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View Full Version : Another bloody weekend in our city



Doug
30-10-2006, 08:36 AM
Another three people are murdered in our city over the weekend. This brings the total up to 32 and we are well on our way to matching or breaking last years record. Years ago Detroit was known as the murder capital in the United States and now we are known as the murder capital in Canada.

This is a blight on our city and something has to be done to stop it. My question is, where do we begin?

Do we need more police on our streets so that we have four on every corner?
Do we start and hold the bars and nightclubs accountable for overservice and shut them down for violations?
Does our justice system start and given meaningful sentences to people that that have committed violent offences?
Do we hold the parents accountable for the actions committted by Young Offeders?

Why has our city lost a handle on what is going on?
Is it just the fact that we have a lot f people coming in from out of town and once the economy slows down so will the murder rate?

The residents of our city need address this problem quickly because this, more than anything, will stop people from moving here. We can have a modern downtown or the countries biggest park system but if people do no feel safe they will not stay.

Your thoughts?

RichardS
30-10-2006, 09:50 AM
Overall, Edmonton is EXTREMELY safe.

There are 2 things that you mention in your post that needs to change, the Youth Criminal Justice Act and MEANINGFUL sentences.

Until harsh penalites are appliedand a lack of parole is enforced unless there is real proof of rehabilitation, nothing will change.

Without a YCJA with teeth (aka all violent crimes are adult crimes), then the swarming by young offenders on the homeless and others will go unpunished. Assault causing bodily harm is so NOT the charge to be laid - it is at LEAST manslaughter. The same goes for the party stabbings and the baseball bat beatings of recent - it is MURDER and the offenders KNEW what they were doing and that it was WRONG. No one can tell me otherwise. 5 year olds know that hitting and killing is bad, you can't tell me that 14 year olds and 16 year olds don't. Youth crimes like shoplifting and grafitti and the like are one thing, violence with weapons is another. Until they FEAR the consequences, nothing will change.

The increase in these violent crimes is partly due to the population explosion. Fast times in a boom town usually lead to a bit more crime. Plus, the more money, the more gang/organized crime that seems to follow. Don't let the numbers fool you, our friends in Calgary are having the same issues, it is just that theirs follow more assaults. It is sad that our assault victims die.

IanO
30-10-2006, 10:17 AM
"
The residents of our city need address this problem quickly because this, more than anything, will stop people from moving here. We can have a modern downtown or the countries biggest park system but if people do no feel safe they will not stay.

Your thoughts? "


downtown van has the same probs, i dont see people moving away....so does toronto, mtl, nyc, cal, et al.

Doug
30-10-2006, 10:35 AM
I do believe that overall we have a very safe city but our homicide rate is by far the highest in the country. Calgary or Vancouver's rate is not even close to ours.

My concern is that our politicians and the justice system are doing very little to correct the tide. As a city we need to look at making the nightclubs more accountble for overservice. Has anyone been to the Y Club on 102 Street south of Jasper Avenue to see how out of control that place is on a weekend night. What has the city done about it? I'll bet nothing.

IanO
30-10-2006, 11:23 AM
I do believe that overall we have a very safe city but our homicide rate is by far the highest in the country. Calgary or Vancouver's rate is not even close to ours.

My concern is that our politicians and the justice system are doing very little to correct the tide. As a city we need to look at making the nightclubs more accountble for overservice. Has anyone been to the Y Club on 102 Street south of Jasper Avenue to see how out of control that place is on a weekend night. What has the city done about it? I'll bet nothing.


Yes we have a high rate and this needs to be attended to, but our demographic is also somewhat responsible for that.

i do agree with what you are saying, just not how you are saying it.

GregK
30-10-2006, 12:04 PM
Does overservice really have anything to do with people shooting other people up? I think gangs, drugs and grudges would have a bit more to do with murders than people getting too loaded.

I think that most of the fights due to people being too drunk involve guys who just wanna get in some fisticuffs. These, typically, arent the same people who are gonna go Columbine on a club

Doug
30-10-2006, 01:30 PM
I do agree that overservice in itself is not the root of the problem but I do think that it is a contributing factor. I feel that all levels of our government need to take a hard look at the violent crime that is occurring in our cities. The federal justice system has not taken a hard stance wih violent offenders and as a result some of young people today have no fear of consequence. Our provincial government has cut back drastically in the last number of years. Do we have adequete staffing at the Liquor Board to ensure that inspections can be done at our night clubs and bars to ensure that overservice is not a problem? I would bet we do not. From a civic standpoint I would like to see us take the initative and pressure the other two levels of government to ensure that we have the funds for adequete policing. This is a problem that we need to deal with as soon as possible.

My fear is that we will become complacent with violent crime and look at it as a fact of life of living in the big city.

IKAN104
31-10-2006, 11:40 AM
I do support tough sentences for violent crime and concurrent sentences for multiple murders. However, I don't think a lack of just punishment is the reason people commit these crimes.

The real problem is the lack of respect these people have for other people. Respect is taught at home. Sadly, too many parents do not know how to teach their children respect.

I don't know what the solution is, I'm just telling you what the problem is.

RichardS
31-10-2006, 12:16 PM
The real problem is the lack of respect these people have for other people. (...)

The other problem is that they don't respect the law and the consequences.

LindseyT
31-10-2006, 12:29 PM
Respect is taught at home. Sadly, too many parents do not know how to teach their children respect.


ding ding ding!!!

IKAN104
31-10-2006, 12:53 PM
My point is that simply toughening the laws is not going to decrease the amount of violent crime. We need to get to the root of the problem. ... but how do you do that? :? You can't force people to take parenting courses... can you?

Oh, and by the way, this problem has existed since the dawn of time, in every corner of the world in every culture. ... so for the good of mankind, let's see if we can't solve this problem once and for all. :roll:

RoyalHighlander
31-10-2006, 01:10 PM
http://www.connect2edmonton.ca/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1028

This link to another topic about Millwoods says it all.. Its a lifestyle issue and one of parents not teaching the kids respect , actually parents not teaching thier kids anything.. I know we can say , "in my day" but its not our day any more.. I know this will sound racist but with an influx of immigrants from parts of the world that puts no value on human life and dignity thats the end result..Even with triple the police we have patrolling there will still be problems...Its all about education and upbringing..Lets not even go to the Hollywwod connection and the violence they show in movies everyday that numbs us to it... :cry:

GregK
31-10-2006, 01:24 PM
I thought it was overserving?

m0nkyman
31-10-2006, 04:11 PM
I thought it was overserving?
It's underserving. Ever notice this stuff always happens at the end of the night when a whole bunch of people are all told that they can't have anymore to drink.

Extend the hours until 5AM, and a lot of this crap will ease off.

Doug
31-10-2006, 08:03 PM
I think we all have to look in the mirror on this issue. Parents, politicians, judges, owners of drinking establishments , police and most importantly, our young people, have a part to play in dealing with the amount of violent crime we currently see.

North Guy66
16-01-2007, 02:58 PM
On Monday night there was a gun incident at the Londonderry Fitness and Leisure Centre. A gun went off in the lobby when someone used to the gun to hit another person. There were many bystanders in the building since it is Minor Hockey Week, luckily no one was injured.

I watched the news reports on CTV and Global and both stations interviewed the same woman. She said she is afraid to live in the city and is considering moving to a small town.


Blahhhh!!!!!! :x

Brentk
16-01-2007, 03:39 PM
This stuff has to stop though. Sure it won't all go away, but there has to be some sort of solution the tame it. Edmonton is a good city, it is not a gang city, but there seems to be the mentality amongst a growing population of young people that the gang mentlity is cool.

RichardS
16-01-2007, 03:52 PM
...they simply have no clue. No consequences and tehy have never ever ever seen something die...so they think carrying guns is "fun".....

Brentk
16-01-2007, 04:11 PM
I was thinking this morning how it is sad how people don't think loss of life is a consequence...people think more in terms of loss of money vs. loss of life...hard to explain over a forum, but I am sure you understand what I mean.

RichardS
16-01-2007, 06:49 PM
i do....

Sonic Death Monkey
17-01-2007, 02:26 PM
I watched the news reports on CTV and Global and both stations interviewed the same woman. She said she is afraid to live in the city and is considering moving to a small town.
Yeah, go to Mayerthorpe or Taber, where violence has NEVER occurred.

RoyalHighlander
26-01-2007, 12:14 PM
I watched the news reports on CTV and Global and both stations interviewed the same woman. She said she is afraid to live in the city and is considering moving to a small town.
Yeah, go to Mayerthorpe or Taber, where violence has NEVER occurred.
I stayed in Mayerthorpe this fall while working with the road crew running eqipment on the highway twinning there, and let me tell you, its a nasty little town... I stopped into the local lil bar one night and once was enough for me... I take the local Legion Branch anytime..Dont say that the small towns are safer the incident at Mayorthorpe asise.. They have thier troubles too and with the spead thin RCMP as your law enforcement you get to wait a lot longerr for help out there...