistic vision for densification is 80%+ of growth occurring in SFH-dominated neighbourhoods on the periphery, so while many people don't want to shovel a driveway, or mow a lawn, or any of all the additional chores that having a house entails they're more than willing to put up with the inconvenience to maintain their higher standards of living.
    Giving less of a damn than ever… Can't laugh at the ignorant if you ignore them!

  70. #170

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    A significant portion of those 80% of new homes that are Greenfield are not single family. Lots of apartments and townhouse condos going up on the edge of town.
    There can only be one.

  71. #171

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    So when I was looking at houses I dove through this area to see what I could find, which was nothing. I was surprised to see that there was no movement at this site whatsoever. Neighbourhood renewal however is in full swing.
    "Do you give people who already use transit a better service, or do you build it where they don't use it in the hopes they might start to use it?" Nenshi

  72. #172
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    Last I recall of this project the developers were asking for several million from the city to ensure the streetscape for the main boulevard would be nice. Was there any movement on that?

  73. #173

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    Quote Originally Posted by Aaron_Lloyd View Post
    Last I recall of this project the developers were asking for several million from the city to ensure the streetscape for the main boulevard would be nice. Was there any movement on that?
    They also want the city to buy the roads from my understanding and no... I’m led to believe that it’s a deadlock and a game of funding chicken.

  74. #174
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    “You have to dream big. If we want to be a little city, we dream small. If we want to be a big city, we dream big, and this is a big idea.” - Mayor Stephen Mandel, 02/22/2012

  75. #175
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    CoE will throw 5$ million+ each for crappy pocket parks that do nothing, or $86 million on a library refurb that somehow made the building uglier... but $13 million to get some actually nice walkable development going is apparently a bridge too far...

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