Bad Dog Owners

[baddogowners]

Hi All,

I've visited this site for many years now, I find this site very insightful, but I never have much to say about the topics here though I have finally found something that bothers me enough to create a username and post...

Bad Dog Owners!! They are all over the place!!! They think their dogs have rights to **** and shiit everywhere!! On my front lawn, in a school parksand most of them never clean up after there dogs. I live in Oliver, and my back door faces the Edmonton Academy school on 120st north of 102avenue... I frequently see this dog owner that just lets their dog rip around the school yard as if it was it's own back yard! The dog shiits all over the place, and the owner doesn't seem to do anything about it!!! The only time I've seen this owner do something about dogs shiit is when they know someone else has observed their dog. Most of the time, its not cleaned up. I wonder how the school feels about this?

There's also dog owners that let their dogs just roam wild in any river valley park. Sure, there's off leash parks, but even that gets abused! Off leash doesn't mean your dog has free reign to bother everyone else and run amock! To be off leash, your dog should know and respond to commands from its owners! If your dog is disobedient, it should not be off leash! Too frequently, owners of untrained dogs think that off leash means off leash for all dogs, and off leash means your dog can do what ever it wants. The parks are for everyone to enjoy, not for your dog to ruin it! Off leash also isn't an exclusive area for your dog. It's still a shared park! Sure your dog might be friendly, and may never bite anyone, but it still doesn't mean that the dog needs to go bother everyone! Not everyone likes a dog, especially an ill-manner dog with clueless owners.

I frequently bike throughout the river valley. Terwilliger could be better if it wasn't over run by dogs and owners who think their dog should just be allowed to go where it pleases. This is also a bike park , and your uncontrolled mutt should be on a leash, unless its taught how to properly behave when off leash. I've almost ran over many dogs on my bike and most of the time, the owners scold you rather than correct their mutt.

I hope we can make our parks a place where all can enjoy, not just for the dogs.

To all the responsible pet owners out thereThis rant isn't about you. Kudos to you that have trained your dog how to behave on and off leash, Kudos to the dog owners that clean up after your dog. You are likely in the minority however.

[Komrade]

I had a guy get mad at me my dog p*ssed on his lawn. What was I supposed to do though? No way to clean it up.

To say bad pet owners are the majority isnt true.

[240GLT]

I'm an avid cyclist and a dog owner

I agree with Komrade, the majority of dog owners that I come across are responsible people with well behaved dogs.

The one thing that dog owners need to remember though is that even in off-leash areas, you are supposed to have your dog on a leash when you are on the paved multi-use trail.

As for cycling in off leash areas, cyclists need to be aware that there will be dogs running around. There are plenty of non-dog areas if you don't want to be bothered by dogs

[lazymonkeygod]

Agreed. The worst dog owner are the ones who let their dog loss in the hallway of a condo!! INDOOR! If only I knew which unit did this...

[Medwards]

Not dog related, but I once lived in an apartment low rise, and this cat lady would just let her cats roam the common hallways. The cat would use the planter by the elevator as it's own personal litter box, and the cat would cause all sorts of commotion with other pets in the building as it put paws under the doors. Was kind of funny at first.

[lazymonkeygod]

I would pick up the cats and called the spca. This is unacceptable in the common spaces.

[Medwards]

I no longer live there, it was a temporary place for me many years ago, and I certainly didn't want to touch the cat.

[240GLT]

I waited until I bought the house to get a dog. I wouldn't have a pet in an apartment.

[edmonton daily photo]

some dogs are bread for apartments. Like great danes.

[Curmudgeon]

^ Do apartments like cheese or butter with their bread (dogs)?

[c2gd]

Originally Posted by baddogowners

Hi All,

I've visited this site for many years now, I find this site very insightful, but I never have much to say about the topics here though I have finally found something that bothers me enough to create a username and post...

Bad Dog Owners!! They are all over the place!!! They think their dogs have rights to **** and shiit everywhere!! On my front lawn, in a school parksand most of them never clean up after there dogs. I live in Oliver, and my back door faces the Edmonton Academy school on 120st north of 102avenue... I frequently see this dog owner that just lets their dog rip around the school yard as if it was it's own back yard! The dog shiits all over the place, and the owner doesn't seem to do anything about it!!! The only time I've seen this owner do something about dogs shiit is when they know someone else has observed their dog. Most of the time, its not cleaned up. I wonder how the school feels about this?

There's also dog owners that let their dogs just roam wild in any river valley park. Sure, there's off leash parks, but even that gets abused! Off leash doesn't mean your dog has free reign to bother everyone else and run amock! To be off leash, your dog should know and respond to commands from its owners! If your dog is disobedient, it should not be off leash! Too frequently, owners of untrained dogs think that off leash means off leash for all dogs, and off leash means your dog can do what ever it wants. The parks are for everyone to enjoy, not for your dog to ruin it! Off leash also isn't an exclusive area for your dog. It's still a shared park! Sure your dog might be friendly, and may never bite anyone, but it still doesn't mean that the dog needs to go bother everyone! Not everyone likes a dog, especially an ill-manner dog with clueless owners.

I frequently bike throughout the river valley. Terwilliger could be better if it wasn't over run by dogs and owners who think their dog should just be allowed to go where it pleases. This is also a bike park , and your uncontrolled mutt should be on a leash, unless its taught how to properly behave when off leash. I've almost ran over many dogs on my bike and most of the time, the owners scold you rather than correct their mutt.

I hope we can make our parks a place where all can enjoy, not just for the dogs.

To all the responsible pet owners out thereThis rant isn't about you. Kudos to you that have trained your dog how to behave on and off leash, Kudos to the dog owners that clean up after your dog. You are likely in the minority however.

As a dog owner myself, I agree that there is nothing worse than a horrible dog (or pet, for that matter) owner.

I have 2 Great Danes and the amount of crap I see is staggering. From people not picking up after their pets, to people letting them get away with aggressive behavior to other people & pets and the idiots that leave their dogs chained up in a backyard all day that never do anything with the poor animals... the list of complaints I have goes on and on.

I've been jumped on by others dogs at off-leash parks and have had other dogs go after my Danes.. the owners of these dogs familiar refrain is "it's off-leash". At that point I tell the idiots that off-leash doesn't mean that your dog has free reign to jump on me or display aggressive tendencies towards my dogs.

I also have to say though that I can't even count the number of times me and my well behaved dogs have almost been mowed down by idiotic bicyclists who absolutely refuse to ring their bells or give me advance warning of their approach. This is when I have my dogs on leash, so they are not at fault here. I have to say though that I feel sorry if an idiot biker ever does hit my dogs because after they go flying from hitting a 140lb or 180lb dog, the next thing they'll be greeted with is a medical bill for my dogs injuries. Oh, and if you don't like dogs... please don't throw your arms up in the air when you see me and my dogs walking towards you and then scream like an idiot. A dog takes that as an aggressive reaction and you really do look quite stupid.

I'd say there are just as many responsible dog owners with well behaved dogs as there are irresponsible idiots (just like bicyclists and joggers), it's just that the irresponsible idiots are more noticeable. Unfortunately for us good dog owners they try their best to ruin it for the rest of us.

[c2gd]

Originally Posted by edmonton daily photo

some dogs are bread for apartments. Like great danes.

Really? News to me. I have two Great Danes and they've (the breed) been owned by my family for 40 years. No offense but you are pretty wrong there.

Great Danes were originally bred to hunt wild boar and they are far from the stereotypical couch potatoes people think they are. Danes can live in apartments just fine but they still need to get out for at least 2-4 hours a day for exercise. Preferably you live in a decently sized house with a good sized yard with dogs that big though.

Plus, if my dogs were bred just to sit in an apartment all day, I doubt they'd be able to do 30km, 10-12 hour day hikes with me in Banff, Jasper and Lake Louise.

Sorry, just a pet-peeve of mine when people think Great Danes are lazy dogs.

[240GLT]

We primarily walk in Dawson Park, From Kinnard Ravine to Goldbar. Not too many issues over there with agressive dogs or bike-dog conflicts.. we do avoid Laurier and Terwillegar though as there are just too many dogs there and people seem to be less responsible. (a lot of peoples' idea of walking the dog at those parks is going to the offleash and standing at the entrance to the park with their Venti-non-fat-soy-mocha-ccino and just letting their dogs go crazy with all the other dogs)

Dawson is a wonderful dog park, not too busy with lots of trails for actual walking, and enough of a buffer between the paved multi-use ot avoid conflicts

[lazymonkeygod]

A couple days ago, I was taking a walk around my neighborhood. As I walked pass this house, a guy gets ready to take his dog out for a walk or something. But his dog wasn't on the leash yet because he was putting on his shoes. The dog sees me, then runs across the street towards me and started climbing and licking me. The dog owner watched his dog run over towards me and didn't say a single thing to call his dog back. If it was my mother-in-law who was walking alone she would've freaked out the moment the dog run towards her and she would've ran like her life depended on it.

Would you consider this person to be an irresponsible dog owner?

[Alex.L]

Originally Posted by lazymonkeygod

A couple days ago, I was taking a walk around my neighborhood. As I walked pass this house, a guy gets ready to take his dog out for a walk or something. But his dog wasn't on the leash yet because he was putting on his shoes. The dog sees me, then runs across the street towards me and started climbing and licking me. The dog owner watched his dog run over towards me and didn't say a single thing to call his dog back. If it was my mother-in-law who was walking alone she would've freaked out the moment the dog run towards her and she would've ran like her life depended on it.

Would you consider this person to be an irresponsible dog owner?

yes

[JBear]

Yes. I have also learned not to wear light coloured shirts or nice clothes at dog parks as well. Sometimes dogs get a little too excited and sometimes surprises the owners, but in your case that was just plain dumb by the guy.

[WestendMark]

I really wish the city would do some patrols in the Laurier off-leash area to reinforce the bylaws, particularly the restricted breeds one.

My pet peeves in the off-leash park:

1 People who bring restricted dogs
2. People who think it's ok to let their unneutered male dogs hump everything in sight and never correct it.
3. People who let their dogs walk behind them, but never watch them to see if they are pooping. This is particularly true by the parking lot - dogs will usually poop within the first 5 minutes of getting to the park.
4. People who think they don't have to pick up the poop if it's in the long grass or off the trail more than 10 feet.
5. People who let their dogs steal other dogs toys but never make an effort to get it back. My dog's frisbee costs about $15!
6. People who brush their dog in the park and then leave the fur all over. What are you thinking?
7. People who let large "scary" dogs like dobermans and rottweilers run around freely and often aggressively up to other dogs and people. Not a good idea.
8. People who let their dogs dig holes in the field or next to the path. This holes are often deep and can injure dogs that trip into them.

Very few bad dogs...lots of bad dog owners.

[c2gd]

It's funny how you say few bad dogs, a lot of bad owners but complain about "scary" dogs like Dobermans and Rottweilers.

Kind of a contradictory statement.

[cheechako]

Originally Posted by c2gd

It's funny how you say few bad dogs, a lot of bad owners but complain about "scary" dogs like Dobermans and Rottweilers.

Kind of a contradictory statement.

Not at all contradictory, large breed dogs can do a lot of damage. The fact is many people are intimidated by large dogs, especially when they are off leash. Bad owners, selfish and inconsiderate behavior by and allowed by dog owners make me feel ashamed for them. Dobermans/Rottweilers ect. are not bad dogs, but they can inspire fear. I believe they often purchased for that very reason. By the way, a small dog was killed by a large dog (GSD) in one of our off leash parks just a few weeks past. That is scarry.

[cheechako]

Originally Posted by WestendMark

I really wish the city would do some patrols in the Laurier off-leash area to reinforce the bylaws, particularly the restricted breeds one.

My pet peeves in the off-leash park:

1 People who bring restricted dogs
2. People who think it's ok to let their unneutered male dogs hump everything in sight and never correct it.
3. People who let their dogs walk behind them, but never watch them to see if they are pooping. This is particularly true by the parking lot - dogs will usually poop within the first 5 minutes of getting to the park.
4. People who think they don't have to pick up the poop if it's in the long grass or off the trail more than 10 feet.
5. People who let their dogs steal other dogs toys but never make an effort to get it back. My dog's frisbee costs about $15!
6. People who brush their dog in the park and then leave the fur all over. What are you thinking?
7. People who let large "scary" dogs like dobermans and rottweilers run around freely and often aggressively up to other dogs and people. Not a good idea.
8. People who let their dogs dig holes in the field or next to the path. This holes are often deep and can injure dogs that trip into them.

Very few bad dogs...lots of bad dog owners.

Good post, I totally agree!

[c2gd]

Originally Posted by cheechako

Not at all contradictory, large breed dogs can do a lot of damage. The fact is many people are intimidated by large dogs, especially when they are off leash. Bad owners, selfish and inconsiderate behavior by and allowed by dog owners make me feel ashamed for them. Dobermans/Rottweilers ect. are not bad dogs, but they can inspire fear. I believe they often purchased for that very reason. By the way, a small dog was killed by a large dog (GSD) in one of our off leash parks just a few weeks past. That is scarry.

If people are intimidated by large dogs off-leash than they shouldn't be going to an off-leash area. I agree with you on the fact that bad owners and inconsiderate behavior by owners of larger dogs is a major problem due to the size of the dog but there is a major double standard. Those with the little ankle biter rats seem to believe that there is nothing wrong with letting their dogs jump all over me and/or yip at my dogs heels with no intention of playing because it's "cute".

I think stereotypes are what inspire fear. Small dog owners literally pick up their dogs and cross the street when they see my dogs because they think my dog is going to eat them. This while their dog is snarling, yapping and strangling itself on its own leash and my dog is ignoring the nuisance. Instead of acting in a ridiculous manner, they should actually socialize their dogs instead of being neurotic about the situation. One of my GD's best friends is an American Pit Bull Terrier; great dog, never has caused a problem. Yet some people want the dog banned from the park solely on the fact that it's a APBT. As for the GSD, there are too many people out there with under socialized, under exercised and unbalanced dogs... sounds like yet another case.

[Medwards]

The off leash areas aren't exclusive for dogs and their owners. Dogs need to still stay near their owners, and be in control, and not disturb other users and dogs in the park. "Off leash" doesn't mean "Dog only park"

[c2gd]

Originally Posted by Medwards

The off leash areas aren't exclusive for dogs and their owners. Dogs need to still stay near their owners, and be in control, and not disturb other users and dogs in the park. "Off leash" doesn't mean "Dog only park"

And multi-use trail doesn't mean "trail only for bicyclists who either don't have a bell or don't ring their bell and almost run over my leashed dogs."

And if you bicyclists or joggers are going to come into an off-leash park, don't freak out when you see a dog. The stupidity of some people.

[cheechako]

Hi c2gd.: I have seen a big dog kill, it happened so fast, before you could spit, let alone intervene. One snap of the GSD's and the Pap was dead. Turned out there was a ***** in 1st stage of oestrus. When your dogs are off leash you have not a hope of control. I consider it good manners to put the other guys feeling before your own. My GSD's would completely bite a freshly butchered steer's leg bone in half. I have a lot of scorn for any small dog owner with undisciplined spoilt animal, on or off leash. But if I am ever bit, I hope it is a Chiwawa bite not a Rottie bite.
When I see someone ahead of me I pull off the trail, or slow down, or even stop to give them a chance to see me. Many times bike riders have quietly overcome me and often nearly collided. We need laws since so many people are simply bad-mannered. I wish the off leash laws would be enforced but even more I wish civil common sense would dominate.

[Gord Lacey]

After reading these comments, I'm so glad I keep my dog out of the off-leash parks.

[Kitlope]

I hear ya Gord. I'm happy with my no politics indoor cat

[lat]

I've been taking our chocolate lab to Buena Vista for 8 years, and can count on one hand the number of times there has been any sort of problem, none of them serious. Some people just need to chill...

[WestendMark]

I said "scary dogs like like dobermans and rottweilers" because they are intimidating and frightening to some people. I have never had a problem with either and I don't worry about them more than any other breed.

I've be going to Buena Vista for 11 years and have only had one serious problem. Unfortunately, I had to kick that dog hard twice to get it off my much smaller dog that it was attacking. My dog is very passive and did absolutely nothing to provoke the attack. The owner did nothing to try to stop it and she seemed paralyzed by the whole thing.

The vast majority of dog owners at Buena Vista are responsible and respectful of others fortunately. I've given up saying anything to people who can't be bothered to pick up after their dog except to offer them a bag. That often works well and is non-confrontational.

[edmonton daily photo]

Originally Posted by c2gd

Really? News to me. I have two Great Danes and they've (the breed) been owned by my family for 40 years. No offense but you are pretty wrong there.

Great Danes were originally bred to hunt wild boar and they are far from the stereotypical couch potatoes people think they are. Danes can live in apartments just fine but they still need to get out for at least 2-4 hours a day for exercise. Preferably you live in a decently sized house with a good sized yard with dogs that big though.

Plus, if my dogs were bred just to sit in an apartment all day, I doubt they'd be able to do 30km, 10-12 hour day hikes with me in Banff, Jasper and Lake Louise.

Sorry, just a pet-peeve of mine when people think Great Danes are lazy dogs.

I never said lazy and in the 1800's the breed was transformed from it's wild hunting ways to the dog we know today.

Great Danes were very vogue with Parisians.... and I would be carful about reading in your own bias because you have come up with a long list of things I never said.

[Frank Wilson]

Originally Posted by c2gd

And multi-use trail doesn't mean "trail only for bicyclists who either don't have a bell or don't ring their bell and almost run over my leashed dogs."

Unfortunately, they "adopt-a-trail" and figure they own it and have exclusive rights to build unsafe bridges and cat-walks. At the same time blasting through the woods doing 20 like Dave Weins.

We had an unfortunate incident a few years ago when I was walking with my Dad's Malinois a rider blasted by us no bell, nothing. The dog who was on lead immediately lunged and torn into the guys leg, a real mess. He tried to fight the dog, which made the dog bite even harder and he started twisting his weight around. I told the guy to stop fighting and don't move while I released the bite. The guy did not have a first-aid kit, and got very upset when I asked if he rode with one, fortunately I had one in the fanny-pack.

[Replacement]

Originally Posted by Frank Wilson

Unfortunately, they "adopt-a-trail" and figure they own it and have exclusive rights to build unsafe bridges and cat-walks. At the same time blasting through the woods doing 20 like Dave Weins.

We had an unfortunate incident a few years ago when I was walking with my Dad's Malinois a rider blasted by us no bell, nothing. The dog who was on lead immediately lunged and torn into the guys leg, a real mess. He tried to fight the dog, which made the dog bite even harder and he started twisting his weight around. I told the guy to stop fighting and don't move while I released the bite. The guy did not have a first-aid kit, and got very upset when I asked if he rode with one, fortunately I had one in the fanny-pack.

I'm a very careful cyclist and approach everybody respectfully and while using a bell. I'm especially careful approaching parties with dogs or kids and really I equate the two as equally unpredictable.

Kids these days will immediate dart sideways on a trail as if they are a waterbug with ADHD and with the parents usually thinking nothing about it. Sorry, a paved multi-use trail is designed for orderly use and people that can't use it properly shouldn't be on it regardless of mode of travel. Its not the place to do unexpected things. Buts heres the kick. This also applies to your dog. If any dog is vicious enough, and unpredictable enough to lunge after a cyclist even if going past full speed the dog and owner is the primary problem in that situation.

The cyclist shouldn't be zooming past. But a dog that lunges at somebody and grabs their leg and injures a person should not be put in that situation with the potential to do that. Period.

ftr as a cyclist several times I've been chased by vicious dogs running at large and IN THE CITY. (rural areas are something else for this and basically stops me from going on any RR's) Nothing more scary than seeing something like a pitbull running full tilt at you because the mere act of cycling elicited a predator prey relationship in the animal. I've never waited around to see how that would turn out. Fortunately I have some kick *** high speed and acceleration. I've needed it quite a few times. I can only presume some of the dogs at large I've encountered on trails with leashes somehow got away from their owners.

[Replacement]

Originally Posted by c2gd

Really? News to me. I have two Great Danes and they've (the breed) been owned by my family for 40 years. No offense but you are pretty wrong there.

Great Danes were originally bred to hunt wild boar and they are far from the stereotypical couch potatoes people think they are. Danes can live in apartments just fine but they still need to get out for at least 2-4 hours a day for exercise. Preferably you live in a decently sized house with a good sized yard with dogs that big though.

Plus, if my dogs were bred just to sit in an apartment all day, I doubt they'd be able to do 30km, 10-12 hour day hikes with me in Banff, Jasper and Lake Louise.

Sorry, just a pet-peeve of mine when people think Great Danes are lazy dogs.

You take your dogs out on backcountry trails in the Mountain Parks?

Leashed? Or free roaming? In anycase I wonder how many backcountry trails you've been on where dogs were prohibited. Or do you pay attention to regulations?

[Titanium48]

^^ Well said.

[Frank Wilson]

Originally Posted by Replacement

I'm a very careful cyclist and approach everybody respectfully and while using a bell. I'm especially careful approaching parties with dogs or kids and really I equate the two as equally unpredictable.

Kids these days will immediate dart sideways on a trail as if they are a waterbug with ADHD and with the parents usually thinking nothing about it. Sorry, a paved multi-use trail is designed for orderly use and people that can't use it properly shouldn't be on it regardless of mode of travel. Its not the place to do unexpected things. Buts heres the kick. This also applies to your dog. If any dog is vicious enough, and unpredictable enough to lunge after a cyclist even if going past full speed the dog and owner is the primary problem in that situation.

The cyclist shouldn't be zooming past. But a dog that lunges at somebody and grabs their leg and injures a person should not be put in that situation with the potential to do that. Period.

ftr as a cyclist several times I've been chased by vicious dogs running at large and IN THE CITY. (rural areas are something else for this and basically stops me from going on any RR's) Nothing more scary than seeing something like a pitbull running full tilt at you because the mere act of cycling elicited a predator prey relationship in the animal. I've never waited around to see how that would turn out. Fortunately I have some kick *** high speed and acceleration. I've needed it quite a few times. I can only presume some of the dogs at large I've encountered on trails with leashes somehow got away from their owners.

Prudent to ring the bell and slow down not simply cover the brake, especially where dogs or children are concerned. I wish more mountain bikers would do the same and not zoom past with less then one foot of space. We were on a goat trail at the time, it's tight even more reason to slow down and ring the bell.

All dogs have very strong prey drive and in this case a fast moving relatively silent object startled the dog, he instinctually reacted and when the rider started to fight the dog the drive switched to defence drive. Both parties were at fault, the rider and me not knowing the dog's behaviour well enough.

The dog is my Dad's they were visiting from Ont. Now when they visit and if they bring the dog he wears a muzzle out in public, trails, parks, downtown, wherever.

Dogs should never be at large, especially on the trail system although I see moron owners doing it all the time. There are a tonne of Coyotes around and they kill for a living, usually four on one with larger prey. There's also the risk of poisoning, children, mountain bikers, other dogs etc.

[Replacement]

Originally Posted by Frank Wilson

Prudent to ring the bell and slow down not simply cover the brake, especially where dogs or children are concerned. I wish more mountain bikers would do the same and not zoom past with less then one foot of space. We were on a goat trail at the time, it's tight even more reason to slow down and ring the bell.

All dogs have very strong prey drive and in this case a fast moving relatively silent object startled the dog, he instinctually reacted and when the rider started to fight the dog the drive switched to defence drive. Both parties were at fault, the rider and me not knowing the dog's behaviour well enough.

The dog is my Dad's they were visiting from Ont. Now when they visit and if they bring the dog he wears a muzzle out in public, trails, parks, downtown, wherever.

Dogs should never be at large, especially on the trail system although I see moron owners doing it all the time. There are a tonne of Coyotes around and they kill for a living, usually four on one with larger prey. There's also the risk of poisoning, children, mountain bikers, other dogs etc.

Thanks as always for the sensible reply. Sorry if it seemed I singled out your post. I just wanted to get that shared notion of responsibility out there and didn't see that in your initial wording. After posting I realized I made an error and it wasn't your dog.

But yeah, I can never understand how cyclists fly past people unsuspectingly. I can't count the amount of times I've approached people carefully only to have some bozo behind cut off me and the other people while flying past without even noticing a possible hazard. This may sound crazy but now whenever I approach people I'm careful about the potential hazard in front and I shoulder check behind to see whats on my trail. Actually I always did that because I never assume that when I have to move left to pass that somebody isn't doing that with me simultaneously. But what would possess a person to pass someone passing is beyond me..

I've seen this behavior on highways as well.

[Frank Wilson]

Originally Posted by Replacement

Thanks as always for the sensible reply. Sorry if it seemed I singled out your post. I just wanted to get that shared notion of responsibility out there and didn't see that in your initial wording. After posting I realized I made an error and it wasn't your dog.

But yeah, I can never understand how cyclists fly past people unsuspectingly. I can't count the amount of times I've approached people carefully only to have some bozo behind cut off me and the other people while flying past without even noticing a possible hazard. This may sound crazy but now whenever I approach people I'm careful about the potential hazard in front and I shoulder check behind to see whats on my trail. Actually I always did that because I never assume that when I have to move left to pass that somebody isn't doing that with me simultaneously. But what would possess a person to pass someone passing is beyond me..

I've seen this behavior on highways as well.

True it wasn't my dog, but still my responsibility since I was handling it at the time.

I should add that ringing the bell is great idea; however, mountain bikers should NOT assume that they've been heard. I see many walking with ear-buds listening to something or chatting away. Of course there's the hearing impaired as well. This makes it even more important to slow down and read the situation. It's funny how many bikers ride defensively on the roads with vehicles, but all that goes out the window when on a trail. And I've seen the exact situation you described, two bicycles colliding one guy trying to overtake another. It's not the Tour de France although many seem to ride like it is.

[Replacement]

Originally Posted by Frank Wilson

[I should add that ringing the bell is great idea; however, mountain bikers should NOT assume that they've been heard. I see many walking with ear-buds listening to something or chatting away. Of course there's the hearing impaired as well. This makes it even more important to slow down and read the situation. It's funny how many bikers ride defensively on the roads with vehicles, but all that goes out the window when on a trail. And I've seen the exact situation you described, two bicycles colliding one guy trying to overtake another. It's not the Tour de France although many seem to ride like it is.

Yep.

As a cyclist exposed to many hazardous drivers you get used to making sure theres actual recognition at all times. With drivers I look for eye contact in many situations.

Ringing the bell on the trail isn't enough, you discern if theres a response. Definitely I slow down. I find that just to be respectful. people are walking having a relaxing walk. They don't need a projectile flying a foot by at 30K/hr. I think just being a hiker makes me appreciate that as well.

Just yesterday some teenage girl on a wide multiuse trail walking right in the middle oblivious to the world with her headphones on and taking up the entire trail. I rang the bell 3 times, passed off in the grass, gave her a look, I doubt anything registered.

[c2gd]

Originally Posted by Replacement

You take your dogs out on backcountry trails in the Mountain Parks?

Leashed? Or free roaming? In anycase I wonder how many backcountry trails you've been on where dogs were prohibited. Or do you pay attention to regulations?

Excuse me?

Well, what a delightful tone you've taken.

To answer your absurd question, yes, I do take my dogs on back-country trails in the National Mountain Parks. Do you live under a rock? This is not the United States where many National Parks have stricter regulations where dogs can and can not go. Canada, specifically Banff, Jasper and Lake Louise National Parks have always been dog friendly and leashed canines have always been able to accompany people on 95% of the back-country trails in the parks. But since you seem so uppity about this fact, I'm curious as to why the park warden in Banff, whom I know personally, wouldn't have in fact righted this wrong if what your opinion entails is indeed reality. Come to think of it, over the past couple decades, I wonder why not even once, any park official has ever questioned me about my dogs being on the trails. Hell, when I did Cascade, up past sunshine ski resort last summer, there were about 10-15 hikers and backpackers with dogs on that paticular back-country trail... Unbelievable we're all not paying attention to the regulations!

The only times dogs are not allowed on a trail is when it has a high concentration of wildlife (there are a couple in Jasper) and when there has been predatory (bear, mountain lion etc.) activity on a trail. And in that case, notices are posted online or at the trailhead. Either that or I inquire at the park gates. There are a few mountain bike trails and one or two 3-5 day backpacking routes with no dogs allowed either, but they are certainly the minority.

Leashed or free-roaming? Seriously? Do you really think I would place my dogs in harms way by letting them free roam in the back country? I summit mountains... I'm sure letting my dogs free-roam on scree slopes and potentially plummet to their death or getting too close to a bear is a smart route to take. It doesn't even deserve a response but yes, my dogs are leashed. On the trails, on mountains........ but not in my vehicle. Would you like to know the type of leash as well? I can count the number of trails on one hand that I've been on where dogs are prohibited... actually, I don't even need one. The answer is zero. Do I pay attention to regulations? If you would put aside your ignorance and understand the rules and regulations in regards to dogs being in Banff, Lake Louise and Jasper National Parks you would understand that your line of attack here is, once again, absurd.

I appreciate the aggressive and demeaning response. You may have no love for dogs but it shouldn't preclude you from being rational about them being allowed in the Rockies.

[Replacement]

Originally Posted by c2gd

Excuse me?

Well, what a delightful tone you've taken.

To answer your absurd question, yes, I do take my dogs on back-country trails in the National Mountain Parks. Do you live under a rock? This is not the United States where many National Parks have stricter regulations where dogs can and can not go. Canada, specifically Banff, Jasper and Lake Louise National Parks have always been dog friendly and leashed canines have always been able to accompany people on 95% of the back-country trails in the parks. But since you seem so uppity about this fact, I'm curious as to why the park warden in Banff, whom I know personally, wouldn't have in fact righted this wrong if what your opinion entails is indeed reality. Come to think of it, over the past couple decades, I wonder why not even once, any park official has ever questioned me about my dogs being on the trails. Hell, when I did Cascade, up past sunshine ski resort last summer, there were about 10-15 hikers and backpackers with dogs on that paticular back-country trail... Unbelievable we're all not paying attention to the regulations!

The only times dogs are not allowed on a trail is when it has a high concentration of wildlife (there are a couple in Jasper) and when there has been predatory (bear, mountain lion etc.) activity on a trail. And in that case, notices are posted online or at the trailhead. Either that or I inquire at the park gates. There are a few mountain bike trails and one or two 3-5 day backpacking routes with no dogs allowed either, but they are certainly the minority.

Leashed or free-roaming? Seriously? Do you really think I would place my dogs in harms way by letting them free roam in the back country? I summit mountains... I'm sure letting my dogs free-roam on scree slopes and potentially plummet to their death or getting too close to a bear is a smart route to take. It doesn't even deserve a response but yes, my dogs are leashed. On the trails, on mountains........ but not in my vehicle. Would you like to know the type of leash as well? I can count the number of trails on one hand that I've been on where dogs are prohibited... actually, I don't even need one. The answer is zero. Do I pay attention to regulations? If you would put aside your ignorance and understand the rules and regulations in regards to dogs being in Banff, Lake Louise and Jasper National Parks you would understand that your line of attack here is, once again, absurd.

I appreciate the aggressive and demeaning response. You may have no love for dogs but it shouldn't preclude you from being rational about them being allowed in the Rockies.

I took the same tone you have throughout the thread.

Anyway interesting foot in mouth response. Thanks for confirming what you don't know.

Yes The National Parks have several backcountry trail restrictions where dogs are strictly prohibited. A greater number at different times of year.

Maybe before being an expert on dog etiquette and all information on National Parks you might acquaint yourself with basic regulations and why they are there.

Seeing as you're convinced I'm talking out of my *** you can read the following:

http://www.pc.gc.ca/pn-np/ab/jasper/activ/ap-bc.aspx

Almost anybody I know that go out in the National Park protected backcountry are well aware of these dog restrictions and the reasons why. Talk about hiding under that rock..

[lat]

... and another thread degrades into name calling...

nice

[Replacement]

Originally Posted by lat

... and another thread degrades into name calling...

nice

Maybe read post 21, 23, 38 and the poster in question calling people ridiculous, stupid and ignorant and being condescending to see where this got going.

[cheechako]

I'd like to thank the folks who ring the bell on their bike, some even pull over, the pedestrians who do not jump in front nor allow their children to run wild. Many car drivers who are very courteous, and so many more decent humans out there. May their tribes increase, maybe it will be contagious. I believe in being as helpfull as I possibly can just because I love Dogs!

[c2gd]

Originally Posted by Replacement

I took the same tone you have throughout the thread.

Anyway interesting foot in mouth response. Thanks for confirming what you don't know.

Yes The National Parks have several backcountry trail restrictions where dogs are strictly prohibited. A greater number at different times of year.

Maybe before being an expert on dog etiquette and all information on National Parks you might acquaint yourself with basic regulations and why they are there.

Seeing as you're convinced I'm talking out of my *** you can read the following:

http://www.pc.gc.ca/pn-np/ab/jasper/activ/ap-bc.aspx

Almost anybody I know that go out in the National Park protected backcountry are well aware of these dog restrictions and the reasons why. Talk about hiding under that rock..

This is hilarious coming from somebody whom is a crap disturber on HFBoards.

Anyway, foot in my mouth? Can you read? Preferably your own link? Which, I may add, actually proves my point that the vast majority of back-country trails in the national mountain parks ARE dog friendly. As I mentioned in my original reply to your absurd line of questioning, I educated you to the fact that only a small number of trails are prohibited to dogs due to a few different circumstances but thank you for parroting what I had already told you.

Do you understand that there are hundreds, if not thousands of back-country trails in the mountain parks? Just because a few trails prohibit dogs does not automatically prohibit them from other trails just because someone like you who doesn't want to be around them say's so. Dogs in the back-country are required to be on leash for a reason. The majority of back-country trails are to be shared responsibly, just like trails here in the River Valley. The sooner you understand that, the better.

Like I said, you keep talking about basic regulations while being completely ignorant to the fact that I take it upon myself to ask park officials and/or check the trail head to see if dogs are prohibited on the trail head. You can continue assuming that I knowingly bring my dogs on the minimal number of trails in the mountain parks that don't allow dogs if you want though. Pretty sad actually.

BTW, hilarious that you give me a link to Jasper only. Couldn't find enough trails that prohibit dogs in Banff? Kootenay? Lake Louise? Waterton? Of the many hundreds or thousands of trails in the parks, 95% of them are dog friendly... if you don't believe me, ask the park wardens or park officials, I have an inkling that they may just know what they're talking about. You're not one of those miscreants that takes his mountain bike on "No Bike" trails, are you? Lord knows there are 10x the number of trails that allow no bikes than there are that allow no dogs.

Originally Posted by Replacement

Maybe read post 21, 23, 38 and the poster in question calling people ridiculous, stupid and ignorant and being condescending to see where this got going.

Funny that you mention 21 because there is nothing inflammatory in there. As for 23, if calling a cyclist -that has almost mowed me down or freaks out because of my dogs being off-leash in an OFF-LEASH park- stupid is inflammatory, you have pretty thin skin. I wasn't talking about any forum member, how much clearer could it have been?

Instead, please refer to post #32. 3 attacks in two sentences from you and the only personal attacks in this thread.

[Replacement]

Originally Posted by c2gd

This is hilarious coming from somebody whom is a crap disturber on HFBoards.

Anyway, foot in my mouth? Can you read? Preferably your own link? Which, I may add, actually proves my point that the vast majority of back-country trails in the national mountain parks ARE dog friendly. As I mentioned in my original reply to your absurd line of questioning, I educated you to the fact that only a small number of trails are prohibited to dogs due to a few different circumstances but thank you for parroting what I had already told you.

Do you understand that there are hundreds, if not thousands of back-country trails in the mountain parks? Just because a few trails prohibit dogs does not automatically prohibit them from other trails just because someone like you who doesn't want to be around them say's so. Dogs in the back-country are required to be on leash for a reason. The majority of back-country trails are to be shared responsibly, just like trails here in the River Valley. The sooner you understand that, the better.

Like I said, you keep talking about basic regulations while being completely ignorant to the fact that I take it upon myself to ask park officials and/or check the trail head to see if dogs are prohibited on the trail head. You can continue assuming that I knowingly bring my dogs on the minimal number of trails in the mountain parks that don't allow dogs if you want though. Pretty sad actually.

BTW, hilarious that you give me a link to Jasper only. Couldn't find enough trails that prohibit dogs in Banff? Kootenay? Lake Louise? Waterton? Of the many hundreds or thousands of trails in the parks, 95% of them are dog friendly... if you don't believe me, ask the park wardens or park officials, I have an inkling that they may just know what they're talking about. You're not one of those miscreants that takes his mountain bike on "No Bike" trails, are you? Lord knows there are 10x the number of trails that allow no bikes than there are that allow no dogs.

Funny that you mention 21 because there is nothing inflammatory in there. As for 23, if calling a cyclist -that has almost mowed me down or freaks out because of my dogs being off-leash in an OFF-LEASH park- stupid is inflammatory, you have pretty thin skin. I wasn't talking about any forum member, how much clearer could it have been?

Instead, please refer to post #32. 3 attacks in two sentences from you and the only personal attacks in this thread.

You said there were zero backcountry trails you went to where dogs were prohbited in the National parks. You said 95% of back country trails allow dogs. I called you on that, provided a link that showed several backcountry trails where dogs are strictly prohibited and you're steamed about that. Its OK to admit you were wrong. No worries either way.

I've called you no names, it wasn't an attack, although there were pointed QUESTIONS, and YOU are the one engaging in name calling and inflammatory behavior.

I'm glad you do pay attention to trail prohibitions and maintain the safety of your dog, wildlife, and other trail users. But that doesn't change the false and misleading statements you've made on the topic.

As for my cycling I think its obvious I'm a courteous bike rider and I pay attention to safety and ftr I don't cycle on prohibited trails. I also didn't make a comment that this is Canada and I can cycle on any trail wherever I like..

ps I was a mod at hfboards. Whats the matter? Did I give you an infraction over there?

cheers guy.

Canada Day long weekend. Hope you and everybody else have a great one.

[Komrade]

[lat]

Originally Posted by Komrade

lol

[albethere]

I don’t own a dog but live on the ground floor of an apartment building with a high traffic walkway belonging to the complex, that is two feet away from my patio. I’m frustrated with one dog owner who allows her dog to pee and poop on the stretch of lawn between my patio and the sidewalk. I asked her nicely to please take her dog out further from my patio/view, considering that a few feet away, there is a whole block of expansive lawn on which no houses are built, no children play, and few people walk. The owner was incredulous that I would ask and stated the dog wasn’t on my patio and that I didn’t own the lawn in question. Later, there was poop on my patio. With other dogs who poop unattended in the courtyard, the entire lawn is unfit for any child to play on.


How inconsiderate this is! Since the bylaws here deal only with the wearing of leashes and picking up of feces, all I can do is hope the owners get their pay back some day.

[Kitlope]

I've had those neighbors too. Such wonderful neighbors. It's really quite amazing to see when you ask nicely for them to be considerate of your wishes how quickly it's turned into their "rights" to let the dog crap all over your sidewalk to your home. And I wouldn't have a problem with it if they cleaned the poop up, as a responsible dog owner should. Of course, as they're making you out to be the bad guy for merely suggesting that they take their dog to do their business elsewhere, they conveniently forget there's a reason why the dog isn't shitting on their own sidewalk.

I'm thinking you might be interested in the Dog Poop thread from a couple years ago.

http://www.connect2edmonton.ca/forum...660#post356660

[albethere]

I think some people get dogs (or other pets) who really aren't prepared to do the daily routine of caring for them. And some are just lazy. Add to that the indignation of having to obey laws in caring for their charges, and you get some downright nasty attitudes. Some do seem to go out of their way to make the non-dog owners pay for their encumbrance.

[Kitlope]

I think some people get dogs (or other pets) who really aren't prepared to do the daily routine of caring for them. And some are just lazy.

No shortage of them. Personally, I know I wouldn't have the time for a dog so it's not fair to the dog, my neighbors and everything else that I have one. That's why I have an indoor cat. If I don't clean the litter box, it's me that suffers the consequences. So needless to say, I clean the litter box

[Frank Wilson]

Originally Posted by Kitlope

That's why I have an indoor cat. If I don't clean the litter box, it's me that suffers the consequences. So needless to say, I clean the litter box

We have a dog and an indoor cat, who's trained to use the toilet. It's just great no litter to clean-up and no poopy paws. Fairly easy to train him (he's an adult rescue), just don't train to flush. One person did that and the water bill went through the roof. The cat was flushing 90 to 100 times per day when folks were at work and watching the water.

[Parkdale]

Nobody suffers more from the actions of irresponsible pet owners than responsible pet owners. We don't want to step, smell, or in any other way enjoy other people's messes either, and as a bonus get to deal with that horrible feeling of walking by somebody else's mess and hoping you don't get screamed at by somebody thinking it was your dog who made it. And of course having a dog makes you all the more of a target to uncontrolled, aggressive dogs. It's a shame, but I can completely understand when people who have had bad experiences because of bad dog owners view me and my larger breed buddy with suspicion.

[jadzia2000]

That's why I own a cat that is strictly indoors.

I'm too lazy to own a dog.