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Thread: Hyatt Place Hotel (10151 96 St.) | Hotel | Completed

  1. #1401

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    Quote Originally Posted by The_Cat View Post
    I think the Hyatt is about 3-5 years ahead of the rest of the area in terms of development. The UCAMA, LRT and possibly the Aldritt would really add to this area.
    You are on point IMO. When he persued this project, any half brainer would have concluded that he was setting up residence for an early start keeping in mind true success would come down the line. Little did I know, an experienced and prominent developer had the vission of a magic wand expectation. This area has been dead since, AT LEAST, 1980 as that spring/summer was my first trip into Edmonton since I arrived to Canada mid November 1979. Decrepit the area was during my first visit, so it is safe to say this area was already stagnant 10 years before that, so let's do the math now...that would be close to half a century of degradation. This project from ground up is four years now, and he is complaining it is not developing fast enough while far more lucrative areas are struggling to rid itself of those dirt lots. Look at Ian's block; from there,go down to the point of the river; look at north of the arena, look at west of ID in the Urban warehouse...do you folks see what I see? Emty lots that are way more appetizing than this area currently; He knew about our stagnation for over 3 decades then he gives this crap of an excuse.

    This is just my conjecture, but here is my take. He developed there because he couldn't compete with larger local developers, so he went to built on the cheap side. There is nothing with that, but, to play in this area, you need long patience and deep pockets. The problem APPEARS to be that he was too cheap or didn't care about fixing the pigeon issue; the fact that the pigeon decided their vent would make a great bathroom. The fact that he thought biohazard was not a concern and neglected to clean it up. A vent is an opening/pathogen for airborne delimas to enter the actual rooms, dining, lounge, and kitchen. Birds have potential of carrying viruses and diseases. Anyone here on this forum dare to go and stay overnight, dine, and hop over their lounge for their latest offerings pigeon poo spice? No matter where you are in that hotel, you will be expose to some level of that lovely dried pigeon spice. Do you think Hyatt would want to be associated with that, and that is the reason why they annulled the relation. God forbid should that spice happen to be tainted and guests ingest that. If you're directly in this city, you just put 1.4 million people in danger; if you are a guest from Toronto staying at the hotel, you go home and endanger a city of 6,5 million ( 4 largest metro in N America). Anyone else want to blame it on slow development?
    Or, should we hold him accountable for his action and damaging words. May i remind all forumers that Mr ChrisD has informed us HealyFord project is trying to secure finance for the second tower. These investors has already have slight reservation hence the delay in start. Do you think a negative statement from a reputable local developer with acute knowledge of city will help or harm such projects. Remember, this is a pension fund group not developers not expert developers. From my own experience, when I'm unknowledgeable of something, but I have to make a decision that is tangible to it, I will become hesitant and reluctant out of fear of making a mistake. HealyFord will cost way more than this hotel ( my guest 450- 500 million). Do we want prominent businessman conducting themselves with blatant disregard for our city's future like that? Hyatt didn't annul because of substandard development as they mist likely already knew; I think it someone someone who did upkeep to Hyatt image and standard. I'm quite surprised the health board has not looked into the pigeon issues.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marcel Petrin View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Spudly View Post
    When is the branding actually removed? It was still a Hyatt about a half-hour ago.
    He'll probably try to make Hyatt pay for the removal.
    There are probably terms in the contract on acceptable conditions, if the health board is involved I doubt Prem has a cause to sue.

  3. #1403

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    " Probably" is not the correct term; "mandatory" is more fitting. This is a franchise with a specific standard protocol practice set by them. Any basic cheap hotelier would have much higher standard than what this gentleman has offered us. This is third world standard plain and simple, and If any one objects to that, go and visit the hotel. stay a night, dine and drink at that establishment and ingest the bird "shots." That is the only way you'lI change my mind about the sarcastic inuendos. I would imagine ebola, and what ever else of that magnitude would most Ikely require just a small particle here and there and you're affected. Im not suggesting that to be the case at that hotel, but after three flights arriving to America last week with people dropping like dead flies, do we keep wanting to cheerlead a risk taker over the importance of proper and respectful contractual obligations which would include trivial basic health ...


    @Replacement: I respect that notion, but my principles were base on complete decent fairness. Had he just acknowledge his mistake or lack of insight, I wouldn't have gone that way. You'll most likely asked for proof, but I think I hypothesized that with quite sound logic whereas the developer did not. He gave a kindergarten of an excuse for a less than stellar performance. A very wise businessman taught me this: don't let pride cloud your judgement or acceptance...
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    Quote Originally Posted by ctzn-Ed View Post
    ... A very wise businessman taught me this: don't let pride cloud your judgement or acceptance...
    maybe you could also ask that very wise businessman to teach you the difference between using hindsight with nothing on the line and using foresight with everything on the line?
    "If you did not want much, there was plenty." Harper Lee

  5. #1405

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    I get what you saying; if I was into development, I would- certainly one wouldn't start out on that scale. The context of that usage is on a different scale. He could of easily rephrase the situation to be diplomatic with the same content; the problem for me was, on the news, the prime factor of the decision was that development was not fast enough. Do you honestly believe that was the case? From experiences, i gathered you have longer history of insights of the past than I do. Did I see a different Bronx or Harlem than you did? True, i did not gambled in this area with my money; but, I also know this, if I gambled in an area that has stood stagnant for well over 3 decades- minimum- I shouldn't expect a return to the glory for at least two decades especially when the character knew of the history of this area and the more appetizing locations. Do you think once your project is complete in that area, it is going to shift into complete 5th gear in terms of development? Right after that hotel was completed, your project and the Hat came on board with Aldritt simmering. A few blocks north, just south of the LRT, have also transformed. How much faster can we go with our net migration? The pace he is suggesting of development to the area would be akin to Vancouver or Toronto. It is possible for this area to be built out in 5 years if net migration to the city can reach the plateau of 50 - 100k annually. However, we have to accept reality. When risking in this manner with its history and all the visible scars all over desirable part of downtown still remains, this is the outcome. He just has to be patient, and most likely you as well- unless your endeavor has already garnered that. I just loathe whining and complaining when one knows the risk. Don't cry foul when you chase a tiger and you get clawed or mauled. No I did not invest in development, but no one put a gun to his head either. Welcome to entrepreneurialism and capitalism!

    I'm interest to know , from your experience of both living and developing in this city along with the knowledge of our history, how long do you think it'll be before this area is semi activated from this point on? I say some activation in 10 years, and full activation in around 20 years. I assessed base on a non developer's perspective with knowledge of how growth and stagnation has occurred over 3 decades. I have also observed Vancouver and Toronto with their dynamics to understand how quick migration can spur development, and I used all culminated metrics to conclude that.
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    Quote Originally Posted by sundance View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Marcel Petrin View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Spudly View Post
    When is the branding actually removed? It was still a Hyatt about a half-hour ago.
    He'll probably try to make Hyatt pay for the removal.
    There are probably terms in the contract on acceptable conditions, if the health board is involved I doubt Prem has a cause to sue.
    It was a joke.

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    ^^

    i'm not sure if i can add anything of substance to your comments given that "all culminated metrics" have already been allowed for...

    other than noting that no area redevelops instantly, it can easily take 20 years or longer from beginning to end (the redevelopment of yaletown and false creek in vancouver started 40 years ago and still aren't completed while the redevelopment of queen/king streets and yonge street and bloor street and the waterfront in toronto started longer ago than that). but even if it does take 20 years or more for an area to redevelop, that doesn't mean that no projects will be viable for that length of time. the prime sites and the prime streets within the area should certainly be able to support viable projects within the first 3 - 5 years of that 20. given that it can take 1 - 3 years or more to complete a project, you could say that means that, theoretically at least, the right project on the right site should be capable of being starting at almost any time.

    at the time prem committed to the hyatt place, there are a number of things that were represented as being completed prior to completion of the hotel including infrastructure upgrades in the immediate area (including better access to the hotel than has ever been provided), completion of the new museum by ucama, completion of the five corners tower plus a number of other then-planned for projects and improvements. interestingly enough, one of the things that probably wasn't on the agenda was the complete closure of 102 avenue for 2 plus years which isn't helping anyone in the area.

    so, did prem roll the dice and lose? did the house change the odds after the dice were rolled or were the dice loaded? did prem do everything he could not to be in the position he is today? is prem - appropriately or not - responsible for some or all of what's currently under discussion including the consequences for him and the quarters and the city? i suppose you'll have to ask prem to answer those things. although given what you've accused him of, i rather doubt that conversation is likely to happen any time soon.
    Last edited by kcantor; 09-09-2018 at 07:24 PM.
    "If you did not want much, there was plenty." Harper Lee

  8. #1408

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    My metrics could always improve and even after the improved metrics, there are more spaces to improve until I'm dead as no two days are the same

    As per your perspective on progression, you summed it up to how I thought - in general. I would agree with the strategy of the major impetus arterial to be priority and developed for many aspects. As I stated with my previous post, I could see medium activation 8-10 years from now and full potential in 20-earliest. We both know this area had to have stagnated as late as 1970 as I recalled the stench of old/neglect in 1980 as a 10yr old in all those buildings as that was where the original Chinatown was. I can still recall that stale smell. Thank for your input as that was a validation for me from a general perspective - without much strategy ruminating to it- for my point of view from a well experienced and respected developer's perception.

    Regarding the circumstantial mishaps with planned strategies, thank you for the more detailed perspective as a developer! That said, im no developer, but i learned this during our recent big boom from 2000-2007. I saw labour shortages; I saw massive backlogs and delays; I saw developers rush into development without game plans; the greed only inflated everything creating more head aches than bennifitting. This applies to both industrial and commercial. In that rush, developers created extra problems for themselves when a cruise control would have coraled much better fruits in general costing them quite steeply- especially the oil sands and all the initial LOA. Premm went through that boom as well; he was already developing in the early 90s as I recalled articles of his ventures in the ' journal -business. ' Did Prem not witnessed delays, cancellations, over cost etc.? He knew the game , and as do you. An experienced leader in constructing in this city didn't anticipate potential delays or cancels; and he didn't have a contingency plan and just blindly threw out however millions he did? It not only happened to this city; it a universal law for chaos for every city... we aren't the only city that have projects come to a sudden halt, cancellation, or delay. If I'm telling you this right now, as a regular civilian, shouldn't a man at his stature, be prepared for what I saw up to 2007. He was acutely involved in constructing. My interpretation was he didn't do his homework well. Just like those pigeon home work he failed - a small delima and he failed. I'm sure you know him well, and I'm sure he is a great guy,; but ultimately he failed just as if you went and write an exam and fail. You wrote that exam not the delays; or what ever circumstances. If that was my money, those would have been quick preliminary thoughts and process let alone a thorough and consultations.

    I honestly think Hyatt was discusted by the pigeon issue hence their decision. If one fails a simple task such as pigeon issue, how can you not question things? That pigeon issue could have cost Hyatt quite a handsome profit should the pigeon contribute something to the population. It is reputation , financial, lawsuits, and negative media attention. Hyatt's name had a lot to lose and Prem didn't; go to Calgary and ask those folks who Prem is and their answer is, "who?" Then, ask them, " what is Hyatt?" What do think the answer would be? Who will the big time loser, and Hyatt is what I see. Then the issue of how he said it when it could have been diplomatic, and a salvage for everyone; I pray to God this did not reach the pensioner's group involved with the Healy Ford. That project is too vital for our city. People divesting money in such manner listen to leaders in the industry as they just want profit. He exposed our weakness when we should maintained quiet with diplomacy- no different than that saying " keep the dirty secret inhouse."
    " The strength of a man is in the stride he walks."

  9. #1409

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    Let's buy the building for cents on the dollar and all move in.
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  10. #1410

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    Quote Originally Posted by kcantor View Post
    ^^

    i'm not sure if i can add anything of substance to your comments given that "all culminated metrics" have already been allowed for...

    other than noting that no area redevelops instantly, it can easily take 20 years or longer from beginning to end (the redevelopment of yaletown and false creek in vancouver started 40 years ago and still aren't completed while the redevelopment of queen/king streets and yonge street and bloor street and the waterfront in toronto started longer ago than that). but even if it does take 20 years or more for an area to redevelop, that doesn't mean that no projects will be viable for that length of time. the prime sites and the prime streets within the area should certainly be able to support viable projects within the first 3 - 5 years of that 20. given that it can take 1 - 3 years or more to complete a project, you could say that means that, theoretically at least, the right project on the right site should be capable of being starting at almost any time.

    at the time prem committed to the hyatt place, there are a number of things that were represented as being completed prior to completion of the hotel including infrastructure upgrades in the immediate area (including better access to the hotel than has ever been provided), completion of the new museum by ucama, completion of the five corners tower plus a number of other then-planned for projects and improvements. interestingly enough, one of the things that probably wasn't on the agenda was the complete closure of 102 avenue for 2 plus years which isn't helping anyone in the area.

    so, did prem roll the dice and lose? did the house change the odds after the dice were rolled or were the dice loaded? did prem do everything he could not to be in the position he is today? is prem - appropriately or not - responsible for some or all of what's currently under discussion including the consequences for him and the quarters and the city? i suppose you'll have to ask prem to answer those things. although given what you've accused him of, i rather doubt that conversation is likely to happen any time soon.
    Thanks Ken, for this post. As I stated the 2year delay in RAM opening (was projected to be early 2017) has also not helped. Also, I was just looking at 2012 City projections saying that a DT bordering Quarters RAM would be completed in 2015.

    Galleria also not going forward.

    I think even the mass construction throughout downtown is discouraging visits. Theres just too much disruption.
    "if god exists and he allowed that to happen, then its better that he doesn't exist"

  11. #1411

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    Quote Originally Posted by Marcel Petrin View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Spudly View Post
    When is the branding actually removed? It was still a Hyatt about a half-hour ago.
    He'll probably try to make Hyatt pay for the removal.
    haha, right on point there Marcel, quite the dodgy, and I use this term loosely, businessman.

    He leaves his stamp on whatever project he touches, and the stamp requires very strong cleaners to remove...

    ...greasy...
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    Another take on the Hyatt situation, this one on the side of the owner:
    https://edmontonsun.com/opinion/colu...ash-a-mosquito

  13. #1413

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    Just amazing how they spin these stories. Hicks is sooo wrong.

    This hotel was plagued right from the get go. Owner is too cheap, they order all sorts of stuff from China. Hyatt says: NO, you can't operate. So hotel was delayed by 6 months or so until upgrades were done.

    Original GM was let go.

    Hyatt standards were never met and this keep dragging on. The deflagging of the brand was decided in the summer/late spring 2018. The poop thing was so coincidental. Hyatt had already set the September date long before.

    Some good journalism is needed here!

  14. #1414

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    You have inside information I suppose?

  15. #1415

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    I like the Hicks story. The violation publication was heavy handed. It'll cost dearly, the worst scenario being the owner walks out. Then what? Nobody else would touch this location.

    As for the pigeon poop seriously.

    Go to Vancouver, Victoria, and you won't find a hotel rooftop that isn't absolutely infested with seagulls or pigeons, and their poop.

    But more to the point the hotel is now irreparably damaged and to what end point? No open hotel at all?
    "if god exists and he allowed that to happen, then its better that he doesn't exist"

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    I’m sure if the Aldritt gets built, the former Hyatt will be resurrected. This hotel, and the Alberta Hotel, have had some challenges.
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    Quote Originally Posted by The_Cat View Post
    I’m sure if the Aldritt gets built, the former Hyatt will be resurrected. This hotel, and the Alberta Hotel, have had some challenges.
    just for clarification for those who might be unaware, the alberta hotel is not a hotel and in its current iteration has never been a hotel. it is a completely occupied office building/broadcasting facility that happens to have some main floor retail space which has had several restaurant operators that have struggled and technically isn't even in the quarters, it's downtown.
    Last edited by kcantor; 14-09-2018 at 06:45 PM.
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  18. #1418

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    I may have missed something but I too am baffled as to why this hotel's health violation was made public.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Vincent View Post
    I may have missed something but I too am baffled as to why this hotel's health violation was made public.
    His reputations precedes him I guess....but yeah strange....not like we see every violation that occurs in the roach filled establishments in Chinatown.....

  20. #1420

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    Quote Originally Posted by kcantor View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by The_Cat View Post
    I’m sure if the Aldritt gets built, the former Hyatt will be resurrected. This hotel, and the Alberta Hotel, have had some challenges.
    just for clarification for those who might be unaware, the alberta hotel is not a hotel and in its current iteration has never been a hotel. it is a completely occupied office building/broadcasting facility that happens to have some main floor retail space which has had several restaurant operators that have struggled and technically isn't even in the quarters, it's downtown.
    Thanks for that as I had thought a new hotel was going up.
    " The strength of a man is in the stride he walks."

  21. #1421

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    Quote Originally Posted by Replacement View Post
    I like the Hicks story. The violation publication was heavy handed. It'll cost dearly, the worst scenario being the owner walks out. Then what? Nobody else would touch this location.

    As for the pigeon poop seriously.

    Go to Vancouver, Victoria, and you won't find a hotel rooftop that isn't absolutely infested with seagulls or pigeons, and their poop.

    But more to the point the hotel is now irreparably damaged and to what end point? No open hotel at all?

    To repair damage, I would suspect new ownership would most likely be the best fit.
    " The strength of a man is in the stride he walks."

  22. #1422

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    Here's Hicks' wretched opinion in one sentence:

    Of course we need laws, bylaws rules and regulations; but heaven forbid they should ever be enforced.

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    Quote Originally Posted by maclac View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Vincent View Post
    I may have missed something but I too am baffled as to why this hotel's health violation was made public.
    His reputations precedes him I guess....but yeah strange....not like we see every violation that occurs in the roach filled establishments in Chinatown.....
    Restaurant health inspections (the good, bad and the ugly) and public health enforcement orders have been posted online for the past ten years. Before heading out, you may wish to check out your favourite greasy spoon here:

    https://www.albertahealthservices.ca...rantIndex.aspx

  24. #1424

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    Quote Originally Posted by East McCauley View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by maclac View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Vincent View Post
    I may have missed something but I too am baffled as to why this hotel's health violation was made public.
    His reputations precedes him I guess....but yeah strange....not like we see every violation that occurs in the roach filled establishments in Chinatown.....
    Restaurant health inspections (the good, bad and the ugly) and public health enforcement orders have been posted online for the past ten years. Before heading out, you may wish to check out your favourite greasy spoon here:

    https://www.albertahealthservices.ca...rantIndex.aspx
    Yes, of course they are. But then theres the press decision to make something like that front page news which rarely if ever occurs. THATS the difference. This story, for some reason hit every news outlet. Even other hotels have had problems and it didn't hit front page. Especially given the nature of the violations. Birds on a roof top defecating? That describes every urban rooftop everywhere.

    This taken from the actual breaking news source article;

    "A populous pest

    Mars Baldisimo, office manager with Pest Force, a company that specializes in commercial extermination jobs, said pigeon infestations are a common problem in the city's commercial buildings.

    A roost of the birds can quickly make a major mess, he said.

    "The smells are pretty bad, especially if there is an accumulated amount of droppings," Baldisimo said. "We've seen some pretty horrible ones."

    You could check 500 other buildings right now and probably 400 would fail the same degree of circumspection. In Vancouver or Victoria hardly any would pass. We stayed in a place in Victoria where dried up bird **** would blow in from the copious amounts on the roof top if you so much as had the window open.
    Last edited by Replacement; 14-09-2018 at 10:01 PM.
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  25. #1425

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    The unfortunate thing here is this hotel was considered a crown jewel here no less than a couple years ago. People were ecstatic about a building and design that left people floored with its elegance and unique look. One of the better buildings in all of Edmonton. It so greatly exceeded the expectations of the area the excitement was unique, real, and deserved.

    Now I tune into this SAME thread in 2018 and I read people saying Prem cheaped out on this and that and was a tightwad etc.

    How quickly we turn on developments here.


    Theres a huge point missing here in the discussion. This owner put a huge amount of $ on the line and is bleeding money on this hotel and its now not a Hyatt and essentially with a lack of development in the area this is dead in the water. Thanks as well due to damaging articles and features that greatly exaggerated the concerns found in this property.

    I can almost guarantee that EVERY hotel that has been open longer in this city has had far worse problems. Anybody here ever work in a hotel?
    I won't name names or tell stories about roach hotels and roach kitchens in high end hotels in this city. Problems that have existed for decades.
    "if god exists and he allowed that to happen, then its better that he doesn't exist"

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    ^The claim that "we turn on developments here" strikes me as unwarranted certainly in this case.

    If you go back through this thread, even when some on this forum were saluting this development for its unique design, others (especially those with first hand knowledge of the development industry) were expressing concerns about the owner's business practices even back then.

    Of course the media is going to take a greater interest in a public health enforcement order against a high profile hotel like Hyatt Place than, for example, a small restaurant like Urban China that very few people know about and was recently ordered to close by AHS. But I've yet to see anything to support the contention in Graham Hicks' column that the former Hyatt was somehow singled out for unfair treatment by AHS.

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    I am still glad that this hotel was built where it was built and considering the risk that this owner took considering the area I don't have any harsh words for him. If anything the only harsh words I have for anyone is for those property owners that have been sitting on their property for decades waiting for a big big payout from an actual developer to buy their land off of them in the quarters. I really do hope that one or two more developments that have been proposed for the area can start so that the promise of the area can begin to meet its potential.
    LRT is our future, time to push forward.

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    ^Agreed. Though I've never done business with him either.

  29. #1429

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    Quote Originally Posted by East McCauley View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by maclac View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Vincent View Post
    I may have missed something but I too am baffled as to why this hotel's health violation was made public.
    His reputations precedes him I guess....but yeah strange....not like we see every violation that occurs in the roach filled establishments in Chinatown.....
    Restaurant health inspections (the good, bad and the ugly) and public health enforcement orders have been posted online for the past ten years. Before heading out, you may wish to check out your favourite greasy spoon here:

    https://www.albertahealthservices.ca...rantIndex.aspx
    Thanks for the link, but why are the violations mentioned in the article not listed here?

    https://www.albertahealthservices.ca...earchStr=hyatt

    The last violation noted was in March of this year and it says:

    Violation noted:
    The handwash facilities are inadequate.
    There are inadequate facilities provided for handwashing in the food preparation area.

    Requirement\Proper procedure:
    (a) The food preparation hand basin must be accessible at all times.

    Remarks
    All critical violations rectified at this time. No further action required.

    And that is in fact the only inspection listed which mentions any critical violations at all. An inaccessible hand basin which was rectified at the time of the inspection. Perhaps there were some boxes blocking access to it. That doesn't sound at all like what the article said. Again, I must be missing something.
    Last edited by Vincent; 15-09-2018 at 10:06 AM.

  30. #1430
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    ^OK, that's weird. The Executive Officer Orders link worked fine yesterday but this morning doesn't seem to load.

    Regardless, Google never forgets. Here is a direct link to the Order in question: https://www.albertahealthservices.ca...-24-2018-a.pdf

  31. #1431

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    Quote Originally Posted by East McCauley View Post
    ^The claim that "we turn on developments here" strikes me as unwarranted certainly in this case.

    If you go back through this thread, even when some on this forum were saluting this development for its unique design, others (especially those with first hand knowledge of the development industry) were expressing concerns about the owner's business practices even back then.

    Of course the media is going to take a greater interest in a public health enforcement order against a high profile hotel like Hyatt Place than, for example, a small restaurant like Urban China that very few people know about and was recently ordered to close by AHS. But I've yet to see anything to support the contention in Graham Hicks' column that the former Hyatt was somehow singled out for unfair treatment by AHS.
    Like I said earlier the City could do a mass inspection on virtually every high profile hotel in this city and find health code violations. Interestingly they have through the decades. But these are rarely if ever published. I could really tell a lot of stories here and won't. I've also known individuals that would be contracted to go into these places and clean up due to found code violations. The thing that I find most interesting is that not all violations are posted even on the AHS site. Indeed if they did the lists would be astronomically long as they used to be. I have a hard time believing that such violations have decreased when exterminators are constantly saying these are the worst times for roach and bed bug etc infestations that they have ever seen in Edmonton. Yet the AHS failed inspections list is the shortest I've seen. Odd.

    Theres something missing here. Seems to me high profile establishments are granted more immunity, typically, more leeway, or something, before reporting documentations are finalized and put online. Go on the AHS site and its invariably end of the road type extablishments listed. The only place of note on any of the years lists other than the Hyatt is the Noorish restaurant.
    "if god exists and he allowed that to happen, then its better that he doesn't exist"

  32. #1432

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    I personally know the health inspector who filed this report for the Hyatt so I believe she was just doing her job and honestly reporting her findings and so I have no problem with that, but I really think the CBC in this case acted very irresponsibly by posting that story. This kind of information is easily misconstrued by the public because they don't understand the reality of the situation and as a business owner myself I'm always aware of how vulnerable we are to the court of public opinion. Positive reviews will contribute to your success but negative reviews will ruin you and if those reviews are fair and balanced then you deserve what you get but a negative review rarely tells the full story.

    And a customer review is one thing, but a media story is on a whole different level. I also find it interesting that the CBC story was written anonymously.

  33. #1433
    I'd rather C2E than work!
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    ^ Why are you singling out the CBC? Was the CBC the news outlet that broke the story of the failed health inspection? On this thread SDM first provided a link to the CBC site. But the Hyatt fail has been reported by every other Edmonton news organization. Then was picked up by CNN, according to the Hicks article today.

    Either someone at Alberta Health or somebody employed by the Hyatt released the report to the media.

  34. #1434

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    CNN? If true, the nightmare which I, hypothetically, thought of has come true.
    " The strength of a man is in the stride he walks."

  35. #1435

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    Quote Originally Posted by North Guy66 View Post
    ^ Why are you singling out the CBC? Was the CBC the news outlet that broke the story of the failed health inspection?
    That was my assumption but now that you mention it, I'm not sure.

  36. #1436

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    Quote Originally Posted by Replacement View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by East McCauley View Post
    ^The claim that "we turn on developments here" strikes me as unwarranted certainly in this case.

    If you go back through this thread, even when some on this forum were saluting this development for its unique design, others (especially those with first hand knowledge of the development industry) were expressing concerns about the owner's business practices even back then.

    Of course the media is going to take a greater interest in a public health enforcement order against a high profile hotel like Hyatt Place than, for example, a small restaurant like Urban China that very few people know about and was recently ordered to close by AHS. But I've yet to see anything to support the contention in Graham Hicks' column that the former Hyatt was somehow singled out for unfair treatment by AHS.
    Like I said earlier the City could do a mass inspection on virtually every high profile hotel in this city and find health code violations. Interestingly they have through the decades. But these are rarely if ever published. I could really tell a lot of stories here and won't. I've also known individuals that would be contracted to go into these places and clean up due to found code violations. The thing that I find most interesting is that not all violations are posted even on the AHS site. Indeed if they did the lists would be astronomically long as they used to be. I have a hard time believing that such violations have decreased when exterminators are constantly saying these are the worst times for roach and bed bug etc infestations that they have ever seen in Edmonton. Yet the AHS failed inspections list is the shortest I've seen. Odd.

    Theres something missing here. Seems to me high profile establishments are granted more immunity, typically, more leeway, or something, before reporting documentations are finalized and put online. Go on the AHS site and its invariably end of the road type extablishments listed. The only place of note on any of the years lists other than the Hyatt is the Noorish restaurant.
    I can't imagine the health board would single out anyone. Do we know the relationship Prem has had with the board in the past? As per the pigeons what is the code fo bird. feces to occur next or near too an air vent? I do know this. Up north, any trades working near or within an area of infestations of bird drops has the option (encouraged) to wear a 95 dust mask- with options of 1/2 mask or full facial mask with appropriate cartridges for the 🎭. We also have the option to wear tyvek suit coveralls (thin paper like/fabric) with built-in hoods. The same white coveralls seen in forensic TV shows. This all while working outside.
    " The strength of a man is in the stride he walks."

  37. #1437

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    Quote Originally Posted by kcantor View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by ctzn-Ed View Post
    ... A very wise businessman taught me this: don't let pride cloud your judgement or acceptance...
    maybe you could also ask that very wise businessman to teach you the difference between using hindsight with nothing on the line and using foresight with everything on the line?
    ^Nominated for second best quote of the year on COE.
    Last edited by Messiah; 18-09-2018 at 04:00 PM.

  38. #1438

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    Which is the first?

  39. #1439

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    Quote Originally Posted by Messiah View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by kcantor View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by ctzn-Ed View Post
    ... A very wise businessman taught me this: don't let pride cloud your judgement or acceptance...
    maybe you could also ask that very wise businessman to teach you the difference between using hindsight with nothing on the line and using foresight with everything on the line?
    ^Nominated for second best quote of the year on COE.
    First, second, or third... who is in the hot seat, and who has to do major damage control? He has other hotels with different branding(s)... Prem got the nomination for best **** up of the DECADES!

    My apologies for the animation, but it was too fitting.
    " The strength of a man is in the stride he walks."

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