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Old 07-04-2012, 01:21 PM   #1
KC
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Default Redford leadership in jeopardy

Some interesting quotes in this article... Too bad I thought she put a fresh face on the old party. Thinks for herself too.

Even if she wins, Alison Redford’s leadership is in jeopardy
PC Leader Redford faces fallout from the party's perils regardless of election outcome
BY LICIA CORBELLA, CALGARY HERALD APRIL 7, 2012 11:18 AM

http://www.calgaryherald.com/opinion...610/story.html

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Old 07-04-2012, 02:30 PM   #2
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She thinks she’s smarter than all of these smart people, but she’s clearly not very astute politically.

This just about sums her up.

Albertans loved ol' Ralph because he was able to take down the intellectual know-it-alls with one sentence.

Didn't matter about his politics, we loved the man because he seemed to be "down to earth". This woman is a nose-in-the air know-it-all. She'll go down in flames.
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Old 07-04-2012, 03:34 PM   #3
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I'd take anything from Corbella with a grain of salt. The Wildrose party has a bunch of ex Herald employees in their ranks.
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Old 07-04-2012, 03:45 PM   #4
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^^ I'd rather have the province ran by intellectuals than idiots! Even small towns need nurses, doctors, teachers, accountants and lawyers, all which need at least a post-secondary degree. And most jobs nowadays require some kind of post-secondary education.
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Old 07-04-2012, 03:54 PM   #5
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^not being an intellectual doesn't make you an *****, and not going to university doesn't either. The most successful people I know are self made, and IMO know more about decision making than an Ivory tower non-real world-er. My impression of Redford is she was a nerd in school, and has lived a very sheltered life. Her decision making and lack of people skills to-date has shown that, capable people can see through her in an instant.
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Old 07-04-2012, 04:32 PM   #6
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My impression of Redford is she was a nerd in school, and has lived a very sheltered life.
What an ignorant and simple minded thing to say, considering she spent the 90's working as a constitutional and legal adviser throughout Africa and was one of the election commissioners for Afghanistan's first elections in 2005.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alison_Redford

Quote:
Her work has included assignments in Bosnia and Herzegovina, Serbia, Namibia, Uganda, Zimbabwe, Mozambique and the Philippines. Before her most current post, Redford managed a judicial training and legal reform project for the Ministry of Justice and the Supreme People's Court in Vietnam.
She's also been deeply involved in politics since the 80's, at the Federal and Provincial level. As to whether or not she was a "nerd" in school, I don't see how that's even a little bit relevant.

Next time you form an impression of someone, you may want to actually look in to their background before making a sweeping generalization of them that makes you look ridiculous given the fact it has no bearing on reality.
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Old 07-04-2012, 04:43 PM   #7
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Wow, moa... that was embarrassing to read, even by your standards.
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Old 07-04-2012, 05:00 PM   #8
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Moa, it appears, values style over substance.

I've got a large number of friends who never went to college. Who are intelligent and well versed on a number of subjects. However, there's very few of them that I would want running the province or the country. Why do so many conservatives dislike people who go to college or have a very broad range of experiences, including time spent in other countries?

Look at Rick Santorum getting all twisted out of shape when Obama said that he wanted to have a system where going to college would be accessible to everyone who qualified? Santorum reacted like Obama was looking down his nose at farmers and mechanics. And these are the people we want making decisions on our education system?
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Old 07-04-2012, 05:01 PM   #9
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I don't rush to judgement on Redford at all ,but she did her good job well over the years before joining the ranks of Tories.
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Old 07-04-2012, 05:40 PM   #10
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To be clear, I'm not defending Redford as a politician. Like Stelmach before her, she's clearly made some huge mistakes and is largely an accidental Premier.
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Old 07-04-2012, 05:44 PM   #11
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All level of Politicans and Public makes mistake in their life, so we don't need to rush to judgement on most people then we will not be judged by someone too.
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Old 07-04-2012, 05:52 PM   #12
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I think the real question is the attitude towards learning. While I see a certain percentage of educated people who lack other skills, and some people with a lack of formal education but street smarts, I think post-secondary education offers in addition to the course material learned.
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Old 07-04-2012, 07:14 PM   #13
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Originally Posted by kkozoriz View Post
Moa, it appears, values style over substance.

Why do so many conservatives dislike people who go to college or have a very broad range of experiences, including time spent in other countries?
Great question! Let me speak for conservatives without altogether being one. First point is - waters are sometimes a mile wide but an inch deep. Lots of travel does not amount to much without some thought, and for that matter your home will give you enough to think about. In the cosmopolitan age of the Greeks, Socrates did not much care for travel and for this very reason. Second point is - what passes for thinking at the universities is social scientific and alien to communal or traditional values. This did not have to be so, as there were intelligent ways to be traditional, and there are intelligent thinkers that take that (conservative) posture. Allan Bloom, or our own George Grant serve as examples. Third point is - Alison Redford is a kind of uber-lawyer. She takes what the law does - legislate rather than bring things up organically (educate) - and radicalizes it. The field is now not just your province or country, it is the whole international "community". What's worse is that her field is human rights laws. I loved my mother too - but the last thing I would want is a "smart" (but not really), secular (but human-rights-pious) nanny running things for me. I like a good round of elitism more than most conservatives, but I utterly dislike this charmless, pinch-faced modern day puritanism.
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Old 07-04-2012, 08:24 PM   #14
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Has Redford gotten rid of the 8 executive jets the Conservatives use at will, so they do not have to mingle with us loser taxpayers?
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Old 07-04-2012, 08:51 PM   #15
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If you ask me, cutting transit funding, cutting funding for the arts (Royal Alberta Museum), and referring individuals in pro-choice predicaments to judges all sound like steps backwards. Not to mention all the oil patch favors they'll have to pay back *cough royalty cut cough*. But hey, if you're ok with all of this, vote for the Wildorse.
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Old 07-04-2012, 09:15 PM   #16
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I will not vote Wildrose. Normally I vote PC but this year might be different. The Liberal platform is quite appealing this year with their focus on the big cities and Sherman's dedication to keeping ECCA on schedule to be closed as well as finally getting shovels in the dirt for the RAM. I have never voted Liberal before but this year might be different.

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Old 07-04-2012, 10:11 PM   #17
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Has Redford gotten rid of the 8 executive jets the Conservatives use at will, so they do not have to mingle with us loser taxpayers?
They have never had biz jets

1-2 Turbo prop King Airs and the Dash 8 that is mainly used for firefighters
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Old 07-04-2012, 10:30 PM   #18
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Moa, it appears, values style over substance.

Why do so many conservatives dislike people who go to college or have a very broad range of experiences, including time spent in other countries?
Great question! Let me speak for conservatives without altogether being one. First point is - waters are sometimes a mile wide but an inch deep. Lots of travel does not amount to much without some thought, and for that matter your home will give you enough to think about. In the cosmopolitan age of the Greeks, Socrates did not much care for travel and for this very reason. Second point is - what passes for thinking at the universities is social scientific and alien to communal or traditional values. This did not have to be so, as there were intelligent ways to be traditional, and there are intelligent thinkers that take that (conservative) posture. Allan Bloom, or our own George Grant serve as examples. Third point is - Alison Redford is a kind of uber-lawyer. She takes what the law does - legislate rather than bring things up organically (educate) - and radicalizes it. The field is now not just your province or country, it is the whole international "community". What's worse is that her field is human rights laws. I loved my mother too - but the last thing I would want is a "smart" (but not really), secular (but human-rights-pious) nanny running things for me. I like a good round of elitism more than most conservatives, but I utterly dislike this charmless, pinch-faced modern day puritanism.
The water may be an inch deep but that doesn't mean you shouldn't at least wade in and see for yourself. I want a leader who is willing to see other points of view, who understands that different doesn't necessarily mean wrong.

You get, particularly in the states but increasingly here as well, conservatives equating time spent in higher learning or overseas and putting you out of touch. Well, the people who are leading the way have to be out front, not in the middle of the crowd.

Last week Mitt Romney claimed that Obama had "spent too much time at Harvard". The really silly thing is that Romney was there longer than Obama was. The crowd Romney was speaking to didn't necessarily know that of course but it made Obama seem elitist when the truth was actually much different.

Obama spent 3 years attending Harvard.
Romney spent 4 years attending Harvard.
Romney has hired numerous staffers and advisers who attended or teach at Harvard.
Romney has spoken on record numerous times (including on Charlie Rose) about how wonderful his experiences were at Harvard.
Romney lived in Massachusetts (home of Harvard) for most of his adult life and served as its governor.

http://www.forbes.com/sites/tjwalker...me-at-harvard/
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Old 08-04-2012, 12:19 AM   #19
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[QUOTE=kkozoriz;433984]
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Originally Posted by Sophia Karel View Post
Obama spent 3 years attending Harvard.
Romney spent 4 years attending Harvard.
Romney has hired numerous staffers and advisers who attended or teach at Harvard.
Romney has spoken on record numerous times (including on Charlie Rose) about how wonderful his experiences were at Harvard.
Romney lived in Massachusetts (home of Harvard) for most of his adult life and served as its governor.
I can tell you for a fact that Ralph Klein never spent a day at Harvard.
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Old 08-04-2012, 10:02 AM   #20
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She thinks she’s smarter than all of these smart people, but she’s clearly not very astute politically.

This just about sums her up.

Albertans loved ol' Ralph because he was able to take down the intellectual know-it-alls with one sentence.

Didn't matter about his politics, we loved the man because he seemed to be "down to earth". This woman is a nose-in-the air know-it-all. She'll go down in flames.
Ralph Klein was an embarassment to all of us - throwing money at homeless people??? Allison Redford is not a 'nose in the air know-it-all'. Why on earth would you even make such a statement?

If people in Edmonton are happy voting for a party that is intent on opening the airport debate (again), shutting down the planned RAM, stopping plans for improving the legislature district and diverting funds from LRT and other things needed by cities - then we are fools!

We should be looking for the best possible candidates from any party that runs them, and ensuring that the platforms offerred are in fact good for us (as in Edmonton).

And why is it that Ms. Smith isn't perceived by you as a know-it-all? Because she is leading the WA?
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Old 08-04-2012, 10:15 AM   #21
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[QUOTE=Sophia Karel;434000]
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Originally Posted by kkozoriz View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sophia Karel View Post
Obama spent 3 years attending Harvard.
Romney spent 4 years attending Harvard.
Romney has hired numerous staffers and advisers who attended or teach at Harvard.
Romney has spoken on record numerous times (including on Charlie Rose) about how wonderful his experiences were at Harvard.
Romney lived in Massachusetts (home of Harvard) for most of his adult life and served as its governor.
I can tell you for a fact that Ralph Klein never spent a day at Harvard.
That was glaringly obvious to all paying attention.
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Old 08-04-2012, 10:16 AM   #22
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i think we should hold off on the ram. that way we lose the feds 92 million. and under the wr govt we only build the culture stuff when we have surplus, meaning only when costs are driven up. so, let the wr build the ram then when it will cost way more to build. good fiscal planning from a party which preaches it!

i wonder why smith hasn't talked about provincial funding to calgary's music centre? the contribution is only 25 million, but still, that should be pulled as well, right wild rose?
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Old 08-04-2012, 10:53 AM   #23
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She's also been deeply involved in politics since the 80's, at the Federal and Provincial level. As to whether or not she was a "nerd" in school, I don't see how that's even a little bit relevant.
So she has had a bunch of government jobs for different burarcracies, good for her, a shettered academic like I suggested (despite the travel). IMO the best politicians typically don't have academic / government buracracy backgrounds. Good examples are Ronald Regan (actor) and Margaret Thatcher (chemist, then a barrister). Clinton was a bit of an exception, but he had fantastic social skills (something men can pick up when they have spent a lot of time with different women).

I made the nerd coment based on what I heard on TV of interviews with her former school, and based on what I see right now, on how she presents herself in public. Just IMO, but the proof is in the pudding.

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Old 08-04-2012, 11:00 AM   #24
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so, i guess if she exploited those countries working as a corporate shill, she'd be perfect. but no, she just played a small role in trying to bring basic human rights and democracy. for shame!
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Old 08-04-2012, 11:05 AM   #25
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^no, but working for government departments gives one a government department mentality, lets spend more on more buracracy, like we see right now, with more health clinics and similar. I don't think its an ideal background, I'd rather politicians come from the private sector or be self made, where possible (not always) to provide some balance against the buracratic stiffs they have to stand up to, to be effective. IMO people skills, communication skills and leadership skills are way more important than academics, for a politician.
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Old 08-04-2012, 02:09 PM   #26
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^That's "bureaucratic", Moa! For god's sake, if you want at least a modicum of credibility, learn how to spell!!!
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Old 08-04-2012, 02:19 PM   #27
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^lol, this work computer doesn't have a spell check (sort of sucks), and yeah, I can't spell without that.
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Old 08-04-2012, 02:53 PM   #28
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So, essentially, it's more important for a politician to look pretty, portray an image of a grand leader, and act down to earth than to have the educational background needed to know what the heck you're behind politically? I'd rather have someone who knows what they're doing within the realms of politics. I mean, people skills and being attractive are nice and all, but that isn't what politics is all about. It's about ideas on how to have society function. Frankly, if a politician did politics well, did what the people wanted, I couldn't care less if they stumble on a Global news broadcast or aren't wearing a designer suit to the ball.
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Old 08-04-2012, 04:37 PM   #29
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^ I hope that people expect more from our leaders than just looks, personality or charisma. We need a leader who will help our province compete globally rather than having regions compete against each other.
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Old 08-04-2012, 05:02 PM   #30
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Speaking off the record, three MLAs and three high powered Progressive Conservative mandarins say most party members are so furious at Redford for rejecting sound political advice and “risking so many political careers and a great political brand,” that she would face a hostile leadership review in 2013 and be pushed out regardless.

Why the hostility? According to these insiders, Redford apparently brushed aside the sound political counsel of experienced Tories on many occasions that they say would have helped keep the Tories in power for at least another four years — reaching their 45th anniversary in power before the end of their next mandate.

...“If she had listened then, we would have won 70 seats — another huge majority, since we were ahead of Wildrose by almost 30 points then,” says one Tory MLA, who adds that the seat he won by thousands of votes in the last election, will be a photo finish horse race on April 23. And he’s being optimistic.
Sounds like the old boys club is still running the PC Party. They wanted Redford to call an election shortly after becoming leader to ensure another huge majority government and continuing Tory arrogance. Boo hoo hoo, old boys.
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Old 08-04-2012, 05:35 PM   #31
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Sounds like the old boys club is still running the PC Party. They wanted Redford to call an election shortly after becoming leader to ensure another huge majority government and continuing Tory arrogance. Boo hoo hoo, old boys.
And WR is made up of former members of which party again? Myst be all those Liberals and NDPer's.

This election is between the Red and Blue wings of the same party essentially.
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Old 08-04-2012, 05:53 PM   #32
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Speaking off the record, three MLAs and three high powered Progressive Conservative mandarins say most party members are so furious at Redford for rejecting sound political advice and “risking so many political careers and a great political brand,” that she would face a hostile leadership review in 2013 and be pushed out regardless.

Why the hostility? According to these insiders, Redford apparently brushed aside the sound political counsel of experienced Tories on many occasions that they say would have helped keep the Tories in power for at least another four years — reaching their 45th anniversary in power before the end of their next mandate.

...“If she had listened then, we would have won 70 seats — another huge majority, since we were ahead of Wildrose by almost 30 points then,” says one Tory MLA, who adds that the seat he won by thousands of votes in the last election, will be a photo finish horse race on April 23. And he’s being optimistic.

Read more: http://www.calgaryherald.com/news/Co...#ixzz1rUN0JVyB


Sounds like the old boys club is still running the PC Party. They wanted Redford to call an election shortly after becoming leader to ensure another huge majority government and continuing Tory arrogance. Boo hoo hoo, old boys.
Just reading that quote from the article again one wonders if the rejected "sound advice" came from the same people who now claim Redford's leadership is in jeopardy. Some people just can't accept not being listened too, especially by the people actually in charge (as opposed to say, themselves).
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Old 08-04-2012, 06:27 PM   #33
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She thinks she’s smarter than all of these smart people, but she’s clearly not very astute politically.

This just about sums her up.

Albertans loved ol' Ralph because he was able to take down the intellectual know-it-alls with one sentence.

Didn't matter about his politics, we loved the man because he seemed to be "down to earth". This woman is a nose-in-the air know-it-all. She'll go down in flames.
Ralph Klein was an embarassment to all of us - throwing money at homeless people??? Allison Redford is not a 'nose in the air know-it-all'. Why on earth would you even make such a statement?

If people in Edmonton are happy voting for a party that is intent on opening the airport debate (again), shutting down the planned RAM, stopping plans for improving the legislature district and diverting funds from LRT and other things needed by cities - then we are fools!

We should be looking for the best possible candidates from any party that runs them, and ensuring that the platforms offerred are in fact good for us (as in Edmonton).

And why is it that Ms. Smith isn't perceived by you as a know-it-all? Because she is leading the WA?
Don't kid yourself. Wildrose's plan is to conquer 2/3's of ALberta's population - namely Calgary and Rural.

The h$%l with Edmonton and region. WIldrose cannot stomach seeing Edmonton move on with life.
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Old 09-04-2012, 12:32 PM   #34
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Originally Posted by bobinedmonton View Post
She thinks she’s smarter than all of these smart people, but she’s clearly not very astute politically.

This just about sums her up.

Albertans loved ol' Ralph because he was able to take down the intellectual know-it-alls with one sentence.

Didn't matter about his politics, we loved the man because he seemed to be "down to earth". This woman is a nose-in-the air know-it-all. She'll go down in flames.
Ralph Klein was an embarassment to all of us - throwing money at homeless people??? Allison Redford is not a 'nose in the air know-it-all'. Why on earth would you even make such a statement?

If people in Edmonton are happy voting for a party that is intent on opening the airport debate (again), shutting down the planned RAM, stopping plans for improving the legislature district and diverting funds from LRT and other things needed by cities - then we are fools!

We should be looking for the best possible candidates from any party that runs them, and ensuring that the platforms offerred are in fact good for us (as in Edmonton).

And why is it that Ms. Smith isn't perceived by you as a know-it-all? Because she is leading the WA?
Don't kid yourself. Wildrose's plan is to conquer 2/3's of ALberta's population - namely Calgary and Rural.

The h$%l with Edmonton and region. WIldrose cannot stomach seeing Edmonton move on with life.
I agree. This is worrying.
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Old 09-04-2012, 01:07 PM   #35
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It's strange that some comments on this thread call Redford an elitist, a sheltered academic bureaucrat who never held a real-world job.

But look at Danielle Smith's background:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Danielle_Smith
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Calgary_School

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/...rticle2392299/

She graduated from the U of C with an economics degree. While there she was a member of the Calgary School. It's members are a group of neo-cons including Harper, Erza Levant, Ted MortonTom Flanagan.

Smith was a former trustee on the Calgary Board of Education before education minister Lyle Oberg dismissed the entire board because it was dysfunctional. From there Danille was an "advocate for ranchers, farmers, etc. with the Alberta Property Rights Initiative and the Canadian Property Rights Research Institute". She went on to become a journalist for the Calgary Herald and worked for Global TV and on talk radio.

So Smith's job experience is being on a dysfunctional board of education, an advocate for property rights, and a journalist. Plus she worked at the Fraser institute and attended the quasi-political science school that spew neo-cons.

That sounds very elitist to me.
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Old 09-04-2012, 01:07 PM   #36
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Sounds like the old boys club is still running the PC Party. They wanted Redford to call an election shortly after becoming leader to ensure another huge majority government and continuing Tory arrogance. Boo hoo hoo, old boys.
That's my feeling as well, its hard to feel sorry about old boy bullies panicking as they watch their cushy power jobs disappear. In a way, Redford is achieving what she said she would for Alberta, a breath of fresh air.
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Old 09-04-2012, 01:25 PM   #37
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Fresh air from a bunch of disgruntled ex-PCers? It would be exchanging one group of old boys for another.
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Old 09-04-2012, 01:33 PM   #38
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Exactly.. look at who is funding the Wild Rose... The Wild Rose is hardly a fresh face.. just fresh lipstick on a the same old pig.
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Old 09-04-2012, 01:55 PM   #39
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^you shouldn't be concerned about the "change" then, since you percieve none. I think there will be a change though, to me, the PC's turned their back on Ralph Kleins direction which was more in step with Albertans, and they are now paying the price. I'm looking forward to smaller leaner cabinet, and signifcant public servant bureaucrat cut backs.

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Old 09-04-2012, 04:17 PM   #40
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^you shouldn't be concerned about the "change" then, since you percieve none. I think there will be a change though, to me, the PC's turned their back on Ralph Kleins direction which was more in step with Albertans, and they are now paying the price. I'm looking forward to smaller leaner cabinet, and signifcant public servant bureaucrat cut backs.

Ralph Klein's direction is Danielle Smith's direction which is backwards for us Albertans and especially unfriendly to Edmontonians.

Those Calgary guys hold grudges and they've always been bitter about Edmonton doing better in the 70's and not recieving as much of the pie.

After the first boom, Klein lured businesses to Calgary to kickstart the economy and from there, they developed at a signifigantly higher pace than we did.

They want the powerbase in Calgary and we're only just sort of in their way to Ft Mac.

This doesn't work well, especially since more people in Edmonton need crucial services like government run health care or support services.

Not to mention the high number of seniors already living on fixed pensions who can't compete with the inflation added because of the local economic boom. Or people on AISH and assisted living.

The government needs to be large enough to maintain the services that benefit Albertans yet efficient, not bloated, and cost effective.

Big or small government arguments belong on Fox news and shouldn't be taken seriously.
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Old 09-04-2012, 09:53 PM   #41
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Yes, a WRA government will be immensely damaging for Edmonton. Unfortunately most people vote their ideals, their passions, their self-image - and not for their city or region. Personally I find much in the WRA to like but could never vote for them. A vote for the WRA is a vote to condemn the City of Edmonton, which I love (as I ought) more than my ideals and passions.

A prediction. The WRA will not carry the election and the PCs will have a minority largely of Capital Region + scattered ridings. This will entail a largely Edmonton-oriented cabinet, and a PC party aggressive in shoring up support here. The WRA then will proceed to put their worse foot forward as members of the loyal opposition, and self-destruct over the next four years. This is the track described by Mario Dumont's Action Democratique in Quebec, another populist right-wing startup with no experience of government. The lunatic fringe of the WRA has too much crusading zeal to refrain from walking onto the stage, and in new, modern, cosmopolitan Alberta this will prove too much for us.
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Old 09-04-2012, 11:13 PM   #42
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There's also a chance of seeing some vote-splitting between WR and PCs, resulting in some Liberals, NDP and Alberta Party candidates to win some ridings they haven't won in a while. I think even Calgary will have one or two more ridings that are not PC or WR.
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Old 09-04-2012, 11:28 PM   #43
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if WR doesn't win a seat in Edmonton, this could send WR a message saying " Don't bother trying to screw Edmonton around."
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Old 09-04-2012, 11:33 PM   #44
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There's also a chance of seeing some vote-splitting between WR and PCs, resulting in some Liberals, NDP and Alberta Party candidates to win some ridings they haven't won in a while. I think even Calgary will have one or two more ridings that are not PC or WR.
More likely than some NDP/Liberals vote PC/WR, resulting in a drop in NDP/Liberal vote in my opinion... I know a handful who plan to vote PC to try and avoid the WR.
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Old 10-04-2012, 09:16 AM   #45
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jag, do you think they care ?
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Old 10-04-2012, 10:40 AM   #46
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This woman is a nose-in-the air know-it-all. [/LEFT]
You know her well enough personally to make this kind of judgment, I assume?
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Old 10-04-2012, 12:29 PM   #47
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^ Of course he doesn't...
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Old 10-04-2012, 12:45 PM   #48
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if WR doesn't win a seat in Edmonton, this could send WR a message saying " Don't bother trying to screw Edmonton around."
Or "screw Edmonton, we don't need them and they won't vote for us anyway."
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Old 10-04-2012, 12:59 PM   #49
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This woman is a nose-in-the air know-it-all. [/LEFT]
You know her well enough personally to make this kind of judgment, I assume?
Some men are just intimidated by intelligent women.
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Old 10-04-2012, 01:56 PM   #50
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^you shouldn't be concerned about the "change" then, since you percieve none. I think there will be a change though, to me, the PC's turned their back on Ralph Kleins direction which was more in step with Albertans, and they are now paying the price. I'm looking forward to smaller leaner cabinet, and signifcant public servant bureaucrat cut backs.
I don't work in government but I'd still defend the level of public servants. I don't see the government as being overstaffed in terms of the programs it offers.

Look at Edmonton back in the range of 1992 - 97. It was a deep recession here partly due to all the government cuts. A return to those conditions is one of the reasons I've cringed every time the City has expanded it's own spending during these boom times.
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Old 10-04-2012, 03:17 PM   #51
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This election is between the Red and Blue wings of the same party essentially.
This. The devil you know or the devil you dont.

Whatever, still voting NDP. Ill be dead before I give the cons my vote to stop a more conservative person.
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Old 10-04-2012, 03:41 PM   #52
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^I'm looking forward to smaller leaner cabinet, and signifcant public servant bureaucrat cut backs.
I agree. We need less police, nurses, teachers, and firefighters. Such a waste of taxpayer money.

Let's just not have any government and just run wild! "Wild"rose that is.


/end sarcasm
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Old 10-04-2012, 03:51 PM   #53
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Whatever, still voting NDP. Ill be dead before I give the cons my vote to stop a more conservative person.
Good for you. And I mean that sincerely. Maybe if we all lived in, say, Okotoks, I would have more grudging respect for the need to vote PC as a strategic choice, but this is Edmonton -- too many of our ridings can and should support non-Tory/Wildrose options.
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Old 10-04-2012, 04:31 PM   #54
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It's strange that some comments on this thread call Redford an elitist, a sheltered academic bureaucrat who never held a real-world job.

But look at Danielle Smith's background:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Danielle_Smith
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Calgary_School

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/...rticle2392299/

She graduated from the U of C with an economics degree. While there she was a member of the Calgary School. It's members are a group of neo-cons including Harper, Erza Levant, Ted MortonTom Flanagan.

Smith was a former trustee on the Calgary Board of Education before education minister Lyle Oberg dismissed the entire board because it was dysfunctional. From there Danille was an "advocate for ranchers, farmers, etc. with the Alberta Property Rights Initiative and the Canadian Property Rights Research Institute". She went on to become a journalist for the Calgary Herald and worked for Global TV and on talk radio.

So Smith's job experience is being on a dysfunctional board of education, an advocate for property rights, and a journalist. Plus she worked at the Fraser institute and attended the quasi-political science school that spew neo-cons.

That sounds very elitist to me.
Just wanted to say excellent post.

What an odd thing in the thread to single Redford out for given Smiths similar track record. If anything Redford is just the much more capable individual who has had bigger responsibilities.
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Old 10-04-2012, 04:35 PM   #55
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It's the Conservative talking point strategy du jour.
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Old 10-04-2012, 04:36 PM   #56
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Exactly.. look at who is funding the Wild Rose... The Wild Rose is hardly a fresh face.. just fresh lipstick on a the same old pig.
Something we agree with. The WC actually ARE the Conservative neocons in this election.

Redford is the PC candidate, but oddly enough is the alternative.

WC is farther right than even the PC's

Also more Calgary Centric.
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Old 10-04-2012, 04:42 PM   #57
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Wild Rose is the Reform Party.
The PC's are, not surprisingly, the Progressive Conservatives

We know how this played out for the Federal PC's
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Old 10-04-2012, 04:42 PM   #58
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^I'm looking forward to smaller leaner cabinet, and signifcant public servant bureaucrat cut backs.
I agree. We need less police, nurses, teachers, and firefighters. Such a waste of taxpayer money.
Bingo, but also more importantly, less middle managment earning six figure salaries doing squat.
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Old 11-04-2012, 10:25 AM   #59
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^I'm looking forward to smaller leaner cabinet, and signifcant public servant bureaucrat cut backs.
I agree. We need less police, nurses, teachers, and firefighters. Such a waste of taxpayer money.
Bingo, but also more importantly, less middle managment earning six figure salaries doing squat.
The problem is systemic. People are working hard but the value and efficiency of their tasks is what needs to be rethought. In government the objectives aren't the simple return on capital, customer satisfaction objectives you find in the private sector.
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Old 11-04-2012, 12:43 PM   #60
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Originally Posted by Bill View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by moahunter View Post
^I'm looking forward to smaller leaner cabinet, and signifcant public servant bureaucrat cut backs.
I agree. We need less police, nurses, teachers, and firefighters. Such a waste of taxpayer money.
Bingo, but also more importantly, less middle managment earning six figure salaries doing squat.
The problem is systemic. People are working hard but the value and efficiency of their tasks is what needs to be rethought. In government the objectives aren't the simple return on capital, customer satisfaction objectives you find in the private sector.
What we don't need is 89 MLAs with 50 or so backbenchers sitting around looking for ways to make more money.
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Old 12-04-2012, 01:46 PM   #61
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Originally Posted by moahunter View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by moahunter View Post
^I'm looking forward to smaller leaner cabinet, and signifcant public servant bureaucrat cut backs.
I agree. We need less police, nurses, teachers, and firefighters. Such a waste of taxpayer money.
Bingo, but also more importantly, less middle managment earning six figure salaries doing squat.
The problem is systemic. People are working hard but the value and efficiency of their tasks is what needs to be rethought. In government the objectives aren't the simple return on capital, customer satisfaction objectives you find in the private sector.
What we don't need is 89 MLAs with 50 or so backbenchers sitting around looking for ways to make more money.
I don't follow...?
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Old 17-04-2012, 03:08 PM   #62
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I wonder what would happen if Redford lost her seat, but the PC's won? Would a less "progressive" leader take over, like Morton (who engineered Bill 48 allowing kids to not learn about homosexuality)?
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Old 17-04-2012, 03:16 PM   #63
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^ It's happened before. In the 1989 election, Don Getty lost his seat in Edmonton-Whitemud. He got back into the Legislature later when he won a byelection in Stettler.
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Old 17-04-2012, 04:51 PM   #64
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^My home town!!!

The safestest PC seat at the time. My mom worked on his campaign. We used to get Christmas cards from him and Margret.
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Old 17-04-2012, 08:36 PM   #65
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill View Post
Quote:
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^I'm looking forward to smaller leaner cabinet, and signifcant public servant bureaucrat cut backs.
I agree. We need less police, nurses, teachers, and firefighters. Such a waste of taxpayer money.
Bingo, but also more importantly, less middle managment earning six figure salaries doing squat.
The problem is systemic. People are working hard but the value and efficiency of their tasks is what needs to be rethought. In government the objectives aren't the simple return on capital, customer satisfaction objectives you find in the private sector.
What we don't need is 89 MLAs with 50 or so backbenchers sitting around looking for ways to make more money.
I don't follow...?
People are fixated on how much money MLAs make and getting payed for " work" on no meet commitees. The problem is we have far too many MLAs. We could do with one third less or half as many. As it is only 15-20 can be be in the cabinet so they try and find something for the rest to do. The money wasted on no meet commitees is peanuts compared to the on going waste of over representation.
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Old 17-04-2012, 11:54 PM   #66
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This woman is a nose-in-the air know-it-all. [/LEFT]
You know her well enough personally to make this kind of judgment, I assume?
Some men are just intimidated by intelligent women.
The only reason some men (Conservative MLA's) are intimidated by Redford is because she is now in charge of the herd. A herd that has taking advantage of the public purse for far too long. There are a whole whack of now ex-conservative supporters who finally saw the light when the no meet committee came to light. Finally brought home to a lot of people that the ruling conservatives were not in it for Alberta but only in it for themselves. Now we are all wondering what else have they been getting away with. I have voted conservative a number of times but I am not going too this time. There are plenty of people I know that are thinking the same way. It's time to put those free-loaders in their place.
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Old 18-04-2012, 07:09 AM   #67
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^So dumping a bunch of free loaders for racists, homophobes, old Socreds like Paul Hinman, extreme right-wing christian fundamentalists, and a guy like Link Byfield who believes being bullied builds character, is a good idea?
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Old 18-04-2012, 08:15 AM   #68
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last i checked mla's from ALL parties took the committee pay. and they only returned it, when they were caught. if the opposition mla's are so outraged by the committee pay issue, then why didn't THEY bring it up?

and i find it VERY ironic people think the WR is the savior, considering they are made up of a bunch of extremely disgruntled tories. i'm sorry, but balanced books a little bit sooner is not worth my dignity.
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Old 18-04-2012, 10:30 AM   #69
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^So dumping a bunch of free loaders for racists, homophobes, old Socreds like Paul Hinman, extreme right-wing christian fundamentalists, and a guy like Link Byfield who believes being bullied builds character, is a good idea?
That was my opinion of the cons, I don't read anywhere in my post that it was an endorsement for another party.
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Old 21-04-2012, 05:11 AM   #70
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Danielle Smith scares me. Not for the future of Alberta but the future of Edmonton. All our progress on the CCA and the new RAM is going to get flushed down the toilet if Wildrose wins. Edmonton might as well go back to the stone age.
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Old 30-11-2012, 11:34 AM   #71
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Was listening to Rob Breakenridge last night and it seems that Alison Redford's statement they didn't decide until June is incorrect as memos were send out of the successful and unsuccessful law firms far earlier when in fact Redford was still the minister
http://www.edmontonjournal.com/news/...086/story.html
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Old 30-11-2012, 12:48 PM   #72
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Does the Wildros and NDP have nothing better to do than witchhunt Redofrd? first election funds, then KAtz contribution, then her sister, now this?? If opposition doesn't know that this goes on in politics then they should not be in politics - its how things work.
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Old 30-11-2012, 12:50 PM   #73
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Personally, while I'd prefer they focused on actual issues of consequence to the public and policy, it is somewhat refreshing to have a somewhat competent opposition in the legislature.
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Old 30-11-2012, 01:01 PM   #74
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Ya.. I am kinda sick of Wildrose's 4 year election campaign plan.
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Old 30-11-2012, 01:03 PM   #75
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Does the Wildros and NDP have nothing better to do than witchhunt Redofrd? first election funds, then KAtz contribution, then her sister, now this?? If opposition doesn't know that this goes on in politics then they should not be in politics - its how things work.
Redford did run on a platform of open and transparent government. Now that things are transparent we can see how many gaffes there are in her party. This latest conflict regarding her ex husbands law firm was uncovered by a CBC reporter through FOIP. The opposition parties are working from what he uncovered. Plus, Redford lied to the legislature on when the actual contract was awarded. Her fingerprints are all over the awarding of the contract.
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Old 30-11-2012, 01:03 PM   #76
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This is not politics but "investigative journalism" from a rather poor hack
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Old 30-11-2012, 01:12 PM   #77
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I would rather have 'investigative journalism' any day of the week rather than no accountability.
Maybe if politicians realized what they did today would be uncovered down the road they might think twice about some of the questionable decisions they make.
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Old 30-11-2012, 01:15 PM   #78
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agreed however the bloom is wearing off the rose by digging up stuff (at taxpayers expense) that could go as far back as the klein era.
their best target with all of this is to unseat the government or to force yet another expensive election

We need to move forward with present day governing and future planning
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Old 30-11-2012, 01:18 PM   #79
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Does the Wildros and NDP have nothing better to do than witchhunt Redofrd? first election funds, then KAtz contribution, then her sister, now this?? If opposition doesn't know that this goes on in politics then they should not be in politics - its how things work.
AS much as I don't like this from the Wildrose, and Danielle Smith ironically complaining about the PC's "smear campaign" in the last election, I'm worried.
I was watching question period and started to get sick to my stomach. Sensing, oh no, this time this has real teeth.

I'm a big fan of Redford and still view it as her lying on the awarding of the anti-smoking contract.

I'm shocked in a way. But I think theres a pretty clear smoking gun here and this one's not going away. Pardon the pun.

On one of these few occasions Danielle is right to be firing away as befits hers overzealous nature. Clearly she's right and Redford should have deferred involvement in the matter of signing and being involved in that contract award decision.

It could be that Redfords upbringing in provincial politics has been so corrupt that even she had difficulty maintaining professional accord. In otherwords that she was so desensitized to corruption she engaged in it.

Very unpleasant matter. I expect far better, and honest answers from Redford on this.
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Old 30-11-2012, 01:21 PM   #80
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Well, what gets a lot of peoples goat is that Redford has not been around for a lot of these accusations. She always seems to be out of the province and when she is around any questions directed to her she usually deflects to the minister in charge of whatever department they are talking about. Redford thinks she walks on water. She thinks she is so smart she can out smart us all. Her arrogance will be the undoing of her.
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Old 30-11-2012, 01:23 PM   #81
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don't agree with that statement as far a purposfully dodgeing the period. If she really wanted to she could close the session or move as did ralph
I do think that she is very successfully going out and marketing this Province
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Old 30-11-2012, 01:23 PM   #82
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Okay lets be VERY clear that EX spouses are not listed, from what I can tell, on the conflict of interest hot list.

They were married in their late 20's.
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Old 30-11-2012, 01:24 PM   #83
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Moreover who cares if she did pick the best candidate firm ?
If she's caught in a lie, deal with it and move on
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Old 30-11-2012, 01:26 PM   #84
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don't agree with that statement as far a purposfully dodgeing the period. If she really wanted to she could close the session or move as did ralph
I do think that she is very successfully going out and marketing this Province
Exactly when your the CEO of a company you don't answer all the questions... you let your subject matter experts do that.

Redford needs to answer more though because when she gets mad she is DEAD on and she commands that gallery! We need to see THAT Redford more often.

Arrogance has rarely been the downfall of any polictical leader... infact I would say the lack of it is a bigger detriment. (steady Eddy, mr Dithers, Joe Clark )
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Old 30-11-2012, 01:29 PM   #85
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Moreover who cares if she did pick the best candidate firm ?
If she's caught in a lie, deal with it and move on
Well, lying and then being caught in a lie does not look too good on a politicians resume. I know, a politician lying (is that possible). Surely you are not suggesting it's O.K. to have a bunch of lyers running the province.
Hardly the 'intergrity' we heard about from her platform.
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Old 30-11-2012, 01:31 PM   #86
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little danny girl and her co-ops are not without skeletons, trust me
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Old 30-11-2012, 01:38 PM   #87
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i am so sick of this *&^%...

no-one - including smith and sherman and mason - seems to dispute the process that was followed to short-list down to the "final three" firms as appropriate. no-one seems to dispute the type of contingency contract ultimately negotiated for the type of work being undertaken as appropriate. and no one seems to dispute whether the type of work itself being undertaken is anything but appropriate.

according the journal's reporting of the firms short listed in this "scandal", "...all are major firms that have connections to the Tories and have contributed money to the party over the years. For example, Farouk Adatia, the premier’s chief of staff, has been a partner at Bennett Jones. The other bidding firm, McLennan Ross, and some of its lead partners have donated to the Tories and their candidates."

so the critics who apparently support the work being done under this contract, the method of carrying out that work, and the selection process itself seem to think that what we have here is, according to mason, "the worst incident involving the premier he had seen in his 12 years as an MLA". i'm not so sure that is less of a condemnation of redford as it is a ratification of what he has seen in his entire tenure.

there were three bidders... the entire brouhaha we are being treated to would appear to have been laid out for our viewing pleasure regardless of which of the three firms would have been selected. this isn't effective representation on behalf of constituents resulting from "investigative journalism" as much as it is pure gutter politics.
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Old 30-11-2012, 01:42 PM   #88
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It is the CBC's Charles Rusnell who's been digging up all the Redford skeletons.
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Old 30-11-2012, 01:46 PM   #89
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^^Ah, you forgot to mention Redford lied about at what time the law firm was picked. They have paperwork proving she picked the law firm while she was still Justice minister,
It's nothing new big law firms donating to political parties. It's nothing new politicians lying. It's when they get caught that is the problem. It's the 'integrity' she did not show, you know, the 'integrity' she talked about during her platform. The open, honest, transparent government we were promised.
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Old 30-11-2012, 01:58 PM   #90
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^^Ah, you forgot to mention Redford lied about at what time the law firm was picked. They have paperwork proving she picked the law firm while she was still Justice minister,
It's nothing new big law firms donating to political parties. It's nothing new politicians lying. It's when they get caught that is the problem. It's the 'integrity' she did not show, you know, the 'integrity' she talked about during her platform. The open, honest, transparent government we were promised.
i don't really want to play the "he said/she said/when/what was meant" game Gemini, but my staff review and recommend things all the time and i review and recommend things all the time. sometimes those recommendations are accepted and sometimes they are not. and even if those recommendations are accepted, there is still not an actual commitment until often lengthy subsequent discussions and negotiations - all of which can be "derailed" by either party - are completed and which are then part of or the subject of subsequent recommendations. you're free to interpret what you want how you want it but you won't convince me on anything i've seen that there is substance other than gutter politics here.
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Old 30-11-2012, 02:03 PM   #91
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Totally becoming a mountain out of a molehill, but I can't stand her so even though this is mostly absurd, for my own personal satisfaction I would love it if she had to take a hike.
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Old 30-11-2012, 02:13 PM   #92
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^^Even if we overlook the $10 billion contract awarded to the law firm her ex-husband is a partner in should we overlook her lying about the dates she signed off on the contract. Making light of decisions she had to make while Justice Minsister may be O.K. for some folks but then lying about the timeing of the decision, well I guess some of us expect more from our elected officials.
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Old 30-11-2012, 02:17 PM   #93
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Totally becoming a mountain out of a molehill, but I can't stand her so even though this is mostly absurd, for my own personal satisfaction I would love it if she had to take a hike.
There's never anyone around when someone needs b*tch slapped.
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Old 30-11-2012, 02:23 PM   #94
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^^Even if we overlook the $10 billion contract awarded to the law firm her ex-husband is a partner in should we overlook her lying about the dates she signed off on the contract. Making light of decisions she had to make while Justice Minsister may be O.K. for some folks but then lying about the timeing of the decision, well I guess some of us expect more from our elected officials.
Just to clarify, $10 billion is the settlement amount and not the amount of the contract awarded to the law firm.
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Old 30-11-2012, 02:25 PM   #95
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^Yes, but the fee from that $10 billion will not be chump change. What law company would not like that contract dropped on their desk.
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Old 30-11-2012, 02:29 PM   #96
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^Yes, but the fee from that $10 billion will not be chump change. What law company would not like that contract dropped on their desk.
except it wasn't "dropped on anyone's desk" at all was it? not even smith or mason in all their indignation are even suggesting that.
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Old 30-11-2012, 02:29 PM   #97
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Didn't say it wouldn't be chump change but you are insinuating that the law firm was handed $10 billion from Redford which is not the case.

If they win, the government will get billions of dollars and in the end makes her recommendation a good one.
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Old 30-11-2012, 02:40 PM   #98
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Quote:
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^Yes, but the fee from that $10 billion will not be chump change. What law company would not like that contract dropped on their desk.
except it wasn't "dropped on anyone's desk" at all was it? not even smith or mason in all their indignation are even suggesting that.
Figure of speech. Like I said before, even if we forget who got the contract Redford lied about the dates it was awarded. She also tried to underplay her role in the reccomendation. She said she was no longer justice minister, there is correspondence saying otherwise
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Old 30-11-2012, 02:43 PM   #99
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Didn't say it wouldn't be chump change but you are insinuating that the law firm was handed $10 billion from Redford which is not the case.

If they win, the government will get billions of dollars and in the end makes her recommendation a good one.
Lying don't count but money rules. Sums up this government nicely.
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Old 30-11-2012, 03:01 PM   #100
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Does the Wildros and NDP have nothing better to do than witchhunt Redofrd? first election funds, then KAtz contribution, then her sister, now this?? If opposition doesn't know that this goes on in politics then they should not be in politics - its how things work.
A witchhunt? She could have excused herself from meetings and stated in advance of the conflict, I certainly have done that personally. Some people still love their ex's some hate them, this isn't necessarily a conflict of interest. There are only so many law firms capable of handling this suit, its possible she had friends or relatives on the other two bids too. Openness means disclosing information as early as possible not when people have to dig out documents to prove you wrong.

But saying that you didn't approve a contract in front of a public news conference when in fact there are documents proving otherwise tells me straight up she is a liar and she should resign.

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