Is Edmonton losing it's grasp on the retail market to other places?

[edmontonenthusiast]

**disclaimer: yes, there is comparison to Calgary in this thread, if you'd rather not read about Calgary or will just rant about bringing it up, move on**

Since it's opening, West Edmonton Mall has been a shopping paradise (whether us urbanists want to hear it or not) and nothing between Toronto and Vancouver could match it for it's retail. If an American chain was opening in Canada, often it would pick somewhere in Toronto first, then Edmonton. Edmonton had many stores before Winnipeg, Calgary, sometimes even Vancouver. Even recently, malls like Southgate and Kingsway have attracted decent tenants. Edmonton was a place of shopping, mainly for the sheer draw that West Edmonton Mall would bring to our city with it's waterpark and amusement rides to go along with the 800+ shops.

But Calgary seems to have caught up VERY quickly now. It already had stores like Crate and Barrel and Pottery Barn that Edmonton didn't have, but for the most part I'd like to thing we outdid Calgary.

Calgary has been going through some mall expansions lately that are far more impressive than Kingsway or Southgate. Chinook Mall and the new "Core" (former Eaton's Centre), and supported slightly by the new Cross Iron Mills Mall are attracting a slough of new retailers formerly only in Edmonton for the Prairies or Alberta (or sometimes western Canada). On top of that, it's getting even more. Just recently, Calgary opened the first LEGO Store in Canada for example! Calgary already has 2 Apple Stores versus our one. It's new Holt Renfrew is impressive and huge in size.

Then there's this:

Originally Posted by Plus15

Aside from the recently announced Lego Store, here is the most up to date list of stores coming to the Chinook expansion: *takes a deep breath*

Abercrombie & Fitch
Hollister Co.
Flatiron Grill
Michael Kors
BCBG MaxAzria
Mexx (relocation/expansion)
Teenflo
Diesel
Kiehl's
Coach
Guess
Lacoste
Oakley
Skechers
Geox
Harry Rosen
Miss Sixty/Energie
Marciano
Apple
Forever XXI
Chop (outparcel next to theatres)
Phil & Sebastian
Chachi's
Swarovski
Browns
Calvin Klein Jeans
Via Uno
Joneve
DC Shoes
Le Chateau Menswear
Bench
Lush
Steve Madden
Crisca
Volcom Jeans
Levis Store

Talk about becoming completely market dominant in one fell swoop...and this is only about 3/4 the space available in the new wing...no other mall in Calgary will come close when it comes to store selection.

Originally Posted by Plus15

Futher store announcements for Chinook Centre in todays Herald:

A|X Armani Exchange
Godiva Chocolatier
Le Crueset Cookware

And the website is hiring for these stores now:

Fossil
Boathouse
Pusch

That is all.

Victoria's Secret PINK is opening in Cross Iron Mills, Anthropologie, Urban Outfitters, and Burberry are opening up in Chinook as well (the post I quoted is from a few months ago).

With all this now, I fail to see any retail Edmonton has over Calgary and that Calgary can now likely rival Edmonton quite well in this area. Will Edmonton's retail dominance continue to diminish to Calgary and do you think this may or may not be a problem for the attractiveness of this city (after all, you can now get all the same shopping opportunities plus more, and be an hour from Banff, no need to go out of your way to Edmonton!)?

Thoughts?

Also: this is impressive. It will be in the heart of 17 Ave, the second level is supposed to end up being an urban Future Shop, with the main level for otehr retail and the top for office. Meanwhile we get a suburban styled Future Shop right downtown and a mega Future Shop in the sprawly abyss of South Edmonton Common. Imagine this happening on the Urbia lot or former gas lot on 105 and Whyte!

[Rocket252]

Calgary is starting to dominate in all aspects over Edmonton.

The obvious ones are Business and Air Transportation but their retail trade and tourism is also overtaking Edmonton.

[edmontonenthusiast]

At least we still have the better Art Gallery (for now)!

[Ander]

http://www.edmontonjournal.com/news/...318/story.html

http://www.edmontonjournal.com/life/...615/story.html

http://www.connect2edmonton.ca/forum...ad.php?t=17966

http://www.connect2edmonton.ca/forum...ad.php?t=17878

http://www.connect2edmonton.ca/forum...ad.php?t=17502

http://www.connect2edmonton.ca/forum...ighlight=lowes


So they're not all under 1 roof. Big deal.

I am pretty jealous of the urban-style stores though. Hopefully we can get a few of those downtown eventually.

[Ander]

Originally Posted by Rocket252

Calgary is starting to dominate in all aspects over Edmonton.

The obvious ones are Business and Air Transportation but their retail trade and tourism is also overtaking Edmonton.

I'm sure that has nothing to do with Travel Alberta basically ignoring all things Edmonton...

[edmontonenthusiast]

Originally Posted by Ander

http://www.edmontonjournal.com/news/...318/story.html

http://www.edmontonjournal.com/life/...615/story.html

http://www.connect2edmonton.ca/forum...ad.php?t=17966

http://www.connect2edmonton.ca/forum...ad.php?t=17878

http://www.connect2edmonton.ca/forum...ad.php?t=17502

http://www.connect2edmonton.ca/forum...ighlight=lowes


So they're not all under 1 roof. Big deal.

I am pretty jealous of the urban-style stores though. Hopefully we can get a few of those downtown eventually.

Marshalls could easily be opening in Calgary too. Lowe's is opening in NE Calgary too. While not an official Victoria's Secret, Victoria's Secret PINK is opening there. So we have 3 stores/restaurants on them? Technically with the draw of WEM we should be doing better I'd think. Calgary is doing this with a regular retail scene and no special things that automatically boost it to another level like WEM.

[Ander]

Originally Posted by edmontonenthusiast

Marshalls could easily be opening in Calgary too. Lowe's is opening in NE Calgary too. While not an official Victoria's Secret, Victoria's Secret PINK is opening there. So we have 3 stores/restaurants on them? Technically with the draw of WEM we should be doing better I'd think. Calgary is doing this with a regular retail scene and no special things that automatically boost it to another level like WEM.

we've been doing better for 30 years. They have 1 run of exclusive stores (not so exclusive if they become profitable, as they'll expand to WEM anyway) and we're supposed to worry?

[Tzoidboy]

Originally Posted by Rocket252

Calgary is starting to dominate in all aspects over Edmonton.

The obvious ones are Business and Air Transportation but their retail trade and tourism is also overtaking Edmonton.

i disagree with the term "starting" calgary has "always" dominated in those areas..but don't forget edmonton has dominate markets to calgary AND the key is a strong diversified province

[edmontonenthusiast]

^What markets? I doubt always they had domination over us considering we were the largest and most important city for most of Alberta's history.

[Chmilz]

After seeing that list of stores going into Chinook, it makes me cry that the best new store in Kingsway is H&M (roughly translated to IKEA Clothing).

Imagine if City Centre mall had these things. Like restaurants.

[Barry N]

Apple has 2 stores in Edm [ WEM and Southgate ]

[Ander]

Originally Posted by Chmilz

After seeing that list of stores going into Chinook, it makes me cry that the best new store in Kingsway is H&M (roughly translated to IKEA Clothing).

Imagine if City Centre mall had these things. Like restaurants.

Imagine if Jasper Ave had these things

[DEESGOODWORD]

Calgary also has Restoration Hardware, Pottery Barn and Williams Sonoma. I used to shop these stores when they first came to Canada in Toronto then shopped them in Vancouver (whenever we travelled to these places). We were in Calgary last year and I checked them out but they don't seem to be the size of the other Canadian stores and Toronto has more than one store of each.
I am patiently (more like impatiently) waiting for them to open here.
I too think that if the City Centre mall had some decent stores that they would get more people down there. Even the BAY's merchandise is pathetic! You should see what their Toronto downtown store looks like and the different brands that they carry.
I believe we beat out Calgary for the first western ANTHROPOLOGIE store.

[abaka]

Order what want online.

[Ander]

yet another Edmonton-Calgary "we're better than you are" thread on C2E

[Tzoidboy]

Originally Posted by edmontonenthusiast

^What markets? I doubt always they had domination over us considering we were the largest and most important city for most of Alberta's history.

We are dominate in the markets of: oil/gas servicing, rail/truck transportation hub, access to northern markets (Fort Mac and GP), government offices/services - I would suggest we also dominate in festivals, work/life balance, river valley beauty and social mixing of people (i find calgarians to be less social).

However, I must remind everyone that we need provincial wide strengths to be leaders in Canada and the world.

[Chmilz]

^Those are great, but when I need new pants, there's crap to choose from compared to Calgary or other major metro areas.

[Mercucio]

Originally Posted by Ander

yet another Edmonton-Calgary "we're better than you are" thread on C2E

^ See EE's disclaimer in the very first post...

[Mercucio]

... Restoration Hardware is opening at Southgate. Pottery Barn and Williams-Sonoma will not be far behind.

[edmontonenthusiast]

People forget Calgary has a beautiful river parkland system too. Maybe less extensive but more used. This is really great and all that Calgary is developing a great retail scene, but it's another thing we're known for they're getting better at us in.

Originally Posted by Ander

yet another Edmonton-Calgary "we're better than you are" thread on C2E

Did you have a hard time reading the disclaimer? This thread is a comparison to Calgary, if you don't like it, don't read it.

[Komrade]

I say let em have it! I know its important for a cities 'stature' to have big name retail, but do we really want more overpriced junk?

We have Whyte, 124st, 118 ave <-- Lets focus on these retail areas. The mom and pop stores. The unique independent business. These are an area of strength we should promote heavily.

[andy8244]

Originally Posted by Tzoidboy

We are dominate in the markets of: oil/gas servicing, rail/truck transportation hub, access to northern markets (Fort Mac and GP), government offices/services - I would suggest we also dominate in festivals, work/life balance, river valley beauty and social mixing of people (i find calgarians to be less social).

However, I must remind everyone that we need provincial wide strengths to be leaders in Canada and the world.

Seriously, I don't know whether to laugh or cry?

[edmontonenthusiast]

^^ If you want to go there, Calgary has 17th, 4th, Kensington, Inglewood, Marda Loop, Stephen Ave, and Eau Claire. Of your list, the only one with "critical mass" is Whyte, from this list Calgary would have 17th, 4th, Kensington, and depending on the day, Stephen for "critical mass". Granted none of them are as developed as Whyte, they do have more variety of locations in Calgary which is also very nice.

[Ander]

Originally Posted by edmontonenthusiast

People forget Calgary has a beautiful river parkland system too. Maybe less extensive but more used. This is really great and all that Calgary is developing a great retail scene, but it's another thing we're known for they're getting better at us in.

Did you have a hard time reading the disclaimer? This thread is a comparison to Calgary, if you don't like it, don't read it.

I wouldn't call my post a rant. Maybe you should have called the thread "Is Edmonton losing its grasp on the retail market to Calgary?" though considering you didn't really provide any examples other than Calgary aside from passing mentions of Toronto and Vancouver.

[edmontonenthusiast]

Calgary was my example. But I left it open in case people had examples from Winnipeg, Vancouver, Toronto, Montreal, Ottawa, cities in the US, Europe, Australia, China, Japan, etc.

[moahunter]

It is not all bad news, WEM now has Western Canada's only Victoria Secrets (people drive to Montana just for that).

[bicycles]

Originally Posted by Komrade

I say let em have it! I know its important for a cities 'stature' to have big name retail, but do we really want more overpriced junk?

We have Whyte, 124st, 118 ave <-- Lets focus on these retail areas. The mom and pop stores. The unique independent business. These are an area of strength we should promote heavily.

exactly, who cares if we get 1 of some chains 294043 stores. let's focus on encouraging local business and promoting things that are unique to Edmonton.

[Rocket252]

The stores are not important now.

Getting business, tourism , making this city more attractive to young professionals, create an environment where people are proud to live here. If you do that then the stores will come.

Right now we are the capital city but not the most important city in this province and if people and city politicians continue to hide their head in the sand and not do anything about it we will fall further behind.

[edmontonenthusiast]

^You could apply your logic to anything. Don't worry about museums, it'll come naturally when people move here. Don't worry about city beautification, it'll come naturally when people move here. Don't worry about tourism, it'll happen when enough people make it here.

We need a decent retail scene so that people have adequate places to shop, because it's something everybody does ... be it for clothing, food, furniture, electronics, cards, shoes, décor, etc. Having a decent retail scene is a piece of the puzzle that makes a city attractive to movers and tourists. Some of the most successful and magnets of a city are fashion or retail meccas (New York, London, Tokyo, Montreal, Paris, LA, Sydney, Milan, Amsterdam, Buenos Aires, Mexico City, Barcelona, etc).

bicycles: see my post 2 down from his.

[jagators63]

calgary better back off of any Edmonton retail stores, why ? because Calgary wanted to steal spotlight for tourists from Edmonton which Edmonton have enjoyed for many years since WEM was open in 1984

[RyanS]

WEM / Edmonton wasnt always going to the be exclusive home of these stores forever in Alberta, this isnt any reason to be concerned. International chains put enourmous amounts of due dilligence and research into where they locate their stores, and this is after they the enourmous amount of research put in to what markets they will enter. Its not always so simple as saying they want to be in Edmonton. Calgary etc. Do you think Victoria Secret would have leased the paint ball space next to the HMV? And once they found the space they wanted, do you think they were happy there was a big blue whale in front of it?

Anyways, long story short, when it comes to international / national retailers Edmonton has an extremely good selection compared to many other cities this size. Calgarians were jealous of many of the stores we had first, but life goes on. Just be glad you dont have to go to Calgary to get the lastest abercrombie sweater or ipod.

[XTendEdmonton]

^ Just like to state that Victoria Secret had no issue witih the whale itself ... but rather they wanted to create a space/lounge for the men/husbands/boyfriends to chill while their ladies go psycho inside

p.s. - does anyone know if calgary has an A&F or Hollister yet?

----------------------------------------------------------------

Favorite Moment of the Day:

Yahoo Answers:
Resolved Question: Is there an abercrombie & fitch store in Calgary

Other Answers: Where is Calgary????

haha! priceless

[Brentk]

Why don't you buy a franchise and open a store? Just realize that there is more initial money in Calgary, and that seeps to Edmonton in a few years when they look to expand there presence in Alberta. Happens with most chains.

[Jimbo]

Originally Posted by Brentk

Why don't you buy a franchise and open a store? Just realize that there is more initial money in Calgary, and that seeps to Edmonton in a few years when they look to expand there presence in Alberta. Happens with most chains.

Good point.

I don't completely understand the title of the post. The retail market is us, you and I, and everyone here who shops (or doesn't shop) at those stores.

As for more/better stores opening in Calgary - those stores are opening in response to their market. They're stores, not museums. And there's no question Calgary has a far greater entrepreneurial spirit than we do. It's not even close. They take risks. We sit on our wallets.

I'm from Calgary originally, but I'm proud to call Edmonton my home. One dramatic difference I couldn't fail to notice is there's a somewhat different spirit in Calgary. Not to put too fine a point on it, but Calgary has more "doers" (that is, people who see a problem/opportunity and do something about it) while Edmonton has more "talkers" (that is, people who see a problem/opportunity and demand that somebody else do something about it).

If anyone thinks we really need more of these stores, and is convinced we have the market for it, I'd encourage them to open one up themselves, and start counting the money. And if someone else does take the risk and make the effort to open one of these stores we're so envious of, shop there.

It's somewhat telling that we have two other current threads on this forum regarding retail stores - one on what retail stores we refuse to shop at, and another rant about MEC, where the biggest complaints are that the staff spend too much time helping customers, and that said customers wear socks with sandals, and that they have a "mountain hipster attitude" (imagine that, at Mountain Equipment Co-op).

[Tzoidboy]

Originally Posted by Chmilz

^Those are great, but when I need new pants, there's crap to choose from compared to Calgary or other major metro areas.

That is a ridculous suggestion...there are many, many options in Edmonton to buy pants from Holt Renfrew, Henry Singer scale to Department Store, Vandenbergs...there is nothing available in Calgary that is not available in Edmonton

[edmontonenthusiast]

^Yet

[ChrisD]

^Oh please. The retail selection between the two cities are essentially eye-to-eye and nor will that change over time as both maintain similar household incomes, demographics and populations. These are major components that drive retail.

[XTendEdmonton]

^ True Story

[Ander]

oh yeah, Victoria's Secret PINK is opening in Kingsway too

[darrellinyvr]

Originally Posted by RyanS

WEM / Edmonton wasnt always going to the be exclusive home of these stores forever in Alberta, this isnt any reason to be concerned. International chains put enourmous amounts of due dilligence and research into where they locate their stores, and this is after they the enourmous amount of research put in to what markets they will enter. Its not always so simple as saying they want to be in Edmonton. Calgary etc. Do you think Victoria Secret would have leased the paint ball space next to the HMV? And once they found the space they wanted, do you think they were happy there was a big blue whale in front of it?

Anyways, long story short, when it comes to international / national retailers Edmonton has an extremely good selection compared to many other cities this size. Calgarians were jealous of many of the stores we had first, but life goes on. Just be glad you dont have to go to Calgary to get the lastest abercrombie sweater or ipod.

Given time yes Calgary will catch up to Edmonton retailwise. No smart company is going to pass up another large well to do Alberta market.
So A&F and Hollister and others are opening in Chinook big deal! It just means that Calgarians won't be buying up our fair share of stuff or taking up our parking..... Do people honestly expect Calgarians to shop at Sears, Tip Top forever LOL.

We still get the vast majority of International/American chains first due to the pull of WEM and people in Toronto or Montreal or New York probably have never heard of Chinook Centre. (you have to keep that in perspective)
Torontonians generally are not worried that Edmonton can rival them in Canadian "firsts" either for store branches.

By the time Calgary gets their own branches of many of these chains they are "old hat" in many repects.
A&F is hardly the "in label" it was 5 or 6 years ago. They have a Hollister in both Aberdeen, Scotland and Belfast, Northern Ireland for gawds sake. hardly cutting edge cities (check the Hollister Website for other "big cities in the UK) Milton Keynes!!!!!!!!!! LOL LOL LOL

Yes Cowtown has scored a few "firsts" over Edmonton, Crate and Barrel, Pottery Barn, and a yet another new Holt Renfrew. but that has a lot to do with appropriate space becoming available.(Burberry is no coup anyways since in the UK all the "chavs" wear it or as in Japan and China so many people wear knock off Burberry it's laughable..)

Henry Singer has had a Calgary Branch for years big deal! even the old Johnstone Walker department store had one in Palliser Square vs 4 here in Edmonton.

Also the fact still remains more people live from Red Deer north in Alberta than from Red Deer south.... not to mention other trading areas in northern BC. Saskatchewan and the territories.

Edmonton has always been more of a "mercantile" city than Calgary so I really would not sweat it if Calgary to some extent catches up. Chinook will never be more than Calgary's largest mall while WEM is still the biggest in North America (though I do wish Triple 5 would spend some $$$ and renovate it to something fitting for the 21st Century.....)

[darrellinyvr]

I forgot to mention Edmonton has many stores that Vancouver not to mention poor old Winnipeg still dreams of....

Vancouver is still waiting for A&F. Abercrombie Kids (Cowtown is not getting one of those yet either)
Anthropologie
Victoria's Secret, PINK to name a couple.

Winnipeg is still waiting for a Banana Republic, H&M (even Red Deer has one), Zara, not to mention IKEA to make an appearance.

Michael Kors is opening in WEM in August and Southgate in October so Edmonton still beats Calgary's store in September (from the Michael Kors site)

As for the rest of Chinook Centre's expansion list it is problematic for other Calgary malls as it will totally dominate the city the way WEM can and does here. We have almost eveything listed already so I cannot see us heading to Chinook to shop (whats the point) and it may mean fewer Calgarians will trek north to drop $$$ here, And here is the "but" WEM offers things Calgarians cannot due in the winter such as hit the World Waterpark or Galaxyland cheesy as they may be.

When people hit another city people tend to shop (even if they are the same outlets as home) 'cause it's "different" They will do the same here. If you buy a Hollister T in Vancouver or Hamilton ON the only difference is you pay alot more in tax otherwise the experience is the same. LOUD and DARK. yet we still do it because we are on "Holiday"

It all boils down to the fact that Alberta still has the highest disposable income in Canada and to a certain extent North America thanks to the US recession and companies know it. that's why both Edmonton and Calgary will continue to attract global brands. I'm actually suprised it has taken Calgary this long to actually catch up to us.

Again think of Wininpeg still waiting for IKEA............31 years after they opened in Alberta's first in Parkway Village here. thats a long time to wait for particleboard furniture.

[andy8244]

My wife weeps at the lack of decent retail here in Alberta. She purchases over the internet far more often nowadays – friends of ours here from Europe and the States do likewise.

[darrellinyvr]

Yeah it must be tough living in a place with no Primark or bHs, JBSports or Argos......sniff..... Such classy well respected UK High Street operations that they are.............not to mention Poundstretcher ............

[XTendEdmonton]

^^^ Thanks for putting things back in perspective darrell - I appreciate your comments

[darrellinyvr]

Originally Posted by XTendEdmonton

^^^ Thanks for putting things back in perspective darrell - I appreciate your comments

We tend to overfixate with our sibling to the south sometimes and yes I do it too LOL. And we forget that other cities our size or bigger lack a lot of what we take for granted. Ottawa has less than we do and as I previously mentioned Vancouver lacks quite a bit too for it's much biggar size. but both those cities are much closer to the states so regular cross-border shopping is a viable option for them (Winnipeg too with that world renowned mecca of Grand Forks next door ha ha )

Calgarians and Edmontonians have the options of Great Falls (yuck) or Spokane (decent but a long drive for what you basically can get here)
Also people in Grande Prairie or Fort McMurray, Saskatoon use us as the big city while Lethbridge, Medicine Hat, Regina would probably use Cowtown. Red Deer can go both ways....LOL

[darrellinyvr]

I know that Jagators started a new thread in regards to the new Tommy Flagship for WEM mentioned in Saturday's Journal but I thought that a post belonged on this thread.

Of the 3 "Tommy" Flagships announced for Canada so far, The one in West Edmonton Mall and 2 others to open in Toronto, shows that for the vast majority of "Western Canadian" premieres Edmonton still has it over other major western centres. Calgary has had a few successes in "firsts" but Edmontons only real competition in Canada seems to be Toronto.
not bad considering Edmonton has approx 1.2 million or so vs the GTA's approx 5.9 million.

Vancouver with nearly 2.5 million has had very few "firsts" except for the extreme higher end stuff such as Hermes, Tiffany's, Gucci, St John, Louis Vuitton or the Ferragamo stand alone stores along Burrard St but those more often than not tend cater to the Asian tourist trade.

Now with Chinook upping it's game and snagging some high profile stores that WEM doesn't have (ie Diese, Lego) Maybe Triple5 will actually spend some more $$$ and update that behemoth on 170St. Because if Calgarians do not have to visit Edmonton to hit stores they now have it may affect the traffic levels to some degree in the mall.

I know it's a pipedream thinking Triple5 will open the wallets and actually let the moths out. but denial is a safe cozy river...........

[darrellinyvr]

Originally Posted by jagators63

calgary better back off of any Edmonton retail stores, why ? because Calgary wanted to steal spotlight for tourists from Edmonton which Edmonton have enjoyed for many years since WEM was open in 1984

Just to give you a heads up WEM Phase1 opened in Sept 1981, Phase 2 in 83, and Phase 3 in 85.

[jagators63]

Originally Posted by darrellinyvr

Just to give you a heads up WEM Phase1 opened in Sept 1981, Phase 2 in 83, and Phase 3 in 85.

phase 4 in 1999

[darrellinyvr]

Originally Posted by jagators63

phase 4 in 1999

I personally do not regard "phase 4" as a real "phase" all they did was gut the old Woodwards space and added the Scotiabank Theatres up top. It was more of an "add on" to p3 it certainly was not on the scale of the previous additions.

They also claim that the Motor Hotel across from the northside of the mall anchors phase 5 LOL...... Triple 5 is pretty free with the word "phase" What they need to do as I have said before is update both the interior and exteriors of I,II,III to something that is considered stylish in the 21st Century, Look at the P3 food court. pink neon for crying out loud.....

[XTendEdmonton]

Originally Posted by darrellinyvr

What they need to do as I have said before is update both the interior and exteriors of I,II,III to something that is considered stylish in the 21st Century, Look at the P3 food court. pink neon for crying out loud.....

haha ... good point

Agreed!

[Edmcowboy11]

Calgary Malls
Cross Iron Mills: 206 stores
Chinook Centre: 200 stores
The Core: 160 stores
Edmonton Malls
Southgate: 154 stores
Kingsway Garden Mall: 200+ stores
City Center Mall: 170 stores
West Edmonton Mall: 800+ stores

I think when it comes to the retail industry Edmonton leads the way in most ways. On top of our malls there is of course SEC. Love it or hate it, SEC is the largest open air retail development in North America. Yes some stores may go to Calgary first, but that really doesn't mean much. If I'm not mistaken there are lots of retail businesses that have come to Edmonton first too.

[RyanS]

Originally Posted by Edmcowboy11

Calgary Malls
Cross Iron Mills: 206 stores
Chinook Centre: 200 stores
The Core: 160 stores
Edmonton Malls
Southgate: 154 stores
Kingsway Garden Mall: 200+ stores
City Center Mall: 170 stores
West Edmonton Mall: 800+ stores

I think when it comes to the retail industry Edmonton leads the way in most ways. On top of our malls there is of course SEC. Love it or hate it, SEC is the largest open air retail development in North America. Yes some stores may go to Calgary first, but that really doesn't mean much. If I'm not mistaken there are lots of retail businesses that have come to Edmonton first too.

You forgot two of Calgary's biggest, and most productive malls Market Mall and Southcentre. Even Sunridge with its new reno and retail mix could be considered in the better half of Calgary malls. In addition, once the reno's at the Core are complete it will be on the same level as anything but WEM on that list.

Right now the biggest things that seperates the 'mall' retail markets in Edmonton and Calgary is the amount of money being invested in the Calgary retail market by developers. The Core, Chinook expansion, Cross Iron, and the recently completed expansions and renos of Market, Southcentre and Sunridge exceed what's been invested in Edmonton (Kingsway and Southgate) by hundreds of millions of dollars.

Anyways I dont think its entirely accurate to say Edmonton entirely leads the way in retail (saying WEM does might better represent), but regardless Edmontonians & Calgarians I'd say are fairly blessed with the choice of international retailers at their disposal, especially when compared to other larger Canadian cities.

[darrellinyvr]

Calgary has seen far more "consistant" in reno's with each of the major malls in various sections of the city updating no argument there. Besides Kingsway and Southgate nothing has really been done locally. Manulife, and ECC both need a jolt and Londonderry is stuck in the early 90's I was in Bonnie Doon on Saturday and it has such a bizarre mix of major chains and mom and pop "leather or fashion stores" I would not call it a regional mall period.

WEM is more than content to spend as little as possible since it has the size and so called "prestige" to land branches first. Otherwise they are perfectly happy doing the absolute minimum in regards to updating the place. Sea Lions , Pink Neon, Submarines (dead yet) etc etc etc great in the 80's/90's but in 2010 tired and tacky.

I don't think anybody ever claimed that Edmonton was the total over all leader but it does seem for the vast majority of either American or International chains we seem to be the first stop or we end up with multiple branches first before Calgary examples Apple, Zara. The glaring exception is in the upscale home category with Restoration Hardware, Pottery Barn, Crate and Barrel and Williams-Sonoma opening down south first.

That both Edmonton and Calgary are well served in the retail marketplace is probably due to the fact that Alberta is still a very lucrative market compared to most other places in these recessionary times. The GTA, and the EDM-CAL corridor are the richest markets in the country. Per capita with the corridor PCI 40% over the Canadian average and 10% over the American average. this was back around 2005 but probably still holds true to some extent today especially since 2008 when the American economy tanked.

Of the other major Canadian markets Ottawa is approx the same size of both Alberta cities and is missing alot of stores we have even with a virtually recession proof government economy. Winnipeg has slipped badly in the past couple of decades and almost seems "second tier" in retail considering how many chains are not represented in Manitoba and I'm not talking "high end" either Aeropostale, H&M, IKEA To me it says something if a retailer opens at Bower Place in Red Deer before either Polo Park or St Vital in Winnipeg.......

Montreal is a rather unique case in that it has a lot of great homegrown chains that we don't such as Simons, Les Ailes and the Dutch chain JacknJones has quite a few branches in Quebec but I suspect that is due to a sightly more European sensibility they have than good old Alberta.....

Vancouver is so close to the border Bellingham might as well be considered part of greater YVR since on any given day the lots are mostly BC plates so many chains can feed that market through those branches especially with the strong Canuck dollar and Seattle isn't that far either. Grand Forks and Fargo can feed the Peg's fondness for all things USA as well and it is also a relatively easy drive to the Mall of America in Minneapolis for them.

As I mentioned previously Alberta's options are Great Falls, whoopie....... and Spokane. and if your willing to go shopping in Spokane you might as well keep heading southwast to Portland, OR with no sales tax. We made that trip from Vancouver a few times beats Seattle hands down LOL.

So in one respect our rather isolated geography has given these two large "rich" markets a hands-up, the tyranny of distance for NICE American malls and a prosperous population resulting in great selection of outlets in both cities.

[Hilman]

Sneak peek at Victoria’s Secret in Edmonton
*
Lingerie chain’s first Canadian store opens to public Thursday*
BY MARTA GOLD, EDMONTONJOURNAL.COM AUGUST 11, 2010

EDMONTON — Arguably the most hotly anticipated store opening at West Edmonton Mall in quite a while, Victoria’s Secret unveiled its coveted wares to the media Wednesday morning.

Full story: http://www.edmontonjournal.com/life/...665/story.html

From the article,

"While there are six PINK outlets in Ontario, the West Edmonton Mall store will be the first Victoria’s Secret in Canada. Victoria’s Secret plans to open four stores in Canada this year. Edmonton’s will be the only one in Western Canada."

[darrellinyvr]

On CTVnews at 6 they did a story on the opening of VS/PINK in WEM tomorrow. Looks like they are expecting every lingerie junkie provincewide ( that includes you too Calgary LOL) to show up!
They ended the piece by stating the Kingsway will be getting a PINK store in November.

So all those Calgary women will have to rely on Edmonton for "sexy lingerie" they cannot find at thier nieghbourhood Lammle's......snicker.......

[XTendEdmonton]

Originally Posted by darrellinyvr

So all those Calgary women will have to rely on Edmonton for "sexy lingerie" they cannot find at thier nieghbourhood Lammle's......snicker.......

^ tee hee

[hello lady]

Originally Posted by Ander

oh yeah, Victoria's Secret PINK is opening in Kingsway too

It has great stores, I rarely go to WEM, its crowded and most are not there to shop.I love kingsway mall.

[darrellinyvr]

Was looking on the Bench UK Clothing Website, They are opening their second Edmonton Store in Kingsway this October following Alberta's first location in Southgate this past March.

Calgary get's it's first Bench store in September..... Edmonton 2 Calgary 1

http://Bench.ca/



Next Up Who will get the first JCrew in the west? They have announced they will be expanding to Canada in the not too distant future.
My guess.....drum roll please...

Toronto either at Eaton Centre, Sherway or Yorkdale. out west the probability will be highest for WEM with a lesser initial chance at Chinook. Who knows perhaps Southgate will score first. With their coup of getting the provinces first Keihls, Bench and Edmontons first Restoration Hardware they are proving they can get the retailers, that and they have a few vacant spots to fill yet.

Time will tell.

Addendum.

Was shopping at Southgate today spoke to the Manager of the store. Bench Kingsway opens September 10 not October as stated on the website. She said they get the keys on Sept 7th followed by a three day set up then open for business.
Kingsway and Southgate seem to be making good progress and getting aggressive in opening stores that WEM doesn't have.

Southgate... Bench, Kiehls, Restoration Hardware, Street (BC Clothing co) RW&Co, Retains a Birks location.
Kingsway....Bench, RW&Co. to name a couple.
It's nice to see other Edmonton malls pulling in retailers so you do not have to brave West Edmonton for certain international brands.

If ECC and Londonderry worked at it every section of the city could have a " decent regional" centre again like downtown and Londonderry once were. I will give downtown far higher marks than Londonderry though for major chains and decent selection.

[darrellinyvr]

Looks like Diesel and DC Shoes have bailed on the Chinook Centre Expansion as they are no longer listed on the website's soon to open tenants list.